Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 13:52     Subject: VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I am not a VYS parent.


Neither am I but it kinda sounds like VYS is hiding their kids in the name of protecting them.


So what are Arlington, Alexandria, Lee Mount Vernon and Gunston afraid of? Same thing?


I don't know their reasons because they don't feel compelled to have a discussion thread dedicated to their trials and tribulations either.


Feeling left out after losing the "don't mention specific clubs" exchange in the Travel Soccer thread? I'm so sorry.

But in this case, if we're going to ask why VYS isn't fully participating (they are still MOSTLY participating in the Herndon tournament this year), we have to ask about these other clubs, too.
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 13:23     Subject: Re:VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:You are still hiding behind the fear of failure and exposure.

No they are not. It's about recognizing that what the kids have done that prior season - different size field, # of players and/or use of goalies - differs from what is offered at the tournament so it would put the kids in a bad situation.

Anonymous wrote:1. Being selected as an "All Star" serves as a sense of pride for a player in a activity level where everyone really does get a participation trophy. And I am for rewarding players with an acknowledgement that they have played well and worked hard. Perhaps these are kids and parents who never felt their kid good enough for travel.


I have no idea how VYS or Arlington or other clubs do their internal tournaments, but they could certainly set it up in a way that recognizes certain players as All-Stars. Playing in the Herndon tournament and being designated an All-Star are not the same thing.

Anonymous wrote:2. Travel teams get crushed in tournaments all the time and they keep going back.


And how does that help the players? How does that justify the cost? If the kids are being recognized by the club and have the opportunity to play some more games against teams that will likely be better matched (since they're put together by a club that knows all of the players involved), isn't that a better overall experience for everyone? And so what that they've played against some of those players before, as they'll also be playing against some players from their own team in a competitive match, and bragging rights are pretty strong motivation to play hard.

Anonymous wrote:3. You really have no idea how the kids will fair. You are simply afraid of the worst possible outcome. I have had a child play in that tournament and the games are competitive, meaning they are pretty balanced.
Nor do you have any idea how the kids will fare. Just because one time your kid's team had balanced games, you think every game will be? And what about the numerous explanations given about how VYS is not doing birth year so their rec soccer teams are set up differently from the other teams in the tourney. You keep ignoring the circumstances at play here.

Anonymous wrote:4. I've got news for you, VYS as a travel program is not lights out amazing and yet you still have teams, and kids still play in leagues and go to tournaments. Some teams are good and some are bad and yet losing is always a possibility and yet they play. Why should rec be any different? You are simply denying an opportunity for club pride and that is sad.

VYS kids are given that opportunity at the older age groups when the tourney set-up matches up with what they're during in house league. From what's been said on here, the younger age groups are being given other opportunities. Do you really believe it's critical for U8 and U9 rec players to play in an All-Star tournament in order to create "an opportunity for club pride," whatever that means. And the fact that VYS' travel teams are not good, with the exception or 1 or 2 teams at the most, is not relevant to this discussion because, to repeat what has been said ad nauseam but which you refuse to acknowledge, there is no disconnect between what the VYS travel teams are doing and what the other travel teams in those tournaments are doing - they are playing to the same USSF standards/rules, whereas the VYS house teams are not.


Anonymous wrote:
4. I've got news for you, VYS as a travel program is not lights out amazing and yet you still have teams, and kids still play in leagues and go to tournaments. Some teams are good and some are bad and yet losing is always a possibility and yet they play. Why should rec be any different? You are simply denying an opportunity for club pride and that is sad.

VYS kids are given that opportunity at the older age groups when the tourney set-up matches up with what they're during in house league. From what's been said on here, the younger age groups are being given other opportunities. Do you really believe it's critical for U8 and U9 rec players to play in an All-Star tournament in order to create "an opportunity for club pride," whatever that means. And the fact that VYS' travel teams are not good, with the exception or 1 or 2 teams at the most, is not relevant to this discussion because, to repeat what has been said ad nauseam but which you refuse to acknowledge, there is no disconnect between what the VYS travel teams are doing and what the other travel teams in those tournaments are doing - they are playing to the same USSF standards/rules, whereas the VYS house teams are not.


Umm, I meant that "club pride" is the reason for NOT participating in the tournament. That your reasons posted are just excuses for the club to save face.

Certainly nobody cares who wins a rec tournament and wouldn't bring any more pride to the club. It is simply a different competitive environment for the kids to play in. VYS seems to weigh the results of it far more than is necessary.

