Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 14:37     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

Until the Latin, KIPP, DC Prep, Two Rivers, and DCI feeders don't have WLs a mile long, we'll continue to need charter middle schools.


I wouldn't suggest shutting them down - they provide special offerings, are available to children from areas not IB to the new and improved middle schools, and probably help to keep DCPS on their toes. But NEW charter middle schools may not be needed - use up the capacity in the DCPS middle schools (including the four new ones) first.



You're not on the charter board. One of the new ones approved to open next year is Washington Global MS. + a new campus at Two Rivers.


And that may well be a mistake given DC's planned investments in middle schools. It will be up to the next mayor to address the issue of coordinating charter and DCPS plans.




So far, DCPS's next big promise is the renovation of Roosevelt to include an International Focus and not an IB program, but... a Culinary Focus. Perhaps that's what passes for synergy at 1200 1st?

Meanwhile, Washington Global will offer Spanish and Chinese plus the International Middle Years curriculum. That should appeal to the CM families!
Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 14:32     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Some one should run against Mary Cheh and fix this mess. I live in a $2m+ IB house and am PISSED my IB school is not truly available to my kids. The idea that all of us in fancy IB houses will just go private is stupid.....we didn't get $$$ by wasting our money on private school. For families with multiple kids, even well heeled families, private school is often a foolish financial decision.
Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 14:15     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

Until the Latin, KIPP, DC Prep, Two Rivers, and DCI feeders don't have WLs a mile long, we'll continue to need charter middle schools.


I wouldn't suggest shutting them down - they provide special offerings, are available to children from areas not IB to the new and improved middle schools, and probably help to keep DCPS on their toes. But NEW charter middle schools may not be needed - use up the capacity in the DCPS middle schools (including the four new ones) first.



You're not on the charter board. One of the new ones approved to open next year is Washington Global MS. + a new campus at Two Rivers.


And that may well be a mistake given DC's planned investments in middle schools. It will be up to the next mayor to address the issue of coordinating charter and DCPS plans.
Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 14:12     Subject: Re:So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:So - we got an IB charter school parent complaining hardy is not good enough for the IB families, vs someone arguing it should not be for IB families.

In a thread asking HOW MANY IB are actually going - and the data we have so far - the best till count day - indicates a big increase in IB families (by either definition) - Hardy is well on its way to overcoming the prisoners' dilemma.

Do arguments always lag data? Is it that people get stuck in modes of arguing?

Who will be more unhappy when Hardy has flipped - the folks defending the idea that Hardy is "meant" to be a mostly OOB school, or the charter families defending their decision?
I don't see where most (or maybe any) posters are arguing that Hardy is meant to be mostly OOB. I see posters arguing that IB kids can still get a decent education there even if there are a lot of OOB kids.

But now that I think about it, I guess it's fortunate that the IB families wouldn't touch Hardy back in the day so my kid was able to feed from her OOB elementary to Hardy. Thanks y'all for leaving room for my OOB kid!


Good point PP. There seems to be a loud and vocal cadre of IB families insisting that there are forces actively trying to keep them from going to Hardy. But there is no such thing. If anything, DCPS is going out of its way to try to address the concerns of IB families.

Maybe four years ago the OOB Hardy families were arguing in favor of the then-status quo. But now? They are not. They are just happy to go to Hardy and - like IB families - want it to be strong.

But still, the perception persists that the poor beleagured IB families aren't welcome in their own school.

This tells me that DCPS has a curriculum problem and a PR problem. The curriculum problem is actually easy to solve (and largely has been, for those who bother to pay attention); the PR problem is much more difficult.

Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 13:59     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

Until the Latin, KIPP, DC Prep, Two Rivers, and DCI feeders don't have WLs a mile long, we'll continue to need charter middle schools.


I wouldn't suggest shutting them down - they provide special offerings, are available to children from areas not IB to the new and improved middle schools, and probably help to keep DCPS on their toes. But NEW charter middle schools may not be needed - use up the capacity in the DCPS middle schools (including the four new ones) first.



You're not on the charter board. One of the new ones approved to open next year is Washington Global MS. + a new campus at Two Rivers.

"The D.C. Public Charter School Board has approved three new charter schools: a residential school meant for children in foster care, a K-8 school targeted at students with special needs, and a middle school that emphasizes international education and foreign language.

All are slated to open in 2015, the same year two existing schools — Two Rivers and Thurgood Marshall Academy — hope to add new campuses, a request the charter board is likely to approve next month.

