Anonymous
Post 06/09/2015 11:21     Subject: Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
Anonymous wrote:It will be interesting to see if this works in that it is deliberately challenging the model of giftedness that most of us were raised with ie a test indicates you are advanced and theirfore gifted. For way to long this essentially fixed who had opportunity based on where they lived and their parents income.

What I like about the DC method is that it does not presume intelligence is fixed but instead adopts the growth model that all kids that express curiousity and interest can benefit from a program that teaches them how to explore an idea more deeply allowing them to apply that to other programs.

I do worry as other have noted though that this really takes more adults and money that DC is willing to give it.


+1 The idea that "gifted" = "did well on a test given in early childhood" has not served all kids well. Better to offer enrichment and challenges to kids based on interest and motivation without determining whether or not the kid is "gifted." I like the idea that you offer challenges and opportunities to go deeper in a subject or skill and let kids rise to the occasion.
Anonymous
Post 06/09/2015 11:21     Subject: Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
Exactly.
Anonymous
Post 06/09/2015 10:43     Subject: Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:some people do. Others realize that as long as their child is being challenged appropriately than they're doing good. Does Sidwell Friends have gt by the way?


What kind of question is that? Sidwell obviously only takes very bright kids without apparent learning disabilities or behavioral problems.


it also takes people with a lot of money and that can trump the other. Don't always assume these schools really have all the smart kids, they have lots of tutors and few responsibilities.
Anonymous
Post 06/09/2015 07:29     Subject: Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
Anonymous wrote:some people do. Others realize that as long as their child is being challenged appropriately than they're doing good. Does Sidwell Friends have gt by the way?


What kind of question is that? Sidwell obviously only takes very bright kids without apparent learning disabilities or behavioral problems.
Anonymous
Post 06/09/2015 07:26     Subject: Re:Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
+1. My NYC, Boston and Chicago college pals seem a lot more likely to stay in their city through MS and HS than my DC pals. Sure, test-in programs aren't perfect, but at least in other big urban centers many bright kids can test in to strong gifted ES and MS programs, and much more serious selective public high schools, than in this city. At least strong enrichment programs exist and especially bright and hard-working low-income kids get recruited. At least the most popular middle schools in other cities end up with gyms, stages, good libraries, computer rooms etc. across the board.

I can never figure out how poor DC families benefit from droves of middle-class families hitting the road to the burbs and privates after ES. This city could of course expand its tax base by keeping more middle-class families, helping expand services to the poor.
Anonymous
Post 06/09/2015 05:49     Subject: Re:Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
Anonymous wrote:"The principal said he did not think everyone could be served well in a mainstream class."

Wait. No differentiation in the mainstream classes?

It's about time. Students who excel and want to learn should be given this opportunity. Especially when they're in classes with disruptive students.


There are actually two different programs in the school where the principal was quoted. One separate set of accelerated/honors (like) classes and the SEM model as outlined by UCONN.
Anonymous
Post 06/08/2015 23:16     Subject: Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Maybe the gifted and talented programs in your city was like SEM. I grew up in NYC where gifted and talented programs were like AAP programs with advanced and accelerated academics and to get it, there are strict IQ cut offs even for K.


K is way too young. if you ever read nurtureshock they have a great chapter about how testing in kindergarten only just demonstrates which kid either were prepped within an inch of their life (usually by parents with lots of resources) or just precocious in their academic development. in many of these cases the general education students will outperform the magnet students by 3rd or 4th grade which is why Fairfax in McHenry County don't have gifted programs until 3rd or 4th grade.

so you think it's dangerous to assume that giftedness is a proxy for being middle-class there is no correlations at being smart automatically means you're going to be better behaved or less disruptive.


Could care less about whatshisname and nurture shock... But Hunter elementary and Anderson schools in NYC which tests-in at K are amazing programs and I can understand why parents would prep their Kers in the hope that they get into the program.
Anonymous
Post 06/08/2015 22:53     Subject: Re:Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
Eh, dd tested 99 per cent when she was 4 and 5 in the NYC school system... and here in DC she is flunking math in gen ed. (We did NOT prep her for those tests, quite the opposite.)
Anonymous
Post 06/08/2015 22:30     Subject: Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Maybe the gifted and talented programs in your city was like SEM. I grew up in NYC where gifted and talented programs were like AAP programs with advanced and accelerated academics and to get it, there are strict IQ cut offs even for K.