So no, kids don't have to play in it. It isn't necessary for their development, it is only an opportunity for some kids to have fun. But better to worry about field dimensions and goalie I suppose.

To participate or not participate does not in and of itself make a club look stupid, but the reasons stated here certainly do.
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 12:59     Subject: VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I am not a VYS parent.


Neither am I but it kinda sounds like VYS is hiding their kids in the name of protecting them.


So what are Arlington, Alexandria, Lee Mount Vernon and Gunston afraid of? Same thing?


I don't know their reasons because they don't feel compelled to have a discussion thread dedicated to their trials and tribulations either.
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 12:58     Subject: Re:VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Anonymous wrote:Do you really believe it's critical for U8 and U9 rec players to play in an All-Star tournament in order to create "an opportunity for club pride," whatever that means.


Exactly.

U8 and U9 players have no idea which tournament they're playing in. They just like the shirts and allure of playing someplace and someone a little different.

The "club pride" in this case just comes from parents who find deep meaning in All-Star rec soccer results. Which is ... very sad ...
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 12:58     Subject: VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Amen
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 12:56     Subject: VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I am not a VYS parent.


Neither am I but it kinda sounds like VYS is hiding their kids in the name of protecting them.


So what are Arlington, Alexandria, Lee Mount Vernon and Gunston afraid of? Same thing?
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 12:38     Subject: Re:VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Anonymous wrote:You are still hiding behind the fear of failure and exposure.

No they are not. It's about recognizing that what the kids have done that prior season - different size field, # of players and/or use of goalies - differs from what is offered at the tournament so it would put the kids in a bad situation.

Anonymous wrote:1. Being selected as an "All Star" serves as a sense of pride for a player in a activity level where everyone really does get a participation trophy. And I am for rewarding players with an acknowledgement that they have played well and worked hard. Perhaps these are kids and parents who never felt their kid good enough for travel.


I have no idea how VYS or Arlington or other clubs do their internal tournaments, but they could certainly set it up in a way that recognizes certain players as All-Stars. Playing in the Herndon tournament and being designated an All-Star are not the same thing.

Anonymous wrote:2. Travel teams get crushed in tournaments all the time and they keep going back.


And how does that help the players? How does that justify the cost? If the kids are being recognized by the club and have the opportunity to play some more games against teams that will likely be better matched (since they're put together by a club that knows all of the players involved), isn't that a better overall experience for everyone? And so what that they've played against some of those players before, as they'll also be playing against some players from their own team in a competitive match, and bragging rights are pretty strong motivation to play hard.

Anonymous wrote:3. You really have no idea how the kids will fair. You are simply afraid of the worst possible outcome. I have had a child play in that tournament and the games are competitive, meaning they are pretty balanced.
Nor do you have any idea how the kids will fare. Just because one time your kid's team had balanced games, you think every game will be? And what about the numerous explanations given about how VYS is not doing birth year so their rec soccer teams are set up differently from the other teams in the tourney. You keep ignoring the circumstances at play here.

Anonymous wrote:4. I've got news for you, VYS as a travel program is not lights out amazing and yet you still have teams, and kids still play in leagues and go to tournaments. Some teams are good and some are bad and yet losing is always a possibility and yet they play. Why should rec be any different? You are simply denying an opportunity for club pride and that is sad.

VYS kids are given that opportunity at the older age groups when the tourney set-up matches up with what they're during in house league. From what's been said on here, the younger age groups are being given other opportunities. Do you really believe it's critical for U8 and U9 rec players to play in an All-Star tournament in order to create "an opportunity for club pride," whatever that means. And the fact that VYS' travel teams are not good, with the exception or 1 or 2 teams at the most, is not relevant to this discussion because, to repeat what has been said ad nauseam but which you refuse to acknowledge, there is no disconnect between what the VYS travel teams are doing and what the other travel teams in those tournaments are doing - they are playing to the same USSF standards/rules, whereas the VYS house teams are not.
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 12:33     Subject: VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Anonymous wrote:Why don't you guys ask your directors for their opinion?


Because my kid doesn't play there and ultimately I don't care. I just happen to think that it is a missed opportunity. I think all clubs with rec programs should take advantage of tournaments like this.
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 12:26     Subject: VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Why don't you guys ask your directors for their opinion?
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 12:11     Subject: VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Anonymous wrote:I am not a VYS parent.


