Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 19:34     Subject: Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Maybe instead of getting upset that inmates are learning so they can become productive members of society, you should be getting upset that college costs so much for everybody else.


I'm not OP but I am annoyed by this. Not really annoyed by it but everything is for the prisoner, not the victim or the families of the people they hurt and more and more money keeps going to them to "get them back on track". Nothing is ever done for them. Justice for them is just prison even though it does nothing for them. No mental health help for them. No help with money. Nothing. My husband committed a crime and had to serve time and now says his kids don't deserve money for college. But now he gets to go to college? He wasn't offered this but I could see some single mom of these people wondering where her check is for her kids to attend college.


MOst people in jail are there for non violent crimes.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 19:29     Subject: Re:Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
I think it is very equitable.

In a way, this offer is open to all. You just have to get to prison first.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 19:15     Subject: Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Calvin University is a private college in western Michigan. Tuition and fees are $38,370, so even if the prisoners get full $6,895 year pell grant, that's a lot of free scholarships or however it's provided.

In other words, convicted criminals get free college and rich kids get free college from their parents, of course, while low and middle class kid are soaked with an average of $30,000 in student loans for a state university degree (it's about $35,000 for a private bachelor's). This seems extremely unfair, yet the media champions it.



Detroit Free Press: Caps, gowns and barbed wire: First-ever college graduation in prison was joyous celebration
https://www.freep.com/story/news/education/2022/05/09/prison-graduation-handlon-correctional-facility/9708357002/


It's a privately funded program apart from the Pell Grants (which cover 60% of the costs). Pell Grants are equally available to qualified people outside prison, and private individuals are free to donate to a charity that they like. Calvin also is pretty generous with aid, from what I understand.

I graduated with about that amount of debt, and no, I don't think it's "unfair." They're a religious college, and to me, as a Christian this is following the Gospel. Visiting the prisoner is a direct instruction of Christ after all, and visiting the prisoner and bringing him education that will hopefully help him to stay free when released? That's a good work. Not unfair.


+1
It's private money, and if a person or religious organization wants to spend their money to help prisoners, there's nothing fair or unfair about it. And certainly, most prisoners are not getting free college educations.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 19:08     Subject: Re:Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
I’m fine with this program existing, but vast majority of the jobs that will require a college degree are also going to weed out candidates who say yes to “have you ever been convicted of a felony?” If this is really about post-release employability (a good thing for society) and not about “keeping them busy while they’re locked up,” not sure it’s achieving that goal by any measurable standard. There are places that hire felons, but they don’t require college degrees, like construction and restaurant kitchens.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 19:01     Subject: Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:According to gov scorecard, the average LAB-ABIDING middle class kid leaves Calvin University with $23,000 in student loans.

While CONVICTED CRIMINALS get a free bachelor's degree.

https://collegescorecard.ed.gov/school/?169080-Calvin-University


Pell Grants covers 60% of the program, so we know that the total cost per pupil for this program is around $11,500 or about 1/3 of the cost of tuition at Calvin. Calvin also provides financial aid for students of, on average, $23,000. Students are Calvin are getting a much more expensive (and valuable) program, with, on average, more being paid for them by other people (grants, aid, etc.) than the entire cost of the program for prisoners.


In other words, convicted felons are given 66% off tuition while poor and middle class families are told to pay 100% with tens of thousands of dollars in student loans. Low and middle class young adults are put in debt to subsidize this virtue-signaling.


Poor kids qualify for pell grants. My riend who is lower middle class has 2 kids going to school for practically free between Pell and merit.

Not everyone can qualify for merit aid. I am stupid and when I went to college I was working full time, paying rent and getting Pell grants. My grades were like a low B in every class except two which were D's. i was doing the absolute best I could.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 18:50     Subject: Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Really OP? eyeroll.

Wouldn't you rather these convicts learn something useful while they are serving time - and perhaps give them a chance to be productive, self supporting individuals when they leave?

