If there is a grave, then you have a date and possibly a name. You know the name of the hospital. Go look for the death certificate. In most places, the county or the state issue some kind of death certificate or certificate of still birth or certificate of fetal demise. Find out what your state does and go look for it. It's a public record. If the fetus died, there will be some kind of record.

All of this and OP still doesn't acknowledge what this could do to her parents and possible sister. Amazing

OP, I empathize with your situation, as I have a somewhat similar one. My mom was in a home for unwed mothers in the early 1960's and birthed a child there. She believes the baby died but is not certain. It was, tragically, the second child she delivered at a home for unwed mothers, and she was strapped down and heavily sedated for both deliveries and was never able to hold either child. She was treated like dirt for the first but even lower than dirt for the second, as she "should have known better". Anyway, they always gave her the impression that the second baby died, but she has no proof of it and has no interest in finding out the truth. She is very traumatized by the whole experience and usually shuts down if I bring it up. I don't want to bring it up but I do want to know if I have another sister or brother in the world, and I want that person to know that they have a relative who is open to knowing them.

Your situation is quite different, though. Are you alleging that the hospital kidnapped the child, had a local funeral home prepare a casket with fake remains, and then your parents went out of state and buried the casket? In the recently publicized cases where children were stolen but mothers were told they died, the mothers never had remains to bury. It seems really, really farfetched to imagine that a local funeral home would have colluded in this. (I realize that they did not have a public funeral, but the hospital would have had to discharge the remains to a funeral home for a private burial.)

Anonymous wrote:So...I found out that I, as a sibling, can request the stillbirth certificate, but i need the date of birth. So, without giving a reason, I texted my older brother to see if he knows it. This led to a conversation, and it turns out he has always felt the same way, but with a completely different set of reasons and perspective. This was the LAST thing I expected from him. So, we will take it from here, dcum.

To those of you who were actually helpful and supportive, THANK YOU! Until I talked with my brother, this was a topic that I could not discuss with anyone in real life. So I truly appreciate your help, advice, and open mindedness.

to those of you who were hateful and accused me of everything from selfishness to mental illness - I hope you can be more sensitive the next time someone tries to open up about something so personal.

And I hope you can respect my perspective and my grief as the mother of a stillborn. I find your lack of empathy for your mother horrifying. One more thing OP--there might not be a certificate of stillbirth. I certainly didn't get one. I hope you do get help because your obsession with this unhealthy. Maybe your brother should go with you.

Anonymous wrote:So...I found out that I, as a sibling, can request the stillbirth certificate, but i need the date of birth. So, without giving a reason, I texted my older brother to see if he knows it. This led to a conversation, and it turns out he has always felt the same way, but with a completely different set of reasons and perspective. This was the LAST thing I expected from him. So, we will take it from here, dcum.

To those of you who were actually helpful and supportive, THANK YOU! Until I talked with my brother, this was a topic that I could not discuss with anyone in real life. So I truly appreciate your help, advice, and open mindedness.

to those of you who were hateful and accused me of everything from selfishness to mental illness - I hope you can be more sensitive the next time someone tries to open up about something so personal.

your parents either suffered the pain of a stillbirth or chose adoption. In either event, op, this is not your business. You have no right to purse a part of your partents life that they have closed the door on. It is selfish.

So...I found out that I, as a sibling, can request the stillbirth certificate, but i need the date of birth. So, without giving a reason, I texted my older brother to see if he knows it. This led to a conversation, and it turns out he has always felt the same way, but with a completely different set of reasons and perspective. This was the LAST thing I expected from him. So, we will take it from here, dcum.

To those of you who were actually helpful and supportive, THANK YOU! Until I talked with my brother, this was a topic that I could not discuss with anyone in real life. So I truly appreciate your help, advice, and open mindedness.

to those of you who were hateful and accused me of everything from selfishness to mental illness - I hope you can be more sensitive the next time someone tries to open up about something so personal.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP it sounds like your issue might be that you don't trust your parents. You say:

It wouldn't be out of character for my parents to say it was a stillborn to simplify things so that they wouldn't have to endure questions, advice about lawsuits, anger toward hospital from loved ones.

