Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Plagiarism will get you kicked out of college. Will that be ok with you too?

But college makes sense. Routine homework is not graded. Students are free to do as many problems as they believe are required for mastery. There'd be no need to copy someone's homework just to check a box. Doing this in high school math has little relation to plagiarizing in a college writing class.

Except the fact that high school is creating habits for college.

I cheated in HS on homework, but knew damn well not to plagiarize a paper in college. It is all about time management and doing an accurate risk analysis.

Well, no it's about being honest. I watched 3 classmates of mine cheat on a test in high school and didn't say anything because I thought it was none of my business. Until I saw that all three of them ranked higher than I did at graduation.
I still don't cheat and they probably still do.

How do you know they still cheat? I cheated on HS homework, haven't since because I didn't want to get kicked out of college and nor do I have any desire to lose my professional certification. Seriously, HS activity does not necessarily translate to adulthood.

Anonymous wrote:
Uh, I'm the pp suggesting that people thinking filling out a daily times sheet is beneath them, but it is required. You don't get to change the rule just because it doesn't suit you. Ditto letting your kid skirt homework policy that a teacher decides is non-negotiable.

You don't get to publicly change rules, but if the rule is stupid and deserves to be violated, you violate it, secretly, but take the consequences if they come to you.

I've noticed teachers load grades with a shit ton of homework so everyone who turns in homework can hardly get anything lower than a B-, i.e. grade inflation. Getting a B in high school math is SUSPECT, as is copying what is very easy homework.

Your child likely needs a math tutor. I guarantee they are developing math gaps that will screw them over when math gets challenging, e.g. pre-calc.

Ron and Harry copied off of Hermione ALL THE TIME and they managed to get through Hogwarts.....

(Well actually they didn't, but that's only because they all had to drop out senior year. Because Voldemort. But they all went on to have very successful careers.)

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Plagiarism will get you kicked out of college. Will that be ok with you too?

But college makes sense. Routine homework is not graded. Students are free to do as many problems as they believe are required for mastery. There'd be no need to copy someone's homework just to check a box. Doing this in high school math has little relation to plagiarizing in a college writing class.

Except the fact that high school is creating habits for college.

I cheated in HS on homework, but knew damn well not to plagiarize a paper in college. It is all about time management and doing an accurate risk analysis.

Well, no it's about being honest. I watched 3 classmates of mine cheat on a test in high school and didn't say anything because I thought it was none of my business. Until I saw that all three of them ranked higher than I did at graduation.
I still don't cheat and they probably still do.

So disgusted with all the DCUMers who are trying to justify cheating on homework with terms like "risk assessment." This is the thinking of bankers who nearly brought down the world economy with cheating, but they were making lots of money and living the good life, so it's OK?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Plagiarism will get you kicked out of college. Will that be ok with you too?

But college makes sense. Routine homework is not graded. Students are free to do as many problems as they believe are required for mastery. There'd be no need to copy someone's homework just to check a box. Doing this in high school math has little relation to plagiarizing in a college writing class.

Except the fact that high school is creating habits for college.

I cheated in HS on homework, but knew damn well not to plagiarize a paper in college. It is all about time management and doing an accurate risk analysis.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here -- I agree that if the homework is not worth the time, the students need to address the issue with the teacher. If I found my kid cheating, I would tell my kid that they have lost a bit of my trust in them. If they can't be trusted with "little things" like doing his/her own homework, how could I trust him or her with bigger things? Once trust is lost, it is hard to regain (E.g., look at the leading presidential candidates trying to regain people's trust). In OP's case, I'd be concerned that my child can't effectively communicate a problem to an adult authority, here the teacher. It is a skill that needs to be honed over time. There will be plenty in the work world kids will find unnecessary (filling in a timecard), that can spell big trouble for an employer and employee if not handled properly.

This assumes the teacher is level-headed and fair. In 6th grade my DD's math teacher was intimidating (to me, even, and I'm not intimidated easily) and unreasonable. We do not have a computer at home for DD to use and the teacher assigned 45 minutes a day of Kahn Academy online to each student. When I told her I could get DD to the library once during the week and once on weekends and she'd do it ALL those two times she said "No, must be every day." I told her that's not possible, and she said DD should use the computer lab. I asked if she would be staying late at the school to walk DD to the bus stop and wait for the bus in the dark so that DD was safe getting home after staying so late, and she said no. So guess what? I did Kahn Academy at work each day. I made sure DD understood what she was learning, but we worked around her teacher.

oh wow, a twofer. Cheating your employer and helping daughter cheat at school. I do think that teachers rule was unfair and should be taken up the chain. I also think your solution was wrong.

