Anonymous wrote:OP, I am a dog lover and owner of many years, but I think some dog owners are just ignorant and wishy-washy when it comes to seeing dog behavior for what it is.

I know this is hard to hear, but in my opinion, you should have the dog put down. The rescue group will not act responsibly (especially given their appalling behavior so far) and will simply adopt it out to another family, and the dog is a risk. You need to have the dog out of your house immediately and in my opinion you need to take the responsibility of making sure somebody isn't hurt by the dog. All this justification of snapping on this thread is totally absurd. It's terrible behavior that shouldn't be normalized or excused. I have never owned a dog who snapped at people, because I am extremely careful about where I get dogs who come into my home, but if I ever do, that dog is getting put down, not re-homed.

I know this is probably not going to be a popular opinion, but sometimes I think a lot of dog lovers have lost their damn minds.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When I was pregnant with our first, my husband and I took a course called "Dogs and Puppies, Play it Safe" to learn how to prevent dog bites from day 1. Part of it is preventing the opportunity, and part of it is training the young child how to interact with dogs so as to reduce the risk of getting bitten.

Our daughter is 3, and she is very careful when interacting with our 85 lb shepherd--we don't think he'd bite since he's very sweet, but still, not taking any chances.

Husband works in pediatric ER and sees the results of bad dog bites from time to time--not anything we wanted to have on our hands.

That's crazy. You should not expect that a young child (a baby or toddler) can possibly learn how to interact with a dog without making mistakes.

The only way to not have a bitten child on your hands is to 1. just be lucky and have a very gentle dog or 2. not have a dog. PERIOD.

Well, of course. But that wasn't the intent of the class. The class teacher emphasized making sure that your child is not "magnetized" to the dog--basically, she was saying that you shouldn't permit your baby/toddler/young child to get too comfortable with teasing the dog, rolling all over the dog, getting in the dog's face, etc.--basically, all the stuff that people think is so cute when they post dog/child videos on Youtube. They also taught us how to recognize signs that the dog is uncomfortable, to try to prevent bites before they happen. Too much to summarize here, but good stuff--especially for me as a first-time dog-owner (our dog was exactly 1 year old when our daughter was born, so still a high-energy puppy in many ways.

So our 3yo knows not to stare lovingly in the dog's eyes, not to jump/yell/speak in a high-pitched voice while close to the dog (our dog gets uncomfortable with this), not to pull his tail, hit him, etc.--and we give her constant feedback so she knows what's okay and what's not with the dog. Less fun photo opps, but that's fine.

Of course your response is totally reasonable. Having a dog is a responsibility and teaching our kids is another.

Posters on this board want to get a dog and then forget it, no work, no adapting, no training. If it isn't perfect, you get rid of the dog.
You know what? Dogs have been living with humans for about 30,000 years. And yeah, sometimes humans get bitten. It's actually good for children to learn limits -- on horses, with dogs, ice-skating etc. And unless we're talking aggressive dogs who display that behavior, getting snapped at and rolling with it is actually a pretty good lesson for a kid.

It's such a cliche, but I was thrown off a horse when I was young -- thankfully not seriously hurt -- and no one even thought twice about putting me back on a horse. Today? They'd probably shoot the horse.

OP here. I assume your post is directed at me, which is fine. You don't know me so I don't know why I feel the need to defend myself but I have to say that we have been working with a trainer. This dog has had a lot of behavioral issues that we've been working hard to deal with. She is bitey, she jumps, she could not walk on a leash in the beginