Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Differential in free time is your core issue. Quit talking about it in terms of “leaning out” to someone earning in the top 5% of American households by himself.

But that doesn't mean he isn't leaning out. I make about $225k, but it's a lot less than I did and probably than I could. I have very regular and flexible hours. If a kid gets sick or something has to be done around the house I can cover it no problem. I almost never have true stress at work and can almost always put something off until tomorrow. These things are more important than whether I make $25k or $225k.

Apparently your memories of what it was like to make $25k are not vivid.

Apparently your reading comprehension skills are lacking. My post had nothing to do with what it would be like to live on $25k. The point was that in deciding which person should take over the household responsibilities and mental load it is more important the nature of the person's job (hours, flexibility, stress) than how much someone makes.

For example, there are certain jobs that have very long hours, big stress, and almost no flexibility -- yet are relatively low paid -- such as a medical resident or a law clerk to a federal judge. Someone in either of these positions may very well make considerably less than their spouse, even if the spouse had more of a 9-5 job. It would be insane to have the resident/clerk take on more of the family responsibilities because s/he made less, even when their job is far more difficult and leaves less time and energy for outside responsibilities.

I'm not in the same position as the OP but can relate somewhat. My husband and I each make what OP's husband makes; actually I make a bit more and he makes a bit less. We both have a lot of flexibility but I have substantially more in-the-office/management responsibilities than he does (he's an academic.) I leaned out briefly while he tried a political job, but it didn't suit him. Since then my job has expanded a lot.

Like OP, I've handled 100% of the 'mental load' of parenting, actually of adulthood in general - all kid appointments and activities; all cooking/shopping; all vacations or nights out; all managing the house. I have tried to shift discrete items to him, but it still requires constant intervention: for example he refuses to be on the email/TeamSnap chains for kid sports so even if he agrees to drive to practice I have to tell him when and where (and often give directions, since he basically refuses to remember which park is which.) He also manages our savings/investments and does a bit more of the homework load with our oldest now, in HS. But on literally every other thing on any adult/parent's to-do list, it's like having a third kid. I've turned down at least 5 jobs that would have boosted my career significantly in part because of the way our lives are, although that was always my choice, mostly about wanting to be around my kids, and in my husband's defense he always encourages me to lean in and promises to do whatever is necessary to make that happen.

We make plenty by any standard but don't come from money (still paying student loans while desperately saving for college) so we can't totally hire our way out of this problem. And as I think your OP hints, in the end hiring someone doesn't really eliminate the burden of managing that person. Personally I found it harder to manage a nanny than to use daycare.

The bottom line with my DH and probably yours as well OP is that it isn't going to change. You have to decide whether you can live with things the way they are or whether there are different solutions for you that would make you happier: a different job, moving near family or moving them to you. Or finding the type of nanny that some of my colleagues has, who literally does every thing from getting the oil changed in the cars to packing for family trips. Yes, ideally we'd all have perfect partners, and if I'd known how my life would turn out, perhaps I would have made a different choice. But as I said at the top, it is what it is and the fact that you are pulling in a big paycheck gives you a lot of options. Obviously another solution is divorce; I have one friend with a slacker husband who went that route and is very happy. It helps that she has one kid, a trust fund, and very engaged grandparents.

OP, you missed the point of the article. You gloss over the part where one spouse works part-time, but that is a huge element. It sounds like your family is stretched way too thin. Your husband works a full-time job that makes good money, and he already handles a ton of childcare. He deserves rest. You sound like the kind of person who doesn’t need/understand rest. I feel like your ideal arrangement is for you both to stay up past midnight every night handling everything that needs to be done in the house. That sounds unsustainable and miserable. You need to either have a real part-time or SAH spouse, or you need to lean out a little yourself.

Anonymous wrote:Your lives sound miserable. Completely miserable. You BOTH need to lean out. This fight isn’t going to be solved by completely outsourcing. It’s fine to be ambitious but there is a time for everything. Missing everything in preschool is not the time.

