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Anonymous wrote:I'm in my 40s with kids (elementary school). My Mother keeps pushing us to go to church, saying the kids need to learn about God. She buys books for my kids but they are not interested. She makes us all say grace when they(mom and dad) visit. Now she's telling me that my nieces went to church this past weekend, and that we had better start going. She guilts us by saying stuff like we will not have the lords blessing, etc.

I personally have no interest. I found bible study boring. What's the appropriate thing to do w.r.t. the kids? Let them grow older and decide for themselves? Any thoughts on how to deal with mom?

OP, your story makes me so sad. You have no idea what church and a relationship with God could add to your family, and to your kids' lives. (Your's too, by the way.)

Your mother is another story and I have a feeling there are other issues here you haven't mentioned.

I wish it would "hit" me too! Then I'd go to church and this won't be an issue. I've done the religion thing as a teen and an adult. I never had the thirst like those in the bible study groups. I think I'm a non believer. Any issues that arise now is only because i was brought up thinking I HAD to go to church, not because I wanted to.

As for my kids, my mom has done a lot to share with them about christianity. So they are exposed. They'll listen and all and read the books with her. But they have never once asked to attend church. After all, they are only kids. If they "find" religion later, great.

OP, you're treating your kids like they're your pets or something.

It is your job as their father to provide guidance, truth and moral leadership. This is not something that you can just hope they'll stumble into at some point when they are adults. You are completely abdicating your responsibility here, as a man and as their dad.

And all because you still have mommy issues of your own.

Pathetic.

What's pathetic are all of these child molesting Christian religious leaders and the congregations that shelter them. Whats pathetic are Congressmen who brag about their personal relationship with Jesus, and then spit on his teaching by cutting off food stamps and health insurance for low income kids. Most surveys of people in prison find thst the majority are Christians, and atheists are underrepresented. Going to church does not make you a decent or ethicsl person.

Of course it doesn't. Churches are full of sinners. Sinners who are redeemed by grace, we hope, but sinners none the less.

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We joined a church when our son was in fourth grade because we wanted him to be grounded in the history of the Christian religion,which is a cornerstone of Western civilization, as well as find a community of good people who have their hearts in the right place, and have a place where we can work for the greater good.

We found all of that in our current church. I sporadically went to church growing up, and I can't believe how much I am learning. Even all the phrases that are commonplace in our language that come straight out of the Bible. My son loves all the fun stuff the church groups are doing, and he is learning all the stories of the Bible. Again, so much of our culture is based on these stories. Even from a purely academic sense, it's smart to know them.

It's possible to learn the history of the CHristian religion in a purely academic sense without being taught to believe that it's true.

I would argue that when you become immersed in learning about religion (any religion, not just Christianity), you are far more likely to come out an unbeliever, than a believer.

This certainly happens to some people. A close reading of the Bible has turned many away from religion because they can't fathom a loving god who would be so cruel to his creation.

Others say those people don't understand the Bible and the context in which it was written, so it doesn't interfere with their deep faith.

Then they aren't reading very closely and/or they haven't read the entire story. It's easy to cherry-pick to suit one's pre-conceived notions.

People are often horrified when they see how violent the Bible is. They didn't cherrypick to see it that way - it jumped out at them while studying the Bible to become better CHristians

The Bible has a lot of violence because it's about real life.

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We joined a church when our son was in fourth grade because we wanted him to be grounded in the history of the Christian religion,which is a cornerstone of Western civilization, as well as find a community of good people who have their hearts in the right place, and have a place where we can work for the greater good.

We found all of that in our current church. I sporadically went to church growing up, and I can't believe how much I am learning. Even all the phrases that are commonplace in our language that come straight out of the Bible. My son loves all the fun stuff the church groups are doing, and he is learning all the stories of the Bible. Again, so much of our culture is based on these stories. Even from a purely academic sense, it's smart to know them.

It's possible to learn the history of the CHristian religion in a purely academic sense without being taught to believe that it's true.

I would argue that when you become immersed in learning about religion (any religion, not just Christianity), you are far more likely to come out an unbeliever, than a believer.