Uh, I'm the pp suggesting that people thinking filling out a daily times sheet is beneath them, but it is required. You don't get to change the rule just because it doesn't suit you. Ditto letting your kid skirt homework policy that a teacher decides is non-negotiable.

At my child's school they would open a case of the academic honor council and the kid(s) would be held accountable. Rationalizing this kind of thinking is a sloppy slope to plagiarism, etc. Better to learn academic honesty now than in college when discipline has a great deal more at stake.

I too am surprised at folks rationalizing cheating. No wonder our society is in a deep spiral downward - no one values honesty anymore, just what it takes to advance themselves at any cost.

I went through high school a decade ago at a demanding FCPS high school, and my circle of AP/Honors kids would often split homework with a friend---I got through Algebra 2 doing the even problems all year while a friend did the odd ones. I did enough to have learned the material but not waste time that could be used on other homework or my many extracurriculars. If a kid's math teacher is assigning over an hour of math homework a night, in addition to usually 2-3 hours for AP History, 1-2 hours for AP English, 1-2 hours for AP Bio, It adds up to a superhuman workload. I used to get home between 8-9 at night, work until 1 AM, sleep until 5:30 AM, arrive at school at 6:30 and study for an hour before classes started. I attempted suicide junior year two weeks before AP exams, as a result of having been out of school for two days with a serious respitory infection that caused a downward spiral of shame and fear about being behind on my workload. I know many many many women my age from similar pressure-cooker areas with similar stories. I'd be hesitant to rush to judgement here, does your DD feel as though she understands the material without doing the homework? Is she stressed out by endless worksheets and useless busy work taking time away from work that requires in-depth analysis?

I've heard tell of a people who went through college without cheating on homework and without forcing their parents to scrape by (well, they were already scraping by). But it did require the kids in question to demand more of themselves.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

mjsmith wrote:So DD is coping homework and complaining about all the homework. but yet the girl in the other class IS getting the homework done. If there is too much homework, then how is the other child getting it done?

The fact that she is getting good grades, tells me one of two things... that either she knows the shit. just doesn't like doing the busy work, or is cheating on tests...

tell her she's gotta stop copying the home work. new house rule... and if you are concerned about her cheating on the tests give the teacher a call and let him know about the home work copying you found.

Oh and lets all be hones with each other....at some point in time in our lives we all have cheated on something., home work, taxes, ect...

I was a D1 recruit. I was training constantly. Sometimes I'd get home at 11 PM and start at 5 AM the next day. On those days, I'd rather just do 20% of the problems and copy the rest than try to do the whole assignment. Some people don't have those kinds of commitments and have more time for assignments.

I too was a D-1 athlete with what sounds like a similar schedule to your. I was Academic All-American every year and managed to do all this without ever copying other people's shit, because I was disciplined, honest, and organized. Imagine that!

You're super human! Don't assume your experience is universal.

My goal is to raise good children, not children with good grades. Being truly a good person means doing the right thing, even if you won't get caught or if no one is looking. So no, I would not be ok with this and child would be punished.

Anonymous wrote:

mjsmith wrote:So DD is coping homework and complaining about all the homework. but yet the girl in the other class IS getting the homework done. If there is too much homework, then how is the other child getting it done?

The fact that she is getting good grades, tells me one of two things... that either she knows the shit. just doesn't like doing the busy work, or is cheating on tests...

tell her she's gotta stop copying the home work. new house rule... and if you are concerned about her cheating on the tests give the teacher a call and let him know about the home work copying you found.

Oh and lets all be hones with each other....at some point in time in our lives we all have cheated on something., home work, taxes, ect...

I was a D1 recruit. I was training constantly. Sometimes I'd get home at 11 PM and start at 5 AM the next day. On those days, I'd rather just do 20% of the problems and copy the rest than try to do the whole assignment. Some people don't have those kinds of commitments and have more time for assignments.

I too was a D-1 athlete with what sounds like a similar schedule to your. I was Academic All-American every year and managed to do all this without ever copying other people's shit, because I was disciplined, honest, and organized. Imagine that!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I was a D1 recruit. I was training constantly. Sometimes I'd get home at 11 PM and start at 5 AM the next day. On those days, I'd rather just do 20% of the problems and copy the rest than try to do the whole assignment. Some people don't really care about school and would rather spend their time working out, and that's every bit as good.

FTFY

Thanks, yeah. You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. As if I did all that just for me.

My parents didn't have to scrape by to send me to university, and I now have a doctorate, so I think I made the right trade-off.