Why isn’t both parties leaning out ever a suggestion? Both my husband and I have leaned out. Our lives are amazing. No, we can’t buy a yacht anytime soon, but that’s ok!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your hhi is 600k. Hire a household manager. You could pay someone 100k and still make a buttload of money each year.

Some people can't handle that mental load. Most men can't do it. Neither can some women. It is what it is. Use your income to make this manageable for yourself.

He is shafting his own kids.

He is playing a game of chicken with his wife- she if she will quit.
He needs to meet more SAHDads- they are all over my Bethesda neighborhood. Some are early retirees too.

But he’s not a SAHD.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your hhi is 600k. Hire a household manager. You could pay someone 100k and still make a buttload of money each year.

Some people can't handle that mental load. Most men can't do it. Neither can some women. It is what it is. Use your income to make this manageable for yourself.

He is shafting his own kids.

He is playing a game of chicken with his wife- she if she will quit.
He needs to meet more SAHDads- they are all over my Bethesda neighborhood. Some are early retirees too.

He’s not a SAHD! He has a full-time job where he makes $200k! They need a better nanny!!

Anonymous wrote:He doesn’t get home until 6-6:30 on most nights and later on others ? And he has the less demanding job? What time do you get home? What time do your kids get to bed? Who takes your special needs child to all their doctor’s appointments? What time do you and your DH leave in the morning? How old are your children?

If you make $400k and your DH makes $200k. Either of you make enough for one of you to be home full time or at least half time.

I didn’t understand that part either... My husband is the breadwinner in our family and still gets home before 6.... OP’s husband’s job actually sounds pretty demanding.

Anonymous wrote:Your hhi is 600k. Hire a household manager. You could pay someone 100k and still make a buttload of money each year.

Some people can't handle that mental load. Most men can't do it. Neither can some women. It is what it is. Use your income to make this manageable for yourself.

He is shafting his own kids.

He is playing a game of chicken with his wife- she if she will quit.
He needs to meet more SAHDads- they are all over my Bethesda neighborhood. Some are early retirees too.

Your lives sound miserable. Completely miserable. You BOTH need to lean out. This fight isn’t going to be solved by completely outsourcing. It’s fine to be ambitious but there is a time for everything. Missing everything in preschool is not the time.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Differential in free time is your core issue. Quit talking about it in terms of “leaning out” to someone earning in the top 5% of American households by himself.

But that doesn't mean he isn't leaning out. I make about $225k, but it's a lot less than I did and probably than I could. I have very regular and flexible hours. If a kid gets sick or something has to be done around the house I can cover it no problem. I almost never have true stress at work and can almost always put something off until tomorrow. These things are more important than whether I make $25k or $225k.

Apparently your memories of what it was like to make $25k are not vivid.

Anonymous wrote:Remind me why you and your DH had kids again? Just to check it off your bucket list? Kids take time. Make the time for them.

Exactly. Slow the eff down, OP. Your children will be out of the house before you know it and you won't even know who they are. It blows my mind that people who can make this much money still choose to spend almost no time with their kids. Poor kids.

Hire someone, honey. He would if the roles were reversed — you’d have at least one full time caregiver/housekeeper to help you at home. A lot of this stuff sounds like something a competent PA could handle. It’s just not worth it. If your husband wants to relax at night, and you are richer than god, let him watch some TV.

Anonymous wrote:Differential in free time is your core issue. Quit talking about it in terms of “leaning out” to someone earning in the top 5% of American households by himself.

But that doesn't mean he isn't leaning out. I make about $225k, but it's a lot less than I did and probably than I could. I have very regular and flexible hours. If a kid gets sick or something has to be done around the house I can cover it no problem. I almost never have true stress at work and can almost always put something off until tomorrow. These things are more important than whether I make $25k or $225k.

Anonymous wrote:Your poor kids.

Please kindly go eat broken glass.

Honestly all you need is a very good nanny.