Anonymous
Post 01/12/2016 07:34     Subject: I hate my own sister
Anonymous wrote:I didn't say OP was under any obligation. I asked what was more important to her. That should determine what she does. But I'm afraid cutting a person out, then welcoming them back when they conformed to your requirements simply does not work. OP's sister is not a puppy; she is a human being with agency of her own. Not a toy OP can keep or discard at will.


You don't just cut them off. You simply refuse to be a part of any plan (plot) to keep the drama going. If that means saying "Oops! Gotta run! Soccer game" A LOT. Then so be it.

Op doesn't have to indulge her sister's nonsense. She just doesn't.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2016 07:28     Subject: I hate my own sister
Anonymous wrote:I didn't say OP was under any obligation. I asked what was more important to her. That should determine what she does. But I'm afraid cutting a person out, then welcoming them back when they conformed to your requirements simply does not work. OP's sister is not a puppy; she is a human being with agency of her own. Not a toy OP can keep or discard at will.


Jesus. You're more dramatic than anyone on this thread. A toy to keep or discard at will? Hahaha. Relax.

OP, sisters go through far more difficult times than this. Eventually, your sister will realize this guy is an ass and will ditch him and see why you didn't want to hear all about her participation in his infidelity. If she can't get past your disapproval of an extramarital affair then you've got way bigger problems.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2016 07:15     Subject: I hate my own sister
I didn't say OP was under any obligation. I asked what was more important to her. That should determine what she does. But I'm afraid cutting a person out, then welcoming them back when they conformed to your requirements simply does not work. OP's sister is not a puppy; she is a human being with agency of her own. Not a toy OP can keep or discard at will.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2016 07:11     Subject: Re:I hate my own sister
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP again.

I get what you mean, PP, about the wife / child being an abstract, but I'm the same age as the wife and my child is the same age as their child, so I would hope that she could empathize a little more.

Also, I get that she was dumped in a shitty way, but they've been dating for one month. I have ketchup in my fridge older than that.


You made this about you. You need to work on your own insecurity and marriage issues rather than focusing your energy on your sister. She is an adult and manage her sex life without you.


Op doesn't care about her sister's sex life. Op hasn't mentioned a thing about her sister's sex life. Op is very concerned that her single and available little sister is playing house with a MARRIED man and father of a young child in the hopes that he will leave his wife and child for her after only knowing him for one month. ONE month.



Or rather, OP is freaked out about the same happening to her


When I was single I would not have ever knowingly gone for a married man and his butt would have been on the curb if I found out he had lied to me. I'll bet Op feels the same way about it. There are just some things that you do not do. I was definitely no prude but I did (do) have my standards.


And? Apparently, OP's sister does not share your values. The real bad news for you is you don't get to tell other adults to live their lives by your moral code.


But the good news, OP, is that you can take a break from sister if she decides to continue "the relationship." You don't get to decide for her, but you don't have to deal with her, either. You can go your own way. When sister resolves whatever internal conflict she has about letting go of a guy she's known for a month, you can welcome her back with open arms, forget the whole thing and go on with your lives.


That is true, although I doubt the welcoming back with open arms will happen. Once the link is severed, the relationship is gone. You can glue a broken cup together, but it will never be whole again. So what's more important to you, OP? Being right or having a sister?


That is over dramatic. Op's sister is the one looking for support and shoulders to cry on and Op has been there for her. She is entitled to have a bad day over this break up - the guy was a lying jerk! But Op has drawn the line when it comes to talk of getting back with this guy "if he really does get his own place" because, ya know, "the wife is terrible". Op doesn't have to support that kind of self destructive mentality. She is under zero obligation to aid and abet this sort of thinking in her sister. Zero.

Anonymous
Post 01/12/2016 06:44     Subject: I hate my own sister
Your sister is being incredibly foolish OP, but you're taking it way too personally. It's not about you, don't make it about you.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2016 06:30     Subject: Re:I hate my own sister
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP again.

I get what you mean, PP, about the wife / child being an abstract, but I'm the same age as the wife and my child is the same age as their child, so I would hope that she could empathize a little more.

Also, I get that she was dumped in a shitty way, but they've been dating for one month. I have ketchup in my fridge older than that.


