Anonymous
Post 07/28/2019 17:51     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Update: my daughter is converting and when she has completed the process, they will marry. It will take a year at least. She is going to sign a prenup that ensures their children will be raised Jewish.

The dinner was great and I think her boyfriend/fiancé is a wonderful man.

The only issue I have is that his mother is disappointed he is marrying a convert. I respect my daughter’s decision and their decision as a couple, and I am trying hard to be respectful of the process. I am excited but also don’t want to be question lady. He was quite good-looking and extremely warm and welcoming and kind. He knocked my socks off! They want to have a large family, which is weird because my daughter has never expressed that desire before. I also appreciate he was honest about his mom. He said he will always love and respect his mom but he loves my daughter completely and wants to spend the rest of his life with her. I think he was worried I would be resistant but it’s not my life or choice. I will support them.
Thanks to everyone who chimed in. I am mostly excited I am hopefully going to have some gorgeous grandchildren someday. I did think about how they will be unable to experience Easter or Christmas, but there’s lots of good things they will have in their lives and that’s all that matters. My daughter is over the moon so over the moon I go with her.

I wonder if grandchildren will think their non-Jewish grandparents are “weird?” I will do anything that encourages a good relationship with them and respect their religion and lifestyle, I hope that is not a disrespectful way of terming it.



TBH, I see a LOT of red flags here, OP. The whole process is very unbalanced, skewing in favor of what the fiance wants. Where is your daughter's identity in all of this process? Why does the MIL think she has the right to express displeasure at all? Also, a pre-nup dictating how the children will be raised is not legally binding. It sounds like the fiance is extremely beholden to his family, and is expecting his wife to have a similar lack of boundaries. The part about wanting to have a large family is extremely worrying too. They're both in medical school, I think you said? So is your daughter going to be expected to quit working to care for said large family?


Same. I’m going to guess that bride and groom are not particularly religious, and that this is a cultural thing. Whatever the case, though, she’s being asked to suppress her own identify.
Anonymous
Post 07/28/2019 16:47     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
A pre-nup regarding how imaginary children who do not exist will be raised is bizarre
That is not what they would ask a Jewish bride
This already indicates that they do not even trust you to raise your own kids, if you even have them
Anonymous
Post 07/28/2019 12:57     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Again, it’s not how DILs are treated in the Jewish community; it’s how they’re treated by individual families whether they’re Jewish or not.

This is what I am not sure about. There definitely are cultural differences. It is not just a question of religion
You need to know more. There surely are a lot of variations within families, but that doesn't mean there is no cultural bias

But isn’t that true for anyone marrying into a culture they’re not born into? There are MIL stereotypes across the board. I immediately think of the incredibly WASP-y MIL in the 1990s sitcom Dharma and Greg for example.

Anonymous
Post 07/28/2019 10:25     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
Anonymous wrote:Update: my daughter is converting and when she has completed the process, they will marry. It will take a year at least. She is going to sign a prenup that ensures their children will be raised Jewish.

The dinner was great and I think her boyfriend/fiancé is a wonderful man.

The only issue I have is that his mother is disappointed he is marrying a convert. I respect my daughter’s decision and their decision as a couple, and I am trying hard to be respectful of the process. I am excited but also don’t want to be question lady. He was quite good-looking and extremely warm and welcoming and kind. He knocked my socks off! They want to have a large family, which is weird because my daughter has never expressed that desire before. I also appreciate he was honest about his mom. He said he will always love and respect his mom but he loves my daughter completely and wants to spend the rest of his life with her. I think he was worried I would be resistant but it’s not my life or choice. I will support them.
Thanks to everyone who chimed in. I am mostly excited I am hopefully going to have some gorgeous grandchildren someday. I did think about how they will be unable to experience Easter or Christmas, but there’s lots of good things they will have in their lives and that’s all that matters. My daughter is over the moon so over the moon I go with her.

I wonder if grandchildren will think their non-Jewish grandparents are “weird?” I will do anything that encourages a good relationship with them and respect their religion and lifestyle, I hope that is not a disrespectful way of terming it.



TBH, I see a LOT of red flags here, OP. The whole process is very unbalanced, skewing in favor of what the fiance wants. Where is your daughter's identity in all of this process? Why does the MIL think she has the right to express displeasure at all? Also, a pre-nup dictating how the children will be raised is not legally binding. It sounds like the fiance is extremely beholden to his family, and is expecting his wife to have a similar lack of boundaries. The part about wanting to have a large family is extremely worrying too. They're both in medical school, I think you said? So is your daughter going to be expected to quit working to care for said large family?
Anonymous
Post 07/28/2019 10:17     Subject: Re:Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
I view it as the religion of most people in this country. Very few people actually believe anything in the Bible, though.
Anonymous
Post 07/28/2019 10:15     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Sounds like a lot of conditions.
1st no woman is good enough
Then she must convert

Then maybe mil will come around and accept it
Fil says as long as kids are raised Jewish

Being raised Jewish sounds like it is all dependent on the woman, is that not the dad's duty too?