The changes would add hundreds of charter-school seats across the city, "

Charter info here:

http://issuu.com/pcsb/docs/washington_global_redacted

WaPo article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/dc-approves-three-new-charter-schools/2014/05/20/7bc3374e-e02f-11e3-9743-bb9b59cde7b9_story.html
Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 13:28     Subject: Re:So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:So - we got an IB charter school parent complaining hardy is not good enough for the IB families, vs someone arguing it should not be for IB families.

In a thread asking HOW MANY IB are actually going - and the data we have so far - the best till count day - indicates a big increase in IB families (by either definition) - Hardy is well on its way to overcoming the prisoners' dilemma.

Do arguments always lag data? Is it that people get stuck in modes of arguing?

Who will be more unhappy when Hardy has flipped - the folks defending the idea that Hardy is "meant" to be a mostly OOB school, or the charter families defending their decision?


IB charter parent here. I will be very happy if/when Hardy flips. Our younger DC could attend the new and improved Hardy if the change is fast enough.

Even if Hardy doesn't flip in time for younger DC, a new and improved Hardy would probably increase the value of our house.




Unlikely. Parts of the catchment are too wealthy to ever consider Hardy. They either don't have children or their children attend private school. Whatever is left would be better served at Latin/Basis/DCI.

The demographics are staring you in the face and laughing. The real estate around Hardy is simply too expensive for the kind of young families that chose public middle schools.


You don't understand the dynamics you're trying to describe. First off, you're wrong. There are plenty of homes in Spring Valley and Wesley Heights that send their kids to public school. Sure, there are many more that do this for elementary school, but plenty still do for later grades as well. (I know. I live there.) Don't take it from me: you can look at the maps yourself (http://edu.codefordc.org/#!/neighborhood/13). (Moreover, any discussion of the attrition between ES grades and MS ignore the Hardy effect. It really is a chicken-and-egg problem.)

Second, the effect on home prices happens at the margin. Private school for two kids is over $40k per year. That's about the cost of a $1m mortgage. So, as long as one new entrant is willing to spend their private school tuition on a home, instead, then the home can support a considerably inflated price. It doesn't matter if the bulk of resident avail themselves of private school.


Good real estate analysis. This describes what has happened in several deal feeder areas.
Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 13:27     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Mann sent 6 kids to Hardy this year-all but one was IB to Mann. Not everyone in the Mann district wants to send their kids to private, and not everyone is IMF (thus has tuition remission) or makes several hundred k a year to afford sending their kids to private.



6 of how many? 6 of 8 would be impressive. 6 of 50 not so much.


False. 5 families from Mann sent their kids to Hardy. Last year's class was made of 24 kids, so about 20% of last year's Mann class went to Hardy. 4 are IB. All are extremely pleased with the choice.
Please ask Mann's Principal Ms Whisnant for confirmation if you do not trust this post.


This is why this thread has gone on for 51 pages -- every few pages, a fresh grain of data appears, and the hopes of IB families are further stoked. The more Mann families are happy at Hardy, the more will follow, and this is what we IB families want to hear.
Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 13:23     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

Until the Latin, KIPP, DC Prep, Two Rivers, and DCI feeders don't have WLs a mile long, we'll continue to need charter middle schools.


I wouldn't suggest shutting them down - they provide special offerings, are available to children from areas not IB to the new and improved middle schools, and probably help to keep DCPS on their toes. But NEW charter middle schools may not be needed - use up the capacity in the DCPS middle schools (including the four new ones) first.


Charters aren't going anywhere. More than half of the DC student population presently attends a charter. The only city with a higher percentage of students in charters is New Orleans, where the last public school closed this spring.
Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 13:19     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:

Until the Latin, KIPP, DC Prep, Two Rivers, and DCI feeders don't have WLs a mile long, we'll continue to need charter middle schools.


I wouldn't suggest shutting them down - they provide special offerings, are available to children from areas not IB to the new and improved middle schools, and probably help to keep DCPS on their toes. But NEW charter middle schools may not be needed - use up the capacity in the DCPS middle schools (including the four new ones) first.
Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 13:13     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
There were 6 originally committed to Hardy, but one family IB for both Deal and Hardy changed their mind. There were also Mann alums who graduated last year who are now attending GDS and Lab as well.
Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 13:07     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Mann sent 6 kids to Hardy this year-all but one was IB to Mann. Not everyone in the Mann district wants to send their kids to private, and not everyone is IMF (thus has tuition remission) or makes several hundred k a year to afford sending their kids to private.



