Anonymous
09/13/2022 18:15
Subject: Lindsey Graham to introduce federal abortion ban
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:And here it is. They’re going to lean into the abortion ban ahead of the midterms. The lesson of Trump: always double down.
This is a gimmick. Republicans have realized that the majority of Americans are opposed to total abortion bans and the Republicans want to paint themselves as the rational ones here by banning them after 15 weeks- and they will then make outlandish claims that all democrats want people to get abortions on demand up until the moment of delivery.
Republicans: let's introduce legislation that has broad popular support
Democrats: that's a gimmick!
I am the PP you are responding to and I am not a Democrat. I am a former R but not a Democrat. I would never personally get an elective abortion and am not particularly fond of the idea of people doing so but don't think legislators should be the ones makes these decisions. I don't care how popular the legislation I- not everything should be subject to popularity contests.
Republicans have completely lost me with this nonsense and gaslighting about late term abortions. Anyone who is getting an abortion past 15 weeks is doing so for reasons that are absolutely none of my business and are likely incredibly hard to deal with.
PP here, I've been a Republican since the second half of college. I don't agree with everything the Republican party has done, but it represents my viewpoints the best so I've stuck with the party. There is undeniably a compelling state interest in protecting human life, including those that are unborn. The difficulty has been in establishing the standard for that interest, not that if such an interest exists at all. Whether we like it or not, everything is up for a popularity contest - even the issues where there is no explicit contest, means there is lack of popular desire to change the issue from the current state of lack of regulation.
Regarding late term abortions, this is not gaslighting at all - it's the mainstream position of the Democrats to protect such a right. They even passed it in the House: Women’s Health Protection Act (WHPA). Go read it, as long as the pregnancy is determined as a risk to the mother's health - a standard which is not defined in the act and is therefore wide open - abortion can be performed at any time.
Please define "late term abortion" -- we can't have a discussion about it until you define your terms.
Anonymous
09/13/2022 18:14
Subject: Re:Lindsey Graham to introduce federal abortion ban
Anonymous wrote:
PP here, I've been a Republican since the second half of college. I don't agree with everything the Republican party has done, but it represents my viewpoints the best so I've stuck with the party. There is undeniably a compelling state interest in protecting human life, including those that are unborn. The difficulty has been in establishing the standard for that interest, not that if such an interest exists at all. Whether we like it or not, everything is up for a popularity contest - even the issues where there is no explicit contest, means there is lack of popular desire to change the issue from the current state of lack of regulation.
Regarding late term abortions, this is not gaslighting at all - it's the mainstream position of the Democrats to protect such a right. They even passed it in the House: Women’s Health Protection Act (WHPA). Go read it, as long as the pregnancy is determined as a risk to the mother's health - a standard which is not defined in the act and is therefore wide open - abortion can be performed at any time.
So….you don’t support ending pregnancies that threaten a woman’s health. That’s a basic republic misogynistic perspective so why all the narrative on how you don’t agree with them?
While 15 weeks may seem like the "reasonable" compromise, taking the standard of care decisions away from the doctors by criminalizing abortions after that will result in women being harmed. We are seeing that now in real time in the states where draconian bans have been enacted. That horrific story out of TX, where a woman who was in the process of miscarrying a wanted pregnancy was unable to get a D&C until it was too late, thus resulting in a hysterectomy. The standard of care decision needs to remain with the medical community, not open to second-guessing by the politicians. My understanding is that how most western European nations handle the issue.
Anonymous
09/13/2022 18:10
Subject: Lindsey Graham to introduce federal abortion ban
It's almost like Lindsey is a Democrat in disguise, trying to help keep the Senate and the House blue.
Anonymous
09/13/2022 18:08
Subject: Lindsey Graham to introduce federal abortion ban
Anonymous wrote:It’s brilliant. It is the point at which most people agree. Prolife won’t agree to anything but I am a Republican woman from a long line of republican women (from the north, all college educated) and I want abortion legal but not unfettered. This will force democrats to own that some of them want unlimited abortion. By 15 weeks you know — that is 3 plus months in— so this means that after 15 weeks it’s off limits. But after that, the baby should have the chance. But this is about flushing out the liars and extremists in the pro abortion lobby. 12 is too soon, 20 is too late. 15 is the sweet spot and it’s going to have an impact.
Abortion has never been "unfettered" in the US. Never. Not even for a day.
People seek out abortions after 20 weeks because of fetal anomalies, because of danger to the mother's health. These are tragedies. And Americans are smart enough to know that. There is no pandemic of women 20+ weeks pregnant, or even 15+ weeks pregnant, deciding willy-nilly to end their pregnancy.
The vast majority of abortions happen in the first trimester.
You'd like to force women to go through 40 weeks of carrying a fetus that is going to die upon birth. Or force a woman to carry a doomed fetus until it is about to kill her, rather than letting her terminate at a much safer point for herself and her future fertility. And Americans who care about women aren't any having any of it.
YOU are the extremist here.
Anonymous
09/13/2022 18:06
Subject: Lindsey Graham to introduce federal abortion ban
Anonymous wrote:It’s brilliant. It is the point at which most people agree. Prolife won’t agree to anything but I am a Republican woman from a long line of republican women (from the north, all college educated) and I want abortion legal but not unfettered. This will force democrats to own that some of them want unlimited abortion. By 15 weeks you know — that is 3 plus months in— so this means that after 15 weeks it’s off limits. But after that, the baby should have the chance. But this is about flushing out the liars and extremists in the pro abortion lobby. 12 is too soon, 20 is too late. 15 is the sweet spot and it’s going to have an impact.
