Anonymous
11/30/2022 09:35
Subject: Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Here is the wisest comment from that thread:
I am the PP who grew up in suburbia and did fine at an Ivy but did not excel, there or in life.
My parents were the first in their families to go to college and they pushed me to do well (I went to public high school) and none of us really thought about what it would take to succeed after I got into a good college. They had no clue. I had no clue. I went to an Ivy that is notorious for not being supportive (esp. in the 80s/90s) and I basically just floated through, getting mored depressed as graduation was coming.
As for the PP who said all you need is hard work and hustle, I push back on this. I waitressed and nannied, and had other jobs through college. I got good grades, I did ECs. I wasn't a slacker with a trust fund just coasting on the Ivy name.
I just didn't understand newtowkring, or parlaying the hand I had into something bigger.
Grad school and law school seemed out of reach for me. I didn't have a passion or a plan and my parents did not have the $ for grad school, so taking on that much debt for something I wasn't sure about seemed irresponsible.
As a mother I tell my kids it is way more important to attend a school where you grow into the best you, have mentors, access to professors, and feel like a part of the school community than it is to have a brand name.
This is where this poster failed. Networking with other high powered families and classmates is what you are paying for in Ivy
Anonymous
11/30/2022 09:26
Subject: Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Many get jobs due to connections, not due to academics or college name. I know many who couldn't get into a local state school and did community college to become eligible for transfer and then got hired by top companies where their dad or uncle worked.
For most that attend Ivy's, they would have had the same connections if they went anywhere---their connections are often from their rich parents/family members. Only the lower income students who attend Ivy's really get any "connection benefit" from attending a top school. The rich kids already have those connections
Anonymous
11/30/2022 08:58
Subject: Re:Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Of course one's major area of study matters. Compare schools by results for similar majors.
You sound like you're measuring success by salary. Not everyone shares that outlook.
Literally everyone shares that outlook except for the 1%.
What a sad way to look at the world. You think the only reason that people become teachers or social workers is because they couldn't get a job in investment banking?
Not necessarily IB, but yes they were not capable for or couldn't get more rewarding career. Nothing sad about it that's how the world works.
Not really. I, and most people that I know took jobs that pay much less that what we could have made because of values other than personal wealth hoarding. I do find it sad that this is all that you can find worth living for.
Anonymous
11/30/2022 08:34
Subject: Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I have been thinking about that thread recently. I have a degree from an Ivy and two graduate degrees from top schools and I make about $130,000 a year as a professor. I am vastly overqualified for my job at a third Tier institution although it works well with my family responsibilities.
My parents were extremely working class and the number one skill that I feel like I did not acquire as a child was the ability to advocate for myself. My parents are very timid and they have never stood up to an employer or asked for anything. The overwhelming sense I had as a child was that life was something that happened to you and I remember being terribly surprised when I figured it out in graduate school, that other people had a vision for where they wanted to end up and that they were working to implement that vision. But to some degree it was already too late for me when I realize that other people had been doing that since they were 16.
A good school can only take you so far if you have no sense of agency or the ability to create their own life, and unfortunately most of us from poor and working class environments do not have that skill
Squandered Ivy here, yes I definitely was extremely deferential to authority. I was terrified of talking to my professors at my Ivy, even though many were very nice, partly because I didn't want them to figure out I didn't belong there (which may or may not have been true!). My GOAL and my parent's goal in life was to go to great college away from my small town -- I had NO inkling of what happened after that, and by the time I figured out what I thought was a decent path, the die was cast for my underwhelming career.
At least as a professor you have a pretty stable career and autonomy; do you get to live in a LCOL college town with good schools, that would be a great benefit!
This is so odd to me. Most of the working class kids at my Ivy were STEM majors who went to med school or into tech. They are killing it now. Why didn’t you do that?
Doubt truly working class kids went into med school btw. The debt required would be a huge roadblock. Borrowing more money than my parents net worth and 10x their annual income??? How does that seem wise…
Working class Asian-American kids do it all the time.
And many other working class immigrants or fits generation kids. Mainly bc they know how to save money. The UMC kids in med school end up with a ton of debt bc their living expenses are so much higher
Anonymous
11/30/2022 08:28
Subject: Re:Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Attending and graduating from an Ivy League school generates opportunities. Whether or not one takes advantage of those opportunities is an individual matter, not a criticism of Ivy League schools.
Attending any college generates opportunities. Every college has alumni networks.
So all colleges are the same with respect to job & career opportunities ?
Major matters much more
https://collegescorecard.ed.gov/school/?166027-Harvard-University&fos_code=2301&fos_credential=3
Harvard English: $43845
https://collegescorecard.ed.gov/school/?232186-George-Mason-University&fos_code=1107&fos_credential=3
GMU CS: $83185
Majors matter and school matters
Harvard CS: $163896
Post college salary is self reporting. So why would anyone care what the data is saying.