And for those that don't leave....how exactly is their degree behind bars of any consequence to your low/middle class kid.

Finally, I bet you you looked hard enough, you could find a school willing to help your child go to college. If your kid is a good student, find a school that has stats far below their own and get merit aid.


Prison is for punishment


Nope.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 18:30     Subject: Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
Anonymous wrote:Really OP? eyeroll.

Wouldn't you rather these convicts learn something useful while they are serving time - and perhaps give them a chance to be productive, self supporting individuals when they leave?

And for those that don't leave....how exactly is their degree behind bars of any consequence to your low/middle class kid.

Finally, I bet you you looked hard enough, you could find a school willing to help your child go to college. If your kid is a good student, find a school that has stats far below their own and get merit aid.


Agree. Never understood why people fight against the best antidote for poverty and crime. Good for this college, good for the prisoners, good for everyone.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 18:06     Subject: Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
This is why president Biden needs to forgive all UNDERGRADUATE federal student loans.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 18:02     Subject: Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
It is to everyone's benefit that prison is not just punishment but restorative. I think most cases it's not, and the cycle of despair and violence continues. However, the more people who are able to find redemption, passion, productivity, and success after prison, the better for all of us.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 18:00     Subject: Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Learn more about the college ~ Calvin College
I bet Op isn't educated enough to understand it's origin


Calvin as in Calvinists, as in literally worship money and believe those who have the most money are closer to and/or chosen by God? And those that don't deserve their lot in life, as God intended?


That is a bizarre theological interpretation. Calvinist as is ministering to those who need it. Who says they put prisoners before the poor. the Bible identifies many who need help. Calvin is following Biblical principles here, and I am sure they are helping the poor, orphans/widows, etc.

I know lots of wonderful Calvin grads. They are not like Betsy DeVos (though there are some of those too).
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 17:56     Subject: Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:According to gov scorecard, the average LAB-ABIDING middle class kid leaves Calvin University with $23,000 in student loans.

While CONVICTED CRIMINALS get a free bachelor's degree.

https://collegescorecard.ed.gov/school/?169080-Calvin-University


Pell Grants covers 60% of the program, so we know that the total cost per pupil for this program is around $11,500 or about 1/3 of the cost of tuition at Calvin. Calvin also provides financial aid for students of, on average, $23,000. Students are Calvin are getting a much more expensive (and valuable) program, with, on average, more being paid for them by other people (grants, aid, etc.) than the entire cost of the program for prisoners.


In other words, convicted felons are given 66% off tuition while poor and middle class families are told to pay 100% with tens of thousands of dollars in student loans. Low and middle class young adults are put in debt to subsidize this virtue-signaling.


Poor kids qualify for pell grants. My riend who is lower middle class has 2 kids going to school for practically free between Pell and merit.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 17:52     Subject: Re:Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
I’d rather they become educated.

Life isn’t fair. Write people get away with things black people go to jail for so…
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 17:49     Subject: Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
Anonymous wrote:Donut hole families are screwed six days from Sunday. Poor get mean-based aid, rich have the cash, convicted felons get free scholarships... and donut hole families get crushing debt.

Obviously you aren’t happy with your Donut hole situation. So, which of the other three categories you listed you would want to apply to you? You have to take responsibility for two categories and your child needs to get to belong to the third.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 17:49     Subject: Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
Anonymous wrote:Learn more about the college ~ Calvin College
I bet Op isn't educated enough to understand it's origin


Calvin as in Calvinists, as in literally worship money and believe those who have the most money are closer to and/or chosen by God? And those that don't deserve their lot in life, as God intended?
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2022 17:48     Subject: Isn't this unfair? Prisoners getting free bachelor's degrees from a private college
Anonymous wrote:Donut hole families are screwed six days from Sunday. Poor get mean-based aid, rich have the cash, convicted felons get free scholarships... and donut hole families get crushing debt.


OK, apply to Calvin and see what they give you. It's likely affordable. But, I'm going to guess you don't want your kid to go there.