This certainly happens to some people. A close reading of the Bible has turned many away from religion because they can't fathom a loving god who would be so cruel to his creation.

Others say those people don't understand the Bible and the context in which it was written, so it doesn't interfere with their deep faith.

Then they aren't reading very closely and/or they haven't read the entire story. It's easy to cherry-pick to suit one's pre-conceived notions.

People are often horrified when they see how violent the Bible is. They didn't cherrypick to see it that way - it jumped out at them while studying the Bible to become better CHristians

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Anonymous wrote:We went to a UU Congregation from when my children were preschool aged to HS graduation. My mother was happy. For her, Church was more about community.

Then you quit? If so, it seems that the community didn't mean so much to you.

Anonymous wrote:We went to a UU Congregation from when my children were preschool aged to HS graduation. My mother was happy. For her, Church was more about community.

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We joined a church when our son was in fourth grade because we wanted him to be grounded in the history of the Christian religion,which is a cornerstone of Western civilization, as well as find a community of good people who have their hearts in the right place, and have a place where we can work for the greater good.

We found all of that in our current church. I sporadically went to church growing up, and I can't believe how much I am learning. Even all the phrases that are commonplace in our language that come straight out of the Bible. My son loves all the fun stuff the church groups are doing, and he is learning all the stories of the Bible. Again, so much of our culture is based on these stories. Even from a purely academic sense, it's smart to know them.

It's possible to learn the history of the CHristian religion in a purely academic sense without being taught to believe that it's true.

I would argue that when you become immersed in learning about religion (any religion, not just Christianity), you are far more likely to come out an unbeliever, than a believer.

This certainly happens to some people. A close reading of the Bible has turned many away from religion because they can't fathom a loving god who would be so cruel to his creation.

Others say those people don't understand the Bible and the context in which it was written, so it doesn't interfere with their deep faith.

Then they aren't reading very closely and/or they haven't read the entire story. It's easy to cherry-pick to suit one's pre-conceived notions.

People are often horrified when they see how violent the Bible is. They didn't cherrypick to see it that way - it jumped out at them while studying the Bible to become better CHristians

Ah, the “everybody is becoming atheist like me” poster has found the thread.

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Anonymous wrote:My in laws continuously encourage my kids to be more religious. I only step in if I don’t like the persuasion techniques (guilt, fear mongering) just as I would regardless of the topic. I have warned my MIL that she will ruin her relationship with them if she pushes too hard but that is her choice to make. I offer them full access to the kids and full control over their time together. Either the kids will decide to follow their grandparents religion or they’ll stay atheist little heathens (or find a different path I guess). All options are OK with me. Looks like they are going to continue to be little heathens and push back against spending time with the grandparents. The diminishing of that relationship makes me sad but maybe it’s inevitable as the kids age regardless of whether or not they pushed religious dogma.

If you really don't care if your kids decide to follow their grandparents religion, why don't you encourage kids and gps to follow that religion. It sure would ease family relationships.

Somehow, I think you DO care and are betting on your kids not taking religions seriously.

Why would I? I don’t believe in religion and so that is what I share with my kids. I have no problem with someone they love sharing a different perspective. I don’t get why you think I should encourage them to do follow a religion?

As stated above, because it would ease family relationships.

The grandparents can also make things easier by respecting the parents' preferences.

Yes, there are two ways of handling this, depending on the parents' wishes. That's why I think it's important for the parents to be clear -- do they really not care or would they prefer the kids not to be raised with religion? If they don't care, then letting the gps take the kids to church would ease family relationships, even while it may also be a form of "shameless manipulation."

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:My in laws continuously encourage my kids to be more religious. I only step in if I don’t like the persuasion techniques (guilt, fear mongering) just as I would regardless of the topic. I have warned my MIL that she will ruin her relationship with them if she pushes too hard but that is her choice to make. I offer them full access to the kids and full control over their time together. Either the kids will decide to follow their grandparents religion or they’ll stay atheist little heathens (or find a different path I guess). All options are OK with me. Looks like they are going to continue to be little heathens and push back against spending time with the grandparents. The diminishing of that relationship makes me sad but maybe it’s inevitable as the kids age regardless of whether or not they pushed religious dogma.

