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Anonymous wrote:Not everyone belongs to TJ, those who don’t and get pushed in simply suffer, whether they are pushed in by overzealous parents or overzealous politicians. A differential equation doesn’t care what color of skin you have. Either you can solve it or you can’t.

You don't need to take differential equations in high school to succeed as a STEM major in college. TJ's goal should be to prepare high school kids for succeeding in STEM majors in college, not to make high school into college. I think that focus on making high school more like college instead of preparing kids to succeed in college is where TJ has gone off track and so is failing all except a small segment of the FCPS student body. Those who want a simulated college experience in high school should pay to have that privately and should not be able to use a public school for that purpose to the detriment of others.

x10000000

Yes! This!

If you don’t want to solve differential equation? then why do you even want to go to TJ?

I don't want my Kid to solve the differential equations, and I don't want your Kid to solve them too, SAD

DD takes DE class at TJ now and tells me every day how she loves it. If she had to go to her base school, she probably could have graduated after 10th grade. Maybe that’s what other advanced kids should do in the future: if they don’t win the TJ lottery, just go to the base school and graduate earlier.

Going to college at 15, 16? May not be mature enough or emotionally ready though.

Some people just can’t seem to understand. There are actually lots of kids at TJ who just love these kind of stuff and genially enjoying it. These kids need TJ.

Anonymous wrote:I actually think the reason more asian kids wants to go to TJ is the result of discrimination, not privilege.

Because in any other field that doesn’t have objective standards such as solving a differential equation, Asians are automatically perceived as less capable.

That’s probably why you don’t see Asian become lawyers or politicians.

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Anonymous wrote:Not everyone belongs to TJ, those who don’t and get pushed in simply suffer, whether they are pushed in by overzealous parents or overzealous politicians. A differential equation doesn’t care what color of skin you have. Either you can solve it or you can’t.

You don't need to take differential equations in high school to succeed as a STEM major in college. TJ's goal should be to prepare high school kids for succeeding in STEM majors in college, not to make high school into college. I think that focus on making high school more like college instead of preparing kids to succeed in college is where TJ has gone off track and so is failing all except a small segment of the FCPS student body. Those who want a simulated college experience in high school should pay to have that privately and should not be able to use a public school for that purpose to the detriment of others.

x10000000

Yes! This!

If you don’t want to solve differential equation? then why do you even want to go to TJ?

I don't want my Kid to solve the differential equations, and I don't want your Kid to solve them too, SAD

DD takes DE class at TJ now and tells me every day how she loves it. If she had to go to her base school, she probably could have graduated after 10th grade. Maybe that’s what other advanced kids should do in the future: if they don’t win the TJ lottery, just go to the base school and graduate earlier.

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Anonymous wrote:This is embarrassing from the TJ students and I am frankly shocked that these decided to put their names on it. It's just not good writing. Their position is a defensible one but this is a poorly mounted defense at best.

The vast majority of students at TJ will not accept this change, and that's to be expected because they were admitted through a different process that told them that they were the best and brightest.

+1 to the letter being very poorly written.

to be fair it is a STEM school. I wonder if their college essays are equally well written; that could explain the annual disappointment at TJ

You might be on to something here....

+1

Very few Asians are lawyers.

Anonymous wrote:When 1/3 of the students are admitted from one prep place - change is needed. Immigrants are organized, and you better believe that information traveled like wildfire, just as the test questions and answers did. In what world is that okay? Why should cheating be tolerated?

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Anonymous wrote:I find it funny that some UMC TJ alums are advocating for the change. How about you give up your position at a big law firm so the poor black/hispanic lawyer can have a chance at success?

Did you get your position through your connection? Well, that's white privilege and you should give that up. Did your get your position through hard work? That's how the current TJ students got their spot at the school but you are telling them that they should not be there.

You only advocate for change when it does not affect you anymore. Let me see you actually do what you preach!

Believe it or not, it's okay to advocate for a wrong to be fixed that you benefited from in the past. That's called caring about your community.

Anonymous wrote:I find it funny that some UMC TJ alums are advocating for the change. How about you give up your position at a big law firm so the poor black/hispanic lawyer can have a chance at success?

Did you get your position through your connection? Well, that's white privilege and you should give that up. Did your get your position through hard work? That's how the current TJ students got their spot at the school but you are telling them that they should not be there.

You only advocate for change when it does not affect you anymore. Let me see you actually do what you preach!

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Anonymous wrote:Wow. You could use some therapy.

Nah. I wasn't born yesterday and can spot self serving BS when I see it. What kind of solution is income equality will solve TJ's diversity issues? If that's the the critical thinking the current TJ produces, change is long overdue.

Why do you think income inequality is the core problem here? Many poor Asian kids test into NYC's best schools--Stuyvesant, Bronx Science etc. Why do you think poor people can't test into TJ?

Look at the FARMS rate at TJ.

NYC uses one admissions test SHSAT to select students into specialized high schools.
46% of Stuyvesant High School students live below the poverty line.
44% of Bronx Science students live below the poverty line.

Why can NYC's poor students test into these elite schools? Why can't Fairfax County's URMs test into TJ?