This makes me wonder how equal ia Dil is in their community

Judaism is matrilineal, so in some people’s eyes (for every 10 Jews, there are 10 ways of following Judaism), the mother has to be Jewish for the children to be Jewish.

In general, someone who converts definitely “counts” as Jewish. This isn’t a “community” thing; it’s a “this mother-in-law” thing.

This mother in law is quite vocal about it
From my experience with past friends who have dated Jews, there was a lot of pressure on the guy to not get serious
Perhaps the father was also against it but let the mother do the talking.
How is a Dil treated?

8:55

I’m a Jewish woman married to a non-Jewish man. We’re raising our children Jewish. All sets of parents are harmonious and friendly.

My Jewish brother is dating a woman who was raised by a Jewish father and a Catholic mother. She identifies as Jewish. Her mother was welcomed with open arms by her father’s family. All sides of the family love each other and spend holidays together. If she marries my brother, she will also be welcomed by my family with open arms.

Again, it’s not how DILs are treated in the Jewish community; it’s how they’re treated by individual families whether they’re Jewish or not.


Exactly. I am non-Jewish and my MIL never for a second made me feel unwelcome based on not being Jewish. Her only concern was that our son be circumcised - that was a tough one to navigate, but since my DH wanted it too, it was an easier decision. Who knows, maybe she would have preferred a Jewish daughter in law, but her family is more important to her than that. I think she was also influenced by the fact that she was somewhat ostracized by her own Orthodox family for becoming more secular and marrying a non-Orthodox jew.

Anonymous
Post 07/28/2019 10:10     Subject: Re:Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
My rabbi (who is Reform) says there is no reason that Jewish kids cannot attend holiday celebrations with their non-Jewish relatives. You will likely be invited to their holiday dinners (Rosh Hashanah, Passover Seder). So there is no reason that they cannot come to your house for Christmas dinner or Easter brunch etc and celebrate with the family. They won’t go to church with you but that is understandable. I was also at a bat mitzvah service recently where the child recognized her non-Jewish family for teaching her love and tolerance. I found it moving. With respect to the pre-nup, I assume it’s just belts and suspenders for the in-laws bc once your daughter converts, she will be Jewish. I would not worry about the in-laws. It sounds like they both have understand how to deal with them (and her fiancé has her back). Your daughter sounds lovely and they are lucky to have her in the family.
Anonymous
Post 07/28/2019 08:49     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
Anonymous wrote:Thanks for chiming in. He keeps kosher and attends temple every week, not sure if once or twice. I know at Christmas he bought her a Mensch on a Bench. They are both in their late 20s and live in another state, so I don’t get to peer into their relationship. I know they work a lot, hike, and generally enjoy each other’s company. I am happy to know that it’s not weird for them to date.


Sounds like a ringing endorsement. Are you angry?
Anonymous
Post 07/28/2019 07:41     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
Anonymous wrote:
Again, it’s not how DILs are treated in the Jewish community; it’s how they’re treated by individual families whether they’re Jewish or not.

This is what I am not sure about. There definitely are cultural differences. It is not just a question of religion
You need to know more. There surely are a lot of variations within families, but that doesn't mean there is no cultural bias
Anonymous
Post 07/27/2019 10:24     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Sounds like a lot of conditions.
1st no woman is good enough
Then she must convert

Then maybe mil will come around and accept it
Fil says as long as kids are raised Jewish

Being raised Jewish sounds like it is all dependent on the woman, is that not the dad's duty too?

This makes me wonder how equal ia Dil is in their community

Judaism is matrilineal, so in some people’s eyes (for every 10 Jews, there are 10 ways of following Judaism), the mother has to be Jewish for the children to be Jewish.

In general, someone who converts definitely “counts” as Jewish. This isn’t a “community” thing; it’s a “this mother-in-law” thing.

This mother in law is quite vocal about it
From my experience with past friends who have dated Jews, there was a lot of pressure on the guy to not get serious
Perhaps the father was also against it but let the mother do the talking.
How is a Dil treated?

8:55

I’m a Jewish woman married to a non-Jewish man. We’re raising our children Jewish. All sets of parents are harmonious and friendly.

My Jewish brother is dating a woman who was raised by a Jewish father and a Catholic mother. She identifies as Jewish. Her mother was welcomed with open arms by her father’s family. All sides of the family love each other and spend holidays together. If she marries my brother, she will also be welcomed by my family with open arms.

Again, it’s not how DILs are treated in the Jewish community; it’s how they’re treated by individual families whether they’re Jewish or not.
Anonymous
Post 07/27/2019 09:00     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Sounds like a lot of conditions.
1st no woman is good enough
Then she must convert

Then maybe mil will come around and accept it
Fil says as long as kids are raised Jewish

Being raised Jewish sounds like it is all dependent on the woman, is that not the dad's duty too?