Neither am I but it kinda sounds like VYS is hiding their kids in the name of protecting them.
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 12:10     Subject: VYS Soccer - better or worse?
I am not a VYS parent.
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 10:35     Subject: Re:VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Arlington has an internal rec tournament called ART (Arlington Rec Tournament) same weekend as Herndon Tournament. Not sure what Alexandria does. VSA is basically a dog an pony show anyway...I wouldn't follow any models coming out of there.


Internal tournaments are simply festivals. So your kids team plays against teams that they likely have already played against. There are not many tournament opportunities for rec players and for parents to deny kids the opportunity because they "would get slaughtered" is a pathetic attempt at saving face and is selfish. The kids don't care, tournaments for them, win or lose are fun.



You have some strong arguments to make here, but, please trust me when I say that the Herndon and FPYC all-star tournaments are not what they once were in terms of providing a House-level challenge, and, I might add, it's not their fault. But clubs do need to take the next step and figure out how to create the right kind of demanding and fun post-season tournament experience for their rec all-star players. If we're with a club that's looking at other options, including internal soccerfests, we should take a minute to thank the administrators and commissioners for going the extra mile, taking on more work for themselves, and doing what's best for the players. The kind of rec all-star tournament that offered authentic competition and a spirit of sportsmanship died about five years ago; it's time to find a better way.


You are still hiding behind the fear of failure and exposure.

1. Being selected as an "All Star" serves as a sense of pride for a player in a activity level where everyone really does get a participation trophy. And I am for rewarding players with an acknowledgement that they have played well and worked hard. Perhaps these are kids and parents who never felt their kid good enough for travel.

2. Travel teams get crushed in tournaments all the time and they keep going back.

3. You really have no idea how the kids will fair. You are simply afraid of the worst possible outcome. I have had a child play in that tournament and the games are competitive, meaning they are pretty balanced.

4. I've got news for you, VYS as a travel program is not lights out amazing and yet you still have teams, and kids still play in leagues and go to tournaments. Some teams are good and some are bad and yet losing is always a possibility and yet they play. Why should rec be any different? You are simply denying an opportunity for club pride and that is sad.
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 10:25     Subject: Re:VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Arlington has an internal rec tournament called ART (Arlington Rec Tournament) same weekend as Herndon Tournament. Not sure what Alexandria does. VSA is basically a dog an pony show anyway...I wouldn't follow any models coming out of there.


Internal tournaments are simply festivals. So your kids team plays against teams that they likely have already played against. There are not many tournament opportunities for rec players and for parents to deny kids the opportunity because they "would get slaughtered" is a pathetic attempt at saving face and is selfish. The kids don't care, tournaments for them, win or lose are fun.



You have some strong arguments to make here, but, please trust me when I say that the Herndon and FPYC all-star tournaments are not what they once were in terms of providing a House-level challenge, and, I might add, it's not their fault. But clubs do need to take the next step and figure out how to create the right kind of demanding and fun post-season tournament experience for their rec all-star players. If we're with a club that's looking at other options, including internal soccerfests, we should take a minute to thank the administrators and commissioners for going the extra mile, taking on more work for themselves, and doing what's best for the players. The kind of rec all-star tournament that offered authentic competition and a spirit of sportsmanship died about five years ago; it's time to find a better way.
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 09:54     Subject: Re:VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Anonymous wrote:Arlington has an internal rec tournament called ART (Arlington Rec Tournament) same weekend as Herndon Tournament. Not sure what Alexandria does. VSA is basically a dog an pony show anyway...I wouldn't follow any models coming out of there.


Why do you consider VSA a dog and pony show? Not too familiar with them but based on the things they are posting on social media they are trying to develop a culture within their club. Also receiving DA status together with another club is not a bad thing. Just curious as to why as you may know more.
Anonymous
Post 10/26/2016 09:52     Subject: Re:VYS Soccer - better or worse?
Anonymous wrote:Arlington has an internal rec tournament called ART (Arlington Rec Tournament) same weekend as Herndon Tournament. Not sure what Alexandria does. VSA is basically a dog an pony show anyway...I wouldn't follow any models coming out of there.


Internal tournaments are simply festivals. So your kids team plays against teams that they likely have already played against. There are not many tournament opportunities for rec players and for parents to deny kids the opportunity because they "would get slaughtered" is a pathetic attempt at saving face and is selfish. The kids don't care, tournaments for them, win or lose are fun.