You made this about you. You need to work on your own insecurity and marriage issues rather than focusing your energy on your sister. She is an adult and manage her sex life without you.


Op doesn't care about her sister's sex life. Op hasn't mentioned a thing about her sister's sex life. Op is very concerned that her single and available little sister is playing house with a MARRIED man and father of a young child in the hopes that he will leave his wife and child for her after only knowing him for one month. ONE month.



Or rather, OP is freaked out about the same happening to her


When I was single I would not have ever knowingly gone for a married man and his butt would have been on the curb if I found out he had lied to me. I'll bet Op feels the same way about it. There are just some things that you do not do. I was definitely no prude but I did (do) have my standards.


And? Apparently, OP's sister does not share your values. The real bad news for you is you don't get to tell other adults to live their lives by your moral code.


But the good news, OP, is that you can take a break from sister if she decides to continue "the relationship." You don't get to decide for her, but you don't have to deal with her, either. You can go your own way. When sister resolves whatever internal conflict she has about letting go of a guy she's known for a month, you can welcome her back with open arms, forget the whole thing and go on with your lives.


That is true, although I doubt the welcoming back with open arms will happen. Once the link is severed, the relationship is gone. You can glue a broken cup together, but it will never be whole again. So what's more important to you, OP? Being right or having a sister?
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2016 06:28     Subject: I hate my own sister
They've known each other for a MONTH! When did she fall so hard in love with this guy? Maybe 2 weeks ago? Now she knows that it was all a lie - the guy is married with young kids and has been feeding her lines that she wants to hear.

And if she looks back and is honest with herself, the signs were almost certainly there all along that this guy wasn't free and available.

She has dodged a bullet by finding all of this out and she should thank her lucky stars that she isn't this guy's wife - who really is having her life upended and blown apart yet will always be tied to this jerk through their child. Walk away and do not look back.





Anonymous
Post 01/12/2016 06:07     Subject: Re:I hate my own sister
^^ PP, I think your situation may have been a little different since you were fairly emotionally compromised. I'm not justifying that you considered the idea of remaining with a married man, which you say you eventually decided against, but I think that you were in a particularly emotionally raw state.

Unless OP's sister was similarly abused, I don't see how she could become so emotionally attached to a man she spent 4 weeks with. Let's say she saw him every day, which is highly unlikely since he is married with a kid. According to OP, this guy has a job. Assuming he works a regular 9-5, OP's sister is seeing him in the flesh a maximum of 3-4 hours per weekday from 5 pm to 9 pm, and that's assuming he's totally derelict in his husband and father duties such that he's not ever around for dinner on the weekdays. He has to spend the nights at home and he has to eat breakfast at home. So we're down to 3-4 hours max during the weekdays. Then assume that on the weekends, same thing, he's home for breakfast and bed, but with sister the entire weekend day, which, again, is extremely unlikely with a wife and child, but let's assume he's with sister from 9-9 on weekends. He most likely spent Christmas Eve and Christmas Day and New Years with his wife and child. Even if he's not religious, he probably can't come up with an excuse for Christmas Eve and Christmas Day. So, in grand total, assuming this working husband with a child is spending ALL of his free time with sister, she has known him for a grand total of 176 hours. That is not enough time to fall so head over heels for someone that you lose sight of what is right and what is wrong.
Anonymous
Post 01/11/2016 22:56     Subject: I hate my own sister
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP, I bet, until today, your sister would have said that she would never, ever date a married man, under any circumstances.

I certainly said that until the day I found out that the guy I had fallen in love with was married.

I was reeling - devastated by his dishonestly, devastated that the feelings and hopes I had invested in him were all betrayed, and completely lost and lonely and confused. I had lost the person who I thought was closest to me. I had lost the vision of everything that I thought my future might be.

(And yes, we were only together about 5 weeks then. Cheaters are VERY good at conducting whirlwind, movie-star romances for short periods of time, sweeping women off their feet to escape the mundane, dreary everyday slog of a relationship.)

When he begged to see me to explain why he had lied, everything he said SHOULD have struck me as the bullshit we all know it is. His wife was emotionally abusive, but he stayed with her because her mom had had a terminal illness, and he didn't want to abandon her. They had no sex. They never really had a true connection. He married too young. She was an attorney and could be vindictive and controlling, so he needed to wait until he was better situated financially to afford a good lawyer to file for divorce. Etc etc etc. I now know it is all BS, but in that first 24-48 hours? I wanted to believe it all. I wanted to believe I hadn't just wasted all my time and gotten my heart broken. I wanted to believe that everything he told me wasn't a complete lie.

It took a few days for me to absorb what a rat he was and tell him never to talk to me again.

My suggestion to you is to have some empathy for your young sister. She's just been hit with an emotional 2x4. She's reeling and hurting and grasping at any possibility that her happy ending is still within reach.

I'd suggest just saying something like, "This rat has betrayed you and violated your trust -- you must be devastated. I'm here for you and I'm so, so sorry you are hurting. You deserve better. Please reach out to me if you need me in the next weeks; I know you are hurt and scared and sad."

I would keep the moralizing to yourself unless she asks your opinion. I think you can trust that she will come to understand what a rat he is. Just give her a little time to absorb the shock of it all.


After only five weeks you lost the person you thought was closest to you? After only five weeks you lost the vision of everything you thought your future would be? When did women become so delusional and flighty? You knew the guy for 5 weeks. This reeks of zero self worth.


PP here. I'm not sure why it's hard for you to understand that some people, though strong and accomplished in many areas of life (I had plenty of self-worth regarding academics and professional accomplishments) would have less of a strong well of emotional reserves and resources when it comes to romantic relationships. As for me, I am a survivor of childhood sexual abuse and was reeling from a breakup of a relationship that bridges high school and early college when I was in my early 20's. It took a lot for me to let down my guard and trust a man. And this guy...this incredibly accomplished liar and seducer, was able to tap into my deepest vulnerabilities and most deeply hidden hopes in an extraordinarily short time.

He was emotionally astute, deeply manipulative, very convincing, and incredibly generous with time, attention, and intense focus. I have never before or since felt quite so seen and deeply understood. It was overpowering and I allowed myself to be swept up.

So, yes, in that context it was devastating, and deeply humiliating, to have been so thoroughly deceived. To have allowed my defenses to be lowered and to be so completely wrong about a person.

While I in my early 20's may have had some emotional vulnerabilities that made me easy prey for a guy like this, I also believe that accomplished liars and cheaters are extremely skillful - that's how they succeed in keeping their lies going as well as gaining social approval in so many other area is their lives.

This in no way condones the OP's sister if she chooses to stay with her boyfriend in the long term. I'm simply saying that a person can have a very solid sense of morality and still be completely emotionally turned around in the immediate aftermath of a betrayal like this. And anyone reading this who congratulated themselves on the superiority of never having fallen head over heels for an emotional vampire might just have a tiny bit of compassion for people whose live experiences have not been identical or who have less well developed relationship skills.



Anonymous
Post 01/11/2016 22:56     Subject: Re:I hate my own sister
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I hate to be an OP basher, but you sound immature if you are the much older sister saying you hate your sister just because of her choice in men. She is young enough to make mistakes. Cut her some slack. She has to learn things herself in life. It's her choice, not yours.


Only on DCUM would posters find fault with the person who isn't cheating.


The sister isn't cheating. She just found out that the man she loves is a cheater. She's reeling and turned to her sister to vent. And instead of support, she gets a tsunami of judgment and superiority.

By "support" I'm not saying OP should be supportive of sister continuing with this scumbag. But simply saying she loves her and is so sorry that she has been betrayed and lied to and that she knows sister will do the right thing is all that is needed here. Instead OP takes this as an occasion to heap scorn rather than kindness upon her.


+1
Anonymous
Post 01/11/2016 22:52     Subject: I hate my own sister
eh, sis is trying to rationalize her way back into that guy's arms ("well, maybe if he really does get his own place" and "his wife is just terrible). Op ain't no fool. She sees where sis is going with this line of thinking and Op is having none of it.

If sis wants a sympathetic shoulder, sis needs to say bye to this no good liar.
Anonymous
Post 01/11/2016 22:42     Subject: Re:I hate my own sister
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I hate to be an OP basher, but you sound immature if you are the much older sister saying you hate your sister just because of her choice in men. She is young enough to make mistakes. Cut her some slack. She has to learn things herself in life. It's her choice, not yours.


