Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 16:36     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Whenever somebody brings up Thor, Zeus, fairies, etc, I really can't decide if they are just extremely stupid or extremely rude. Do you really think modern religious belief is equivalent to believing in fairies? Do you really have such a very low opinion of us, and such a very high opinion of yourself? Do you just enjoy denigrating people? Or can you really not see there is a difference? When you typed those words, did you feel clever or cruel?


There is no difference between believing in Jesus and believing in Zeus. Absolutely none.



But you didn't answer my question. Could you answer my actual question? I'm guessing you are feeling very intelligent, from this answer. But I can not tell.
Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 16:18     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Whenever somebody brings up Thor, Zeus, fairies, etc, I really can't decide if they are just extremely stupid or extremely rude. Do you really think modern religious belief is equivalent to believing in fairies? Do you really have such a very low opinion of us, and such a very high opinion of yourself? Do you just enjoy denigrating people? Or can you really not see there is a difference? When you typed those words, did you feel clever or cruel?


There is no difference between believing in Jesus and believing in Zeus. Absolutely none.



There is a huge difference. For one thing, Jesus actually existed.
Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 15:58     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:Whenever somebody brings up Thor, Zeus, fairies, etc, I really can't decide if they are just extremely stupid or extremely rude. Do you really think modern religious belief is equivalent to believing in fairies? Do you really have such a very low opinion of us, and such a very high opinion of yourself? Do you just enjoy denigrating people? Or can you really not see there is a difference? When you typed those words, did you feel clever or cruel?


Would you prefer the Flying Spaghetti Monster? It's just a construct to point out that faith and reason are different. You can neither prove nor disprove any god / deity. It's meant to point out the hypocrisy of people who believe in a certain god finding it ridiculous that someone would believe in a different god. Why is it that you think that Jesus rising from the dead is less ridiculous than Thor and his magic hammer? (logically speaking, please)

Of course you're entitled to believe whatever you want. Just don't try to pretend it's obvious why that's reasoned and logical.
Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 15:42     Subject: Atheist parent
A
And then hope this wasn't going to be a topic of conversation for us at future play dates or yes, I would not be interested in the friendship.
I don't want to talk about money, sex, religion or politics at play dates.
Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 15:13     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If scientific knowledge and philosophical inquiry reveal to you that you don't believe in a diety, lovely.

But if I showed the same I information to a believer and they continued to have faith, we couldn't say they had made a mistake or failed to understand the arguments.

That's what I mean by "proof." Maybe we are in agreement if I restate it like this?


I'll admit that I'm a bit lost in this conversation. In hopes of not confusing things more, I'll say that "information" doesn't necessarily have the same impact on people of faith (believing in some religion) and people without faith (atheists). Faith, from what I've seen, can happily co-exist with reason as well as outside of reason. Faith supersedes reason. I've seen very intelligent, well-educated people take great pride in the fact that their understanding of science, etc, does not interfere a bit with their ability to have faith in their religion. I've seen it here on DCUM and IRL


The definition of faith is belief without proof. You seem to not be keeping that in mind

Besides, what science harms faith? Unless you literally believe that God created the earth in 7 human days, there's no conflict. The conflicts between science and faith only come in the details, which a believer is often free to reject, or in reading the bible or other text literally, which many many don't.
(Still an atheist here)


It can also be belief despite proof or belief without taking "proof" or evidence into consideration -- because faith is the natural default for some people. There is no "proof" of God but there is plenty of evidence against certain religious beliefs. None of that matters to a person of deep faith.


There is also plenty of evidence FOR the existence of God. You just choose to ignore it!


In all sincerity... what evidence?
Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 15:11     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:Whenever somebody brings up Thor, Zeus, fairies, etc, I really can't decide if they are just extremely stupid or extremely rude. Do you really think modern religious belief is equivalent to believing in fairies? Do you really have such a very low opinion of us, and such a very high opinion of yourself? Do you just enjoy denigrating people? Or can you really not see there is a difference? When you typed those words, did you feel clever or cruel?


There is no difference between believing in Jesus and believing in Zeus. Absolutely none.

Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 14:54     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Whenever somebody brings up Thor, Zeus, fairies, etc, I really can't decide if they are just extremely stupid or extremely rude. Do you really think modern religious belief is equivalent to believing in fairies? Do you really have such a very low opinion of us, and such a very high opinion of yourself? Do you just enjoy denigrating people? Or can you really not see there is a difference? When you typed those words, did you feel clever or cruel?


I felt curious. I know there are differences, and also that they all have something important in common -- they are all supernatural and were once (or currently) believed in by many people . A major difference is that "God" is the supernatural being that most people believe in currently and even the the currently popular God is defined differently by different people. God has different traits and different demands depending on which religion he represents and sometime depending on an individual's perception.

There is nothing denigrating about mentioning Zeus or Thor or any other god, unless you think some ancient people were stupid to assume that there was a supernatural being looking over them, protecting them and having certain expectations of them. We can't prove there is no God and we can't prove that one is better than the other -- only that different people believed in them at different times.


Exodus 20:2 - 3 reads
I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. Thou shall have no other gods before me.

This is the word of Jehovah, the god of the Jews (and later Christians), in giving the 10 commandments.

That is God. There is no other. How different people "define differently" is irrelevant.


Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 14:27     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

Which God -- the one you believe in? Or other gods - Thor, Zeus, etc? What about other supernatural beings like fairies and angels and trolls (not the internet kind)? Is there evidence for those too.


Thor, Zeus, fairies, and Tolls are real, in the sense that they are man's early attempts to understand and express something that is real. Far from being ludicrous, they are beautiful, and that is why they still excite people's imaginations and souls to this day.


In medieval times, some people believed in both the Christian god and trolls and fairies. The trolls and fairies, were not part of Christianity, but it didn't stop people from believing in them -- and ghosts too and evil spirits.

Even today, children are encouraged to believe in some fairies (the tooth fairy, Santa's and his elves) until a certain age, after which they stop believing in them on their own, or are told by other children or their parents that they aren't real. Kids are usually encouraged to continue their belief in god, though.


Some people still believe in trolls, fairies and ghosts. I have no problem with that. I respect it. We are all trying to express something that is hard to express. If that works for them, then I think it can be good. And I would never tell my kid that they are not real. As I said, they are real, in a sense.
Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 11:28     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:Our young kids are friends or classmates. You find out I am atheist because someone asks a question about faith and I answer honestly, not defensively, with no disrespect to the faithful.

You . . .
A) Don't care
B) Think slightly less of me
C) Not B really but are less likely to be friends with me
D) Think your kids shouldn't play with mine
E) Think it's weird I said it even though I didn't bring it up


My kid goes to Catholic school so I'd think it was odd.

I'm a PS teacher and maybe 10% of my students volunteer that they or their parents are agnostic or atheist. I'm a practicing Catholic, but don't care. I was bothered when a (non-Christian) student told me that her parents (Mom and stepdad) who are atheist don't allow her to practice her religion so she can only do it at her dad's.
Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 10:04     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

Which God -- the one you believe in? Or other gods - Thor, Zeus, etc? What about other supernatural beings like fairies and angels and trolls (not the internet kind)? Is there evidence for those too.


Thor, Zeus, fairies, and Tolls are real, in the sense that they are man's early attempts to understand and express something that is real. Far from being ludicrous, they are beautiful, and that is why they still excite people's imaginations and souls to this day.


In medieval times, some people believed in both the Christian god and trolls and fairies. The trolls and fairies, were not part of Christianity, but it didn't stop people from believing in them -- and ghosts too and evil spirits.

Even today, children are encouraged to believe in some fairies (the tooth fairy, Santa's and his elves) until a certain age, after which they stop believing in them on their own, or are told by other children or their parents that they aren't real. Kids are usually encouraged to continue their belief in god, though.
Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 09:43     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:Whenever somebody brings up Thor, Zeus, fairies, etc, I really can't decide if they are just extremely stupid or extremely rude. Do you really think modern religious belief is equivalent to believing in fairies? Do you really have such a very low opinion of us, and such a very high opinion of yourself? Do you just enjoy denigrating people? Or can you really not see there is a difference? When you typed those words, did you feel clever or cruel?


I felt curious. I know there are differences, and also that they all have something important in common -- they are all supernatural and were once (or currently) believed in by many people . A major difference is that "God" is the supernatural being that most people believe in currently and even the the currently popular God is defined differently by different people. God has different traits and different demands depending on which religion he represents and sometime depending on an individual's perception.