If you really don't care if your kids decide to follow their grandparents religion, why don't you encourage kids and gps to follow that religion. It sure would ease family relationships.

Somehow, I think you DO care and are betting on your kids not taking religions seriously.

Why would I? I don’t believe in religion and so that is what I share with my kids. I have no problem with someone they love sharing a different perspective. I don’t get why you think I should encourage them to do follow a religion?

As stated above, because it would ease family relationships.

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Anonymous wrote:I'm in my 40s with kids (elementary school). My Mother keeps pushing us to go to church, saying the kids need to learn about God. She buys books for my kids but they are not interested. She makes us all say grace when they(mom and dad) visit. Now she's telling me that my nieces went to church this past weekend, and that we had better start going. She guilts us by saying stuff like we will not have the lords blessing, etc.

I personally have no interest. I found bible study boring. What's the appropriate thing to do w.r.t. the kids? Let them grow older and decide for themselves? Any thoughts on how to deal with mom?

OP, your story makes me so sad. You have no idea what church and a relationship with God could add to your family, and to your kids' lives. (Your's too, by the way.)

Your mother is another story and I have a feeling there are other issues here you haven't mentioned.

I wish it would "hit" me too! Then I'd go to church and this won't be an issue. I've done the religion thing as a teen and an adult. I never had the thirst like those in the bible study groups. I think I'm a non believer. Any issues that arise now is only because i was brought up thinking I HAD to go to church, not because I wanted to.

As for my kids, my mom has done a lot to share with them about christianity. So they are exposed. They'll listen and all and read the books with her. But they have never once asked to attend church. After all, they are only kids. If they "find" religion later, great.

OP, you're treating your kids like they're your pets or something.

It is your job as their father to provide guidance, truth and moral leadership. This is not something that you can just hope they'll stumble into at some point when they are adults. You are completely abdicating your responsibility here, as a man and as their dad.

And all because you still have mommy issues of your own.

Pathetic.

Do you go to Church?

Who, me? Yes. Weekly.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
We joined a church when our son was in fourth grade because we wanted him to be grounded in the history of the Christian religion,which is a cornerstone of Western civilization, as well as find a community of good people who have their hearts in the right place, and have a place where we can work for the greater good.

We found all of that in our current church. I sporadically went to church growing up, and I can't believe how much I am learning. Even all the phrases that are commonplace in our language that come straight out of the Bible. My son loves all the fun stuff the church groups are doing, and he is learning all the stories of the Bible. Again, so much of our culture is based on these stories. Even from a purely academic sense, it's smart to know them.

It's possible to learn the history of the CHristian religion in a purely academic sense without being taught to believe that it's true.

I would argue that when you become immersed in learning about religion (any religion, not just Christianity), you are far more likely to come out an unbeliever, than a believer.

This certainly happens to some people. A close reading of the Bible has turned many away from religion because they can't fathom a loving god who would be so cruel to his creation.

Others say those people don't understand the Bible and the context in which it was written, so it doesn't interfere with their deep faith.

Then they aren't reading very closely and/or they haven't read the entire story. It's easy to cherry-pick to suit one's pre-conceived notions.

People are often horrified when they see how violent the Bible is. They didn't cherrypick to see it that way - it jumped out at them while studying the Bible to become better CHristians

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Anonymous wrote:I'll give a slightly different perspective, OP. A friend was raised by a lapsed Catholic family and never learned a thing about religions. We both agree that each person should make a personal choice about religion, but friend will say that being raised with no exposure effectively took that choice away from him. He feels that as an adult it is now a bridge too far.

So he feels that the children should be raised in a faith and attend religious education, so that when they reach the age of confirmation and ultimately adulthood, the choice is 100% their to make with sufficient knowledge to guide their decision of faith. In the end, if they decline to practice a faith, they still have a decent knowledge of biblical literature, which is a great education in and of itself, and can also contribute to discussions and debates about religion in a meaningful way. This friend always feels lost in such discussions because he is smart enough to realize that he doesn't quite understands what people are talking about.