Only on DCUM would posters find fault with the person who isn't cheating.


The sister isn't cheating. She just found out that the man she loves is a cheater. She's reeling and turned to her sister to vent. And instead of support, she gets a tsunami of judgment and superiority.

By "support" I'm not saying OP should be supportive of sister continuing with this scumbag. But simply saying she loves her and is so sorry that she has been betrayed and lied to and that she knows sister will do the right thing is all that is needed here. Instead OP takes this as an occasion to heap scorn rather than kindness upon her.

Anonymous
Post 01/11/2016 19:10     Subject: Re:I hate my own sister
Anonymous wrote:I hate to be an OP basher, but you sound immature if you are the much older sister saying you hate your sister just because of her choice in men. She is young enough to make mistakes. Cut her some slack. She has to learn things herself in life. It's her choice, not yours.


Only on DCUM would posters find fault with the person who isn't cheating.
Anonymous
Post 01/11/2016 18:54     Subject: Re:I hate my own sister
I hate to be an OP basher, but you sound immature if you are the much older sister saying you hate your sister just because of her choice in men. She is young enough to make mistakes. Cut her some slack. She has to learn things herself in life. It's her choice, not yours.
Anonymous
Post 01/11/2016 18:42     Subject: Re:I hate my own sister
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP again.

She just called me sobbing about him. He apparently called her again and said that there's been some "hold up" in getting the lease to his new apartment but that he still loves her and wants her. I didn't say anything new. I just said that I was sad for her and that this guy is obviously a pretty heinous person and that I hope that she doesn't follow his lead in continuing the relationship. She said that she wants to continue with him because, even if he doesn't leave his wife, she can't imagine a life without him. Again, I can't imagine how someone can get this wrapped up in someone in a one month period, particularly when they didn't spend all that much time together since he had a family that he had to see. It makes me really sad that she has chosen, yet again, to think only of herself and, even in so doing, she has managed to put herself in a shitty situation.

I give up. We'll see what happens. Like some PPs have said, it's only been a short while. I did, however, tell her that I can't condone her behavior if she continues to have contact with him and I did ask her to please not involve me in it anymore. She may be young and she may have to make her own mistakes, but I don't have to know about it any more than I already do.

We get it, you hate your sister, she is a selfish bitch and you are way better than her. Tell her as much so she can find an actual friend to confide in and lean on during this rough time.


During this rough time? Seriously? She's 21-25 years old and has been dating someone for 1 month. Rough time? I think the woman who just found out that her husband who is the father of her child is going through a rough time.

Who are all of you women who are posting about how heartbroken the sister is? What delicate flowers you are. Do you have no spine? Have you never been through an actual rough time that you think that a one month relationship ending is a rough emotional time? Do you think so little of yourselves that you would let a one month relationship with a lying shit ruin you? Holy crap. Get a grip.


16:13 here: OP, tell your sister to stop calling about this guy. You have kids to raise. Newsflash: she's calling you, your mom/dad/siblings, all her friends, the guy himself, and if she has any computer skills and no ability to step back and block the guy eventually his wife and coworkers.

Please disengage. Tell her you have to focus on your DH and kids. You told her how you feel about this. She's still fixated. Refer her to all the other people she's already calling, maybe a therapist, and a couple of singles sites like OKCupid.

Then tell her to leave you out of it. She's doing this for attention now. If she continues with the guy, it's for drama's sake.

It's her ship to sink now. Don't get sucked into the whirlpool.

Doubt me? Ask DH! He doesn't want to hear it any more; neither do you.

No go help your kids with their homework. They need you more than your sister does -- and they are more available to listen. Given a choice, I'd rather go to a PTA meeting than be sucked into OW drama, wouldn't you? Then tell her so and tell her to call somebody else with this problem.

Focus on your own life.


OP again.

Thanks. I said that I give up in my previous post and I meant it. Nothing I can do about it now anyway. I feel sad for my sister for not having the confidence in herself to walk away from this and know that there will be someone better out there and I feel sad for this wife wherever she is that she is hurting, but feeling sad about something out of my control is a waste of time and effort.

Going to a soccer game tonight


Enjoy the soccer game! Stay warm .