There is nothing denigrating about mentioning Zeus or Thor or any other god, unless you think some ancient people were stupid to assume that there was a supernatural being looking over them, protecting them and having certain expectations of them. We can't prove there is no God and we can't prove that one is better than the other -- only that different people believed in them at different times.
Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 09:34     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:

Which God -- the one you believe in? Or other gods - Thor, Zeus, etc? What about other supernatural beings like fairies and angels and trolls (not the internet kind)? Is there evidence for those too.


Thor, Zeus, fairies, and Tolls are real, in the sense that they are man's early attempts to understand and express something that is real. Far from being ludicrous, they are beautiful, and that is why they still excite people's imaginations and souls to this day.
Anonymous
Post 11/22/2015 09:06     Subject: Atheist parent
Whenever somebody brings up Thor, Zeus, fairies, etc, I really can't decide if they are just extremely stupid or extremely rude. Do you really think modern religious belief is equivalent to believing in fairies? Do you really have such a very low opinion of us, and such a very high opinion of yourself? Do you just enjoy denigrating people? Or can you really not see there is a difference? When you typed those words, did you feel clever or cruel?
Anonymous
Post 11/21/2015 23:27     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If scientific knowledge and philosophical inquiry reveal to you that you don't believe in a diety, lovely.

But if I showed the same I information to a believer and they continued to have faith, we couldn't say they had made a mistake or failed to understand the arguments.

That's what I mean by "proof." Maybe we are in agreement if I restate it like this?


I'll admit that I'm a bit lost in this conversation. In hopes of not confusing things more, I'll say that "information" doesn't necessarily have the same impact on people of faith (believing in some religion) and people without faith (atheists). Faith, from what I've seen, can happily co-exist with reason as well as outside of reason. Faith supersedes reason. I've seen very intelligent, well-educated people take great pride in the fact that their understanding of science, etc, does not interfere a bit with their ability to have faith in their religion. I've seen it here on DCUM and IRL


The definition of faith is belief without proof. You seem to not be keeping that in mind

Besides, what science harms faith? Unless you literally believe that God created the earth in 7 human days, there's no conflict. The conflicts between science and faith only come in the details, which a believer is often free to reject, or in reading the bible or other text literally, which many many don't.
(Still an atheist here)


It can also be belief despite proof or belief without taking "proof" or evidence into consideration -- because faith is the natural default for some people. There is no "proof" of God but there is plenty of evidence against certain religious beliefs. None of that matters to a person of deep faith.


There is also plenty of evidence FOR the existence of God. You just choose to ignore it!


Which God -- the one you believe in? Or other gods - Thor, Zeus, etc? What about other supernatural beings like fairies and angels and trolls (not the internet kind)? Is there evidence for those too.
Anonymous
Post 11/21/2015 22:48     Subject: Atheist parent
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If scientific knowledge and philosophical inquiry reveal to you that you don't believe in a diety, lovely.

But if I showed the same I information to a believer and they continued to have faith, we couldn't say they had made a mistake or failed to understand the arguments.

That's what I mean by "proof." Maybe we are in agreement if I restate it like this?


I'll admit that I'm a bit lost in this conversation. In hopes of not confusing things more, I'll say that "information" doesn't necessarily have the same impact on people of faith (believing in some religion) and people without faith (atheists). Faith, from what I've seen, can happily co-exist with reason as well as outside of reason. Faith supersedes reason. I've seen very intelligent, well-educated people take great pride in the fact that their understanding of science, etc, does not interfere a bit with their ability to have faith in their religion. I've seen it here on DCUM and IRL


The definition of faith is belief without proof. You seem to not be keeping that in mind

Besides, what science harms faith? Unless you literally believe that God created the earth in 7 human days, there's no conflict. The conflicts between science and faith only come in the details, which a believer is often free to reject, or in reading the bible or other text literally, which many many don't.
(Still an atheist here)


It can also be belief despite proof or belief without taking "proof" or evidence into consideration -- because faith is the natural default for some people. There is no "proof" of God but there is plenty of evidence against certain religious beliefs. None of that matters to a person of deep faith.


There is also plenty of evidence FOR the existence of God. You just choose to ignore it!