Its at least data by DoE and much better that stuff out of random people's arses
But where is the DoE getting there data? I assume the schools.
It is associated with those who have federally backed student loans. It is not all students.
It's associated with students who got federal aid(Pell) and/or received federal student loan.
This applies to most of the 'normal' low income, middle class, UMC families.
It also eliminates rich dad with family business, fancy connection, trust fund kids, celebrities, etc.
Many of those 'prestigious' schools have these type of people, and school reported data has huge skew.
Hence this is close to real data.
Anonymous
11/30/2022 07:25
Subject: Re:Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Of course one's major area of study matters. Compare schools by results for similar majors.
You sound like you're measuring success by salary. Not everyone shares that outlook.
Literally everyone shares that outlook except for the 1%.
What a sad way to look at the world. You think the only reason that people become teachers or social workers is because they couldn't get a job in investment banking?
Not necessarily IB, but yes they were not capable for or couldn't get more rewarding career. Nothing sad about it that's how the world works.
Anonymous
11/30/2022 06:55
Subject: Re:Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Of course one's major area of study matters. Compare schools by results for similar majors.
You sound like you're measuring success by salary. Not everyone shares that outlook.
Literally everyone shares that outlook except for the 1%.
What a sad way to look at the world. You think the only reason that people become teachers or social workers is because they couldn't get a job in investment banking?
Anonymous
11/30/2022 05:47
Subject: Re:Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Of course one's major area of study matters. Compare schools by results for similar majors.
You sound like you're measuring success by salary. Not everyone shares that outlook.
Literally everyone shares that outlook except for the 1%.
Disagree. We look at salary but sometimes people in DC area also look at political success.
Now I understand what people mean when they refer to the Beltway bubble. MANY of us chose our careers based on what we love to do, not salary. I mean sure, if they were paying teachers 25k to teach in MCPS, who would do it? If the US Govt. topped salaries out at 50k, we wouldn't have a nation anymore. But they don't, and despite the fact that most of us who work in those places are smart enough that we could've made more working elsewhere, we continue where we are because we're doing work that we believe makes the world a better place.
Anonymous
11/30/2022 04:18
Subject: Re:Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Attending and graduating from an Ivy League school generates opportunities. Whether or not one takes advantage of those opportunities is an individual matter, not a criticism of Ivy League schools.
Attending any college generates opportunities. Every college has alumni networks.
So all colleges are the same with respect to job & career opportunities ?
Major matters much more
https://collegescorecard.ed.gov/school/?166027-Harvard-University&fos_code=2301&fos_credential=3
Harvard English: $43845
https://collegescorecard.ed.gov/school/?232186-George-Mason-University&fos_code=1107&fos_credential=3
GMU CS: $83185
Meanwhile,
GMU English: $28,000
Harvard CS: $160,000
Rofl
So
Harvard CS >> GMU CS >>> Harvard English > GMU English
Thank you for reconfirming the order is by major and it matters much more
Lmao
Anonymous
11/30/2022 01:57
Subject: Re:Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Of course one's major area of study matters. Compare schools by results for similar majors.
You sound like you're measuring success by salary. Not everyone shares that outlook.
Literally everyone shares that outlook except for the 1%.
Disagree. We look at salary but sometimes people in DC area also look at political success.
Anonymous
11/29/2022 22:49
Subject: Re:Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Of course one's major area of study matters. Compare schools by results for similar majors.
You sound like you're measuring success by salary. Not everyone shares that outlook.
Literally everyone shares that outlook except for the 1%.
Anonymous
11/29/2022 21:09
Subject: Re:Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Of course one's major area of study matters. Compare schools by results for similar majors.
You sound like you're measuring success by salary. Not everyone shares that outlook.
Anonymous
11/29/2022 21:08
Subject: Re:Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I find the study mildly interesting, but quite amusing as both Stacy Dale and Alan Krueger hold degrees from Ivy League schools including Princeton, Harvard, and Cornell.
+1 that grads from very elite institutions with very elite jobs at very elite institutions are pretending it doesn't matter. ROFL for anyone to take that BS seriously.
Fortunately peer-reviewed research doesn't care about your our cynicism and ignorance.
Anonymous
11/29/2022 21:06
Subject: Re:Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Attending and graduating from an Ivy League school generates opportunities. Whether or not one takes advantage of those opportunities is an individual matter, not a criticism of Ivy League schools.
Attending any college generates opportunities. Every college has alumni networks.
So all colleges are the same with respect to job & career opportunities ?
Maybe not all colleges, but any two colleges within a hundred of one another on any ranking can offer the same opportunities to any given student.
Anonymous
11/29/2022 21:03
Subject: Ivies aren't the best
Anonymous wrote:Of course law schools care! And the firms I've been at care about law school first but look at undergrad as well.
No, they don't. They care about intellect and ambition. Those qualities are more commonly found at more selective colleges, but they're happy to take it wherever they find it.