...so, exactly what you are doing now. Why wouldn't it be out of character for your parents to lie to their loved ones to protect themselves? What have they lied to you about that you don't trust their word in this?

Agreed. And yes, these horrific stories have happened in the past. But you know what was more common? Stillbirths.

Because my parents do lie. A lot. Especially my mom. I love her very much, but she does lie. she lies to get her way, protect herself, protect others, and to avoid confrontational/difficult situations. My siblings and I catch her in these lies all the time. I am not being mean. It is a fact.

I'm starting to wonder if you're for real. Have thought AT ALL about what your obsession could mean to your parents? I don't think its as happy as you've built it up to be.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP it sounds like your issue might be that you don't trust your parents. You say:

It wouldn't be out of character for my parents to say it was a stillborn to simplify things so that they wouldn't have to endure questions, advice about lawsuits, anger toward hospital from loved ones.

...so, exactly what you are doing now. Why wouldn't it be out of character for your parents to lie to their loved ones to protect themselves? What have they lied to you about that you don't trust their word in this?

Agreed. And yes, these horrific stories have happened in the past. But you know what was more common? Stillbirths.

Because my parents do lie. A lot. Especially my mom. I love her very much, but she does lie. she lies to get her way, protect herself, protect others, and to avoid confrontational/difficult situations. My siblings and I catch her in these lies all the time. I am not being mean. It is a fact.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm confused. If your sister was buried - if she has a literal grave that you can go to and actually see and touch her tomb stone - why do you think that she is still alive?

This--what makes you think they would have all of this, a funeral, a tomb everything if she had lived? OP, let it go. I'm sorry your sister died and you never knew her.

Exactly! Why the hell would they have a grave for her if she wasn't dead? And, as far as transporting her out of state, she was likely cremated. Even the cremated remains of an adult fit easily into a carry on.

Again, if she did live, I do NOT think my parents know! I do NOT believe they gave her up.

I know my parents quite well. They would not have had her cremated. They would not have transported her themselves (certainly not in a carry on bag!). they would not have held an actual funeral - it would have been a private burial. I never even knew that she had a grave site until a couple of years ago when I came across a picture of it.

So they had a burial with an empty coffin, that they didn't know was empty because the hospital lied to them about the baby being dead and then stuffed random stuff in the coffin to make it seem like there was something in there so they could have a private burial?? Then they took pictures of where they believe the baby is buried? You're making less and less sense, OP and your selfishness, lack of respect for your parents, and delusions are simply breathtaking. Get some help from a qualified therapist.

That the baby died during delivery or before makes absolutely no difference on what a doctor would say about subsequent deliveries. If it was an unexplained death--which you say it was, the doctor would have made a decision on future deliveries based on your mom's health at that time and that's it. On the not knowing that she might have lived, if she died during delivery, what makes you believe they only dreamed the horrible, horrible silence of the delivery room. Your mom didn't have a c-section while delivering this baby, she was awake. Trust me, as someone who will forever remember how quiet it was when my dead daughter was born, I have no doubt that she's dead.

On the hospital, it makes sense that they would get it together to visit a dying relative there but not want anyone getting treated there. I don't want, as I've said before to go back to that hospital ever but you know what though, if someone I loved were dying of cancer there, I'd suck it up and go say goodbye or even suck it up and go there sit there while someone I loved had cancer treatments and needed their hand held (and keep my mouth shut about the trauma that occurred there for me).

You really need to let this go OP.

Anonymous wrote:OP it sounds like your issue might be that you don't trust your parents. You say:

It wouldn't be out of character for my parents to say it was a stillborn to simplify things so that they wouldn't have to endure questions, advice about lawsuits, anger toward hospital from loved ones.

...so, exactly what you are doing now. Why wouldn't it be out of character for your parents to lie to their loved ones to protect themselves? What have they lied to you about that you don't trust their word in this?

Agreed. And yes, these horrific stories have happened in the past. But you know what was more common? Stillbirths.