Your friend can take a course in Biblical literature any time and not feel cut off. He could send his kids to a Unitarian church where they learn about all religions and are not indoctrinated into any one religion.

There are lots of ways to learn about religion without being a member of a particular denomination.

He actually disagrees with that approach, although the Unitarian approach might cover that. But you cannot get from a class when you get from living for a while in a community of faith because there is much more to it than book learning. He gets that.

I think I understand -- there's a culture involved in attending church that is not available when reading or attending an academic class. The potential downside, is that the culture may include teaching beliefs as facts that must be accepted to avoid dire, eternal consequences.

Yes, but of course, the vast majority of main stream religions don't actually teach that, so that really is a very small cultish problem.

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We joined a church when our son was in fourth grade because we wanted him to be grounded in the history of the Christian religion,which is a cornerstone of Western civilization, as well as find a community of good people who have their hearts in the right place, and have a place where we can work for the greater good.

We found all of that in our current church. I sporadically went to church growing up, and I can't believe how much I am learning. Even all the phrases that are commonplace in our language that come straight out of the Bible. My son loves all the fun stuff the church groups are doing, and he is learning all the stories of the Bible. Again, so much of our culture is based on these stories. Even from a purely academic sense, it's smart to know them.

It's possible to learn the history of the CHristian religion in a purely academic sense without being taught to believe that it's true.

I would argue that when you become immersed in learning about religion (any religion, not just Christianity), you are far more likely to come out an unbeliever, than a believer.

This certainly happens to some people. A close reading of the Bible has turned many away from religion because they can't fathom a loving god who would be so cruel to his creation.

Others say those people don't understand the Bible and the context in which it was written, so it doesn't interfere with their deep faith.

Then they aren't reading very closely and/or they haven't read the entire story. It's easy to cherry-pick to suit one's pre-conceived notions.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
We joined a church when our son was in fourth grade because we wanted him to be grounded in the history of the Christian religion,which is a cornerstone of Western civilization, as well as find a community of good people who have their hearts in the right place, and have a place where we can work for the greater good.

We found all of that in our current church. I sporadically went to church growing up, and I can't believe how much I am learning. Even all the phrases that are commonplace in our language that come straight out of the Bible. My son loves all the fun stuff the church groups are doing, and he is learning all the stories of the Bible. Again, so much of our culture is based on these stories. Even from a purely academic sense, it's smart to know them.

It's possible to learn the history of the CHristian religion in a purely academic sense without being taught to believe that it's true.

Not really. Because it is Truth, and it is the foundation of all of Western humanity.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm in my 40s with kids (elementary school). My Mother keeps pushing us to go to church, saying the kids need to learn about God. She buys books for my kids but they are not interested. She makes us all say grace when they(mom and dad) visit. Now she's telling me that my nieces went to church this past weekend, and that we had better start going. She guilts us by saying stuff like we will not have the lords blessing, etc.

I personally have no interest. I found bible study boring. What's the appropriate thing to do w.r.t. the kids? Let them grow older and decide for themselves? Any thoughts on how to deal with mom?

OP, your story makes me so sad. You have no idea what church and a relationship with God could add to your family, and to your kids' lives. (Your's too, by the way.)

Your mother is another story and I have a feeling there are other issues here you haven't mentioned.

I wish it would "hit" me too! Then I'd go to church and this won't be an issue. I've done the religion thing as a teen and an adult. I never had the thirst like those in the bible study groups. I think I'm a non believer. Any issues that arise now is only because i was brought up thinking I HAD to go to church, not because I wanted to.

As for my kids, my mom has done a lot to share with them about christianity. So they are exposed. They'll listen and all and read the books with her. But they have never once asked to attend church. After all, they are only kids. If they "find" religion later, great.

OP, you're treating your kids like they're your pets or something.

It is your job as their father to provide guidance, truth and moral leadership. This is not something that you can just hope they'll stumble into at some point when they are adults. You are completely abdicating your responsibility here, as a man and as their dad.

And all because you still have mommy issues of your own.

Pathetic.