Most people do not agree that abortion should be restricted beyond the completely arbitrary line of 15 weeks. Read the polling at the beginning of the thread.
Anonymous
Anonymous
09/13/2022 18:00
Subject: Lindsey Graham to introduce federal abortion ban
After seeing how women with pregnancy complications are being treated in red states, this legislation is a disaster.
“Thanks, Graham” - dem voters
“Thanks, Graham” - dem voters
Anonymous
Anonymous
09/13/2022 17:56
Subject: Lindsey Graham to introduce federal abortion ban
Anonymous wrote:It’s brilliant. It is the point at which most people agree. Prolife won’t agree to anything but I am a Republican woman from a long line of republican women (from the north, all college educated) and I want abortion legal but not unfettered. This will force democrats to own that some of them want unlimited abortion. By 15 weeks you know — that is 3 plus months in— so this means that after 15 weeks it’s off limits. But after that, the baby should have the chance. But this is about flushing out the liars and extremists in the pro abortion lobby. 12 is too soon, 20 is too late. 15 is the sweet spot and it’s going to have an impact.
Imagine being this ignorant and expecting people to take you seriously.
Anonymous
09/13/2022 17:54
Subject: Lindsey Graham to introduce federal abortion ban
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:And here it is. They’re going to lean into the abortion ban ahead of the midterms. The lesson of Trump: always double down.
This is a gimmick. Republicans have realized that the majority of Americans are opposed to total abortion bans and the Republicans want to paint themselves as the rational ones here by banning them after 15 weeks- and they will then make outlandish claims that all democrats want people to get abortions on demand up until the moment of delivery.
Republicans: let's introduce legislation that has broad popular support
Democrats: that's a gimmick!
I am the PP you are responding to and I am not a Democrat. I am a former R but not a Democrat. I would never personally get an elective abortion and am not particularly fond of the idea of people doing so but don't think legislators should be the ones makes these decisions. I don't care how popular the legislation I- not everything should be subject to popularity contests.
Republicans have completely lost me with this nonsense and gaslighting about late term abortions. Anyone who is getting an abortion past 15 weeks is doing so for reasons that are absolutely none of my business and are likely incredibly hard to deal with.
PP here, I've been a Republican since the second half of college. I don't agree with everything the Republican party has done, but it represents my viewpoints the best so I've stuck with the party. There is undeniably a compelling state interest in protecting human life, including those that are unborn. The difficulty has been in establishing the standard for that interest, not that if such an interest exists at all. Whether we like it or not, everything is up for a popularity contest - even the issues where there is no explicit contest, means there is lack of popular desire to change the issue from the current state of lack of regulation.
Regarding late term abortions, this is not gaslighting at all - it's the mainstream position of the Democrats to protect such a right. They even passed it in the House: Women’s Health Protection Act (WHPA). Go read it, as long as the pregnancy is determined as a risk to the mother's health - a standard which is not defined in the act and is therefore wide open - abortion can be performed at any time.
So….you don’t support ending pregnancies that threaten a woman’s health. That’s a basic republic misogynistic perspective so why all the narrative on how you don’t agree with them?
Anonymous
09/13/2022 17:54
Subject: Lindsey Graham to introduce federal abortion ban
Anonymous wrote:It’s brilliant. It is the point at which most people agree. Prolife won’t agree to anything but I am a Republican woman from a long line of republican women (from the north, all college educated) and I want abortion legal but not unfettered. This will force democrats to own that some of them want unlimited abortion. By 15 weeks you know — that is 3 plus months in— so this means that after 15 weeks it’s off limits. But after that, the baby should have the chance. But this is about flushing out the liars and extremists in the pro abortion lobby. 12 is too soon, 20 is too late. 15 is the sweet spot and it’s going to have an impact.
You are literally picking numbers out of thin air. Why is 12 too son but 20 too late? Didn't both fetuses have their lives start at conception?
Why do you want abortion legal but not unfettered? What magical difference is there between 12 and 15 and 20 weeks that should be decided by a politician and not a doctor?
Anonymous
09/13/2022 17:52
Subject: Lindsey Graham to introduce federal abortion ban
Anonymous wrote:It’s brilliant. It is the point at which most people agree. Prolife won’t agree to anything but I am a Republican woman from a long line of republican women (from the north, all college educated) and I want abortion legal but not unfettered. This will force democrats to own that some of them want unlimited abortion. By 15 weeks you know — that is 3 plus months in— so this means that after 15 weeks it’s off limits. But after that, the baby should have the chance. But this is about flushing out the liars and extremists in the pro abortion lobby. 12 is too soon, 20 is too late. 15 is the sweet spot and it’s going to have an impact.
You obviously don’t have very many female friends. You might think you do, but if you did you’d know a few who have had to terminate wanted pregnancies after 15 weeks. As it is, they probably disappeared from your life because you’re an idiot.
Anonymous
09/13/2022 17:48
Subject: Lindsey Graham to introduce federal abortion ban
It’s brilliant. It is the point at which most people agree. Prolife won’t agree to anything but I am a Republican woman from a long line of republican women (from the north, all college educated) and I want abortion legal but not unfettered. This will force democrats to own that some of them want unlimited abortion. By 15 weeks you know — that is 3 plus months in— so this means that after 15 weeks it’s off limits. But after that, the baby should have the chance. But this is about flushing out the liars and extremists in the pro abortion lobby. 12 is too soon, 20 is too late. 15 is the sweet spot and it’s going to have an impact.
Anonymous
09/13/2022 17:34
Subject: Lindsey Graham to introduce federal abortion ban
I think this will help Dems. More women will get out and vote.