6 of how many? 6 of 8 would be impressive. 6 of 50 not so much.


False. 5 families from Mann sent their kids to Hardy. Last year's class was made of 24 kids, so about 20% of last year's Mann class went to Hardy. 4 are IB. All are extremely pleased with the choice.
Please ask Mann's Principal Ms Whisnant for confirmation if you do not trust this post.

Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 13:04     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
6 of 24. 4 went to Deal IB, 6 to Hardy, a bunch went to private (WES, NCS, Holy Trinity and others) about 6 went to charters (among others were Basis and DCI) and a bunch moved. It's the first time in YEARS Mann has sent kids to Hardy,
Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 13:01     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

There is no city-wide arts program or pseudo-magnet at Hardy. That died a few years ago when Pope was ousted. Remember? To appease the IB parents? Who are not flocking to the school as promised? Yes, those families - who demanded things, got them, and then still didn't show up.Why in the hell would anyone open up a new school for them? Do know which ward has the most children in public school? (Hint: it's east of the river.)

Meanwhile, there's a new MS set to open in Brookland, which will probably be underenrolled. Jefferson and Elliot Hine are underenrolled. Ward 4 wants a unicorn McFarland, which after decades of being underenrolled finally closed. Maybe the city can waste tens of millions restoring it so that it too, can be underenrolled. There's always Shaw Middle, which could be renovated and underenrolled.

Meanwhile Deal is bursting at the seams. Latin has LONG WL. Basis has a WL for 5th. Brand new DCI is fully enrolled.

Kaya told the truth when she said DCPS doesn't do MS well. Do NOT spend more money on a Hardy unicorn. Total waste of resources.




There's about 56 kids in 6th grade who are IB or from feeder schools. IB kids are about 34. There's no way to have an official statement in this sense or a certified declaration If you need confirmation call Ms Pride or wait for the school profiles to be released. Source: Principal Pride and PTO rumors.


Maybe 34 isn't a flock. Its enough to break through the prisoners dilemma. Next year should be higher (but lets wait to take bets till the 34 is official.)

This could be the first sign that DCPS CAN do MS well - and will promise well for the new schools EOTP. If anything, it suggest rather less need for charter middle schools.




Until the Latin, KIPP, DC Prep, Two Rivers, and DCI feeders don't have WLs a mile long, we'll continue to need charter middle schools.
Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 12:59     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:Mann sent 6 kids to Hardy this year-all but one was IB to Mann. Not everyone in the Mann district wants to send their kids to private, and not everyone is IMF (thus has tuition remission) or makes several hundred k a year to afford sending their kids to private.



6 of how many? 6 of 8 would be impressive. 6 of 50 not so much.
Anonymous
Post 09/23/2014 12:49     Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:

There is no city-wide arts program or pseudo-magnet at Hardy. That died a few years ago when Pope was ousted. Remember? To appease the IB parents? Who are not flocking to the school as promised? Yes, those families - who demanded things, got them, and then still didn't show up.Why in the hell would anyone open up a new school for them? Do know which ward has the most children in public school? (Hint: it's east of the river.)

Meanwhile, there's a new MS set to open in Brookland, which will probably be underenrolled. Jefferson and Elliot Hine are underenrolled. Ward 4 wants a unicorn McFarland, which after decades of being underenrolled finally closed. Maybe the city can waste tens of millions restoring it so that it too, can be underenrolled. There's always Shaw Middle, which could be renovated and underenrolled.

Meanwhile Deal is bursting at the seams. Latin has LONG WL. Basis has a WL for 5th. Brand new DCI is fully enrolled.

Kaya told the truth when she said DCPS doesn't do MS well. Do NOT spend more money on a Hardy unicorn. Total waste of resources.




There's about 56 kids in 6th grade who are IB or from feeder schools. IB kids are about 34. There's no way to have an official statement in this sense or a certified declaration If you need confirmation call Ms Pride or wait for the school profiles to be released. Source: Principal Pride and PTO rumors.


Maybe 34 isn't a flock. Its enough to break through the prisoners dilemma. Next year should be higher (but lets wait to take bets till the 34 is official.)

This could be the first sign that DCPS CAN do MS well - and will promise well for the new schools EOTP. If anything, it suggest rather less need for charter middle schools.