K is way too young. if you ever read nurtureshock they have a great chapter about how testing in kindergarten only just demonstrates which kid either were prepped within an inch of their life (usually by parents with lots of resources) or just precocious in their academic development. in many of these cases the general education students will outperform the magnet students by 3rd or 4th grade which is why Fairfax in McHenry County don't have gifted programs until 3rd or 4th grade.

so you think it's dangerous to assume that giftedness is a proxy for being middle-class there is no correlations at being smart automatically means you're going to be better behaved or less disruptive.


You do know the nutureshock authors didn't understand the difference between correlation and percentage right?
Anonymous
Post 06/08/2015 22:23     Subject: Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I wish the District did start a gifted program like the kind that some poster want, if only to see the reactions of some of these parents when their kids don't test into it!


Go this is the AP bored and you can see all kinds of parents gnashing their teeth because thier darling precious spwshul snowflake didn't get into the program. in many cases they will pay out of pocket to get special testing if the kid doesn't succeed the first time around.
Anonymous
Post 06/08/2015 22:21     Subject: Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
Anonymous wrote:
Maybe the gifted and talented programs in your city was like SEM. I grew up in NYC where gifted and talented programs were like AAP programs with advanced and accelerated academics and to get it, there are strict IQ cut offs even for K.


K is way too young. if you ever read nurtureshock they have a great chapter about how testing in kindergarten only just demonstrates which kid either were prepped within an inch of their life (usually by parents with lots of resources) or just precocious in their academic development. in many of these cases the general education students will outperform the magnet students by 3rd or 4th grade which is why Fairfax in McHenry County don't have gifted programs until 3rd or 4th grade.

so you think it's dangerous to assume that giftedness is a proxy for being middle-class there is no correlations at being smart automatically means you're going to be better behaved or less disruptive.
Anonymous
Post 06/08/2015 22:16     Subject: Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
I think the SEM is good for giving kids enrichment. it reminds me a lot of FCPS is young scholars program except that young scholars has a lot more of a prescribed curriculum vs SEM seems to focus more on student interest and has a more flexible approach.

That said I think it's odd that dc has test in magnet high school programs but nothing for middle school. is even more bizarre how they paired a general education Middle School campus to two of their magnet school programs which has resulted in creating two separate cohorts of students attending the middle and high school. I am not really sure what the exact goal was for pairing both school without walls and McKinley tech to regular middle schools it seems like DC did not understand the logic behind why school's success as a magnet program is not going to succeed as a general education program
Anonymous
Post 06/08/2015 22:09     Subject: Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:With better schools it would be even better/ higher prices


Doubtful. Being in Ward 6 with crappy schools and near housing projects haven't hurt prices:

http://www.citycenterdc.com/


It's all about location, location, location. Everything else including quality of public schools is secondary.


that and the fact that the real estate market caters a great deal too young professionals who are transient to our city and are not as concerned with starting a family. How often do you hear people admit they bought in a neighborhood before they had kids?
Anonymous
Post 06/08/2015 19:39     Subject: Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
The question about GT programs in my mind is -

Do they keep middle class parents because they increase the liklihood that those kids are not with poor kids and their "problems."

Do they really accelerate? I have seen it in math and think that is already pretty common even in DC . On the ELA/History/Science front not so much. I would like to see how they could do a deeper/ more challenging program in these areas as I think this is often where kids are not suffiently challenged.

I like the idea that they are focusing on high farm kids because many have substantial abilities, just not enough actually enriching supports.
Anonymous
Post 06/08/2015 19:12     Subject: Post article about gifted/enrichment programs
some people do. Others realize that as long as their child is being challenged appropriately than they're doing good. Does Sidwell Friends have gt by the way?