This makes me wonder how equal ia Dil is in their community

Judaism is matrilineal, so in some people’s eyes (for every 10 Jews, there are 10 ways of following Judaism), the mother has to be Jewish for the children to be Jewish.

In general, someone who converts definitely “counts” as Jewish. This isn’t a “community” thing; it’s a “this mother-in-law” thing.

This mother in law is quite vocal about it
From my experience with past friends who have dated Jews, there was a lot of pressure on the guy to not get serious
Perhaps the father was also against it but let the mother do the talking.
How is a Dil treated?
Anonymous
Post 07/27/2019 08:55     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
Anonymous wrote:Sounds like a lot of conditions.
1st no woman is good enough
Then she must convert

Then maybe mil will come around and accept it
Fil says as long as kids are raised Jewish

Being raised Jewish sounds like it is all dependent on the woman, is that not the dad's duty too?

This makes me wonder how equal ia Dil is in their community

Judaism is matrilineal, so in some people’s eyes (for every 10 Jews, there are 10 ways of following Judaism), the mother has to be Jewish for the children to be Jewish.

In general, someone who converts definitely “counts” as Jewish. This isn’t a “community” thing; it’s a “this mother-in-law” thing.
Anonymous
Post 07/26/2019 23:55     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
Sounds like a lot of conditions.
1st no woman is good enough
Then she must convert

Then maybe mil will come around and accept it
Fil says as long as kids are raised Jewish

Being raised Jewish sounds like it is all dependent on the woman, is that not the dad's duty too?

This makes me wonder how equal ia Dil is in their community
Anonymous
Post 07/26/2019 22:50     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
Anonymous wrote:Thank you all for this info. Dd’s fiancé didn’t belabor the issue but said no woman would meet his mom’s standards and she will accept his marriage as long as my daughter converts and their children are raised Jewish. He said he took his current job so he could be independent and live his life...but also is committed to his religion and parents. He made it clear to me he will always make sure my dd is respected. They go to counseling to deal with this issue and I was glad to hear it. My dd is not worried too much because they live far away and will only see his family for special occasions or brief trips due to work schedules anyway. He made me feel comfortable and a part of his family already. Part of me is sad because we too will see them occasionally but that’s how it goes sometimes. Thank you all again.


He sounds like a mensch, your daughter sounds like she's thought this through carefully, which is important, and you sound very caring and lovely. His mother will almost certainly come around when there are grandchildren. She seems somewhat close-minded and old school but once she has grandkids she will dote on them in her own way. It will all work out. Mazel tov (congratulations) on the happy event to be!
Anonymous
Post 07/26/2019 15:03     Subject: Jewish people: how do you view Christianity?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Update: my daughter is converting and when she has completed the process, they will marry. It will take a year at least. She is going to sign a prenup that ensures their children will be raised Jewish.

The dinner was great and I think her boyfriend/fiancé is a wonderful man.

The only issue I have is that his mother is disappointed he is marrying a convert. I respect my daughter’s decision and their decision as a couple, and I am trying hard to be respectful of the process. I am excited but also don’t want to be question lady. He was quite good-looking and extremely warm and welcoming and kind. He knocked my socks off! They want to have a large family, which is weird because my daughter has never expressed that desire before. I also appreciate he was honest about his mom. He said he will always love and respect his mom but he loves my daughter completely and wants to spend the rest of his life with her. I think he was worried I would be resistant but it’s not my life or choice. I will support them.
Thanks to everyone who chimed in. I am mostly excited I am hopefully going to have some gorgeous grandchildren someday. I did think about how they will be unable to experience Easter or Christmas, but there’s lots of good things they will have in their lives and that’s all that matters. My daughter is over the moon so over the moon I go with her.

I wonder if grandchildren will think their non-Jewish grandparents are “weird?” I will do anything that encourages a good relationship with them and respect their religion and lifestyle, I hope that is not a disrespectful way of terming it.





Hi OP - you sound like you are a great Mom and a soon-to-be awesome MIL!

I'm coming to this conversation late, but I was raised Protestant, married a Jew, am raising our kids Jewish, and in the process of converting. Yes, it took me a lot longer to get there than your daughter did!

As for my family, my kids always knew that I grew up as a Christian with Christian holidays. We also celebrated those holidays - in a secular way - in my parents' or siblings' houses. We never went to church with them, and didn't do Santa or the Easter Bunny, but rather my kids got gifts from my side of the family (and we gave gifts as well). They will all be in attendance at my kids' - and my - bar mitzvahs. Best of all, my ILs and my family get along quite well. Respect and love for family really is a key value for all of us.

Mazel tov to you and your daughter!


Thank you so much and my best wishes to your family. I appreciate your insight.