Maybe FCPS should switch to that test? They should also get rid of looking at anything other than the test and grades. That way some UMC kid with strong STEM extracurriculars dating back years isn't presumed to have a stronger interest in STEM than kids who couldn't afford the extracurriculars. Essays are also preppable, so we need to get rid of those too so being able to afford an essay writing coach doesn't improve a student's chance of getting in. You also keep focusing on URMs and NYC. Clearly there's an issue in FCPS because there are basically no FARMS kids of any race at TJ. Are you going to ask why poor Asians here in FCPS can't test into TJ as opposed to their counterparts in NYC? You should.

Anonymous wrote:https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/18/nyregion/black-students-nyc-high-schools.html

Only 7 Black Students Got Into Stuyvesant, N.Y.’s Most Selective High School, Out of 895 Spots

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow. You could use some therapy.

Nah. I wasn't born yesterday and can spot self serving BS when I see it. What kind of solution is income equality will solve TJ's diversity issues? If that's the the critical thinking the current TJ produces, change is long overdue.

Why do you think income inequality is the core problem here? Many poor Asian kids test into NYC's best schools--Stuyvesant, Bronx Science etc. Why do you think poor people can't test into TJ?

I've seen this argument made MANY times. However, you need to actually look at the data and how poverty is actually defined.

For FCPS, "poverty" means the percentage of students receiving free or reduced priced meals. In FCPS, this is about 30%. Its unclear if the all students that attend schools where everyone gets free lunch are included in this number.

In NYC Schools, "poverty" appears to be not as well-defined. Sometimes they use free/reduced priced meals and sometimes they use "community income". Its very confusing and I'm sure a poverty expert would be able to explain it better. NYC provides free meals to ALL of its students, not just those that are below 185% of the federal poverty limit.

NYC also sees the poverty rate at their specialized HS as a problem:

Students at the specialized high schools are less likely to be in poverty than students city wide.

While 74% of students city wide experience poverty, fewer than 50% of students at specialized high schools experience poverty.

Source: https://council.nyc.gov/data/school-diversity-in-nyc/

Anonymous wrote:This is embarrassing from the TJ students and I am frankly shocked that these decided to put their names on it. It's just not good writing. Their position is a defensible one but this is a poorly mounted defense at best.

The vast majority of students at TJ will not accept this change, and that's to be expected because they were admitted through a different process that told them that they were the best and brightest.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not everyone belongs to TJ, those who don’t and get pushed in simply suffer, whether they are pushed in by overzealous parents or overzealous politicians. A differential equation doesn’t care what color of skin you have. Either you can solve it or you can’t.

You don't need to take differential equations in high school to succeed as a STEM major in college. TJ's goal should be to prepare high school kids for succeeding in STEM majors in college, not to make high school into college. I think that focus on making high school more like college instead of preparing kids to succeed in college is where TJ has gone off track and so is failing all except a small segment of the FCPS student body. Those who want a simulated college experience in high school should pay to have that privately and should not be able to use a public school for that purpose to the detriment of others.

Nope. TJ produces not just STEM majors for college but leaders in STEM fields- students who go on to earn MD/PhD and conduct research, STEM professors, Tech Company founders etc. not a science education grad from GMU or ODU.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not everyone belongs to TJ, those who don’t and get pushed in simply suffer, whether they are pushed in by overzealous parents or overzealous politicians. A differential equation doesn’t care what color of skin you have. Either you can solve it or you can’t.

You don't need to take differential equations in high school to succeed as a STEM major in college. TJ's goal should be to prepare high school kids for succeeding in STEM majors in college, not to make high school into college. I think that focus on making high school more like college instead of preparing kids to succeed in college is where TJ has gone off track and so is failing all except a small segment of the FCPS student body. Those who want a simulated college experience in high school should pay to have that privately and should not be able to use a public school for that purpose to the detriment of others.

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We agree that the application fee should be removed/reduced.
We believe it would be a good way to create equal opportunity among the applicants.
We truly believe that when there is no gap between income and educational opportunity, diversity within the TJ community will flourish naturally. Instead of hastily trying to “fit” in more diversity at TJ, we should be starting from a fundamental level to make education an experience that flows naturally and allows everyone equal

I don't know is this is laudable naive optimism or cynical hope that the system that favored them will remain in place until the impossible is achieved

I think it's the latter. How many years would it be before there is no income gap?! We should wait for that to solve the diversity problems at TJ? Ok. These kids are smart, they can't possibly be naive enough to think that offers a real solution to the current problem.

Improving STEM education and exposure for URMS since the early age is the ONLY solution. Not to forcibly admit URMs, but to invest enough resources to make URMs as competitive as UMC children. But it's expensive, long-term and laborious, and therefore you want nothing to do with it. You want a quick fix you can point to.

Having a lottery that has an academic benchmark doesn't forcibly admit anyone. It levels the playing field so UMC kids don't have an overwhelming advantage because their parents pay for expensive prep classes and tutors. The lottery system won't be a quick fix, but it can't possibly have worse results for URMs than the current system. I also think MC and LMC white kids will be helped by the lottery. I value SES diversity as much as racial diversity. This is a public school that should serve a larger segment of the public.