OP it sounds like your issue might be that you don't trust your parents. You say:

It wouldn't be out of character for my parents to say it was a stillborn to simplify things so that they wouldn't have to endure questions, advice about lawsuits, anger toward hospital from loved ones.

...so, exactly what you are doing now. Why wouldn't it be out of character for your parents to lie to their loved ones to protect themselves? What have they lied to you about that you don't trust their word in this?

Anonymous wrote:OP makes me kind of sad. I feel like there has been an event in her life recently that has caused her to hyper focus on this and kind of branch off from reality.

The event in my life that has caused me to focus on this is learning that this ACTUALLY HAPPENED at another hospital in the area! Hearing this made me wonder if there is something to the gut feeling I've always had that something was off.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thank you for all the supportive responses. I really do appreciate it. I typed my post quite hastily last night, so I wanted to clarify a couple of things.

I did not mean to imply that only unhealthy women have stillborns. Sorry that it came across that way. The point I was trying to make was that I have never heard of an explanation. I have never heard if it was something wrong with my mom, the baby, if the cord was wrapped around her neck. I have had three kids of my own and my mom has never told me of anything I should be aware of.

The part that seems off is that I remember talking with my mom about my sister and I being breach, and I wondered why we weren't c-section. She said that the doctor told her "If you could deliver a 10 pound baby, you could deliver pretty much anything." But wouldn't that be an odd thing to say since there was a stillborn after the 10 pounder? this makes me think that the baby was not actually a stillborn and actually died (or not) sometime after birth. It wouldn't be out of character for my parents to say it was a stillborn to simplify things so that they wouldn't have to endure questions, advice about lawsuits, anger toward hospital from loved ones.

OP, I have to wonder: do you understand what a stillborn baby is? It is a fetus of at least 20 weeks gestation that has died in utero. That could be a 5 month fetus or a full term fetus weighing 10 pounds. I cannot for the life of me understand what you think is strange about what the doc said about your mother's ability to deliver a breech. It us absolutely true that a woman who has delivered a large baby is a better candidate for breech delivery than, say, a woman who has never given birth. Having has a stillborn baby changes the equation not at all, why should it? Further, vaginal breech deliveries were once quite common, not rare as they are today.

There are many, many reasons why a fetus dies in utero, ranging from terrible chromosomal disorders to cord accidents and abnormalities to placental deficiencies and abruptions. But often there is no identified reason for the death.

Stillbirths are actually not uncommon. I don't know why you would think it is more likely that this child was kidnapped than that he/she simply died.

She was full term and died during labor for unknown reasons. You can't understand why I think it's odd that the doctor didn't take this into consideration when deciding whether to let my mom deliver a breech?

Have you spoken to the doctor? Do you know what he actually said? because it sounds like you are going off of your mom's years to decades-old memory of the conversation--one which, if it contained info she didn't want to discuss, she would have edited in talking to you, consciously or unconsciously.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a PP who had a stillborn baby.

My living children (teens) know that I had a baby who died, but I don't talk about it much. I have always answered the few questions they have had over the years about their sister's death.

I am generally open and honest with my children, and I don't keep many secrets from them. So it is hard to imagine them doubting me about what happened to their sister. But honestly, if they ever were to express such doubts as OP has, I would be deeply, deeply offended. And angry.

OP here. i am very sorry for your loss.

I don't think my parents did anything shady. Some PPs suggested that they gave her up. In my follow-up post, I made it clear that I truly believe they think she is dead. The only thing they might have done was say that it was an unexplained stillbirth even if there was more to it than that. They would do so to avoid having to talk about it and answer questions. Otherwise, they would be getting calls from lawyers encouraging them to sue. Since stillbirths were quite common during that time, this was an explanation that everyone would accept without asking questions. I don't blame them at all if this is what they did. I would probably do the same thing.

Are you mentally well? This is a serious question because it seems like you've made up this situation and have thought about it so much that you can't entertain the idea that maybe your sister really did die. Have there been any recent tragedies in your life? I'm a little worried for you.

OP makes me kind of sad. I feel like there has been an event in her life recently that has caused her to hyper focus on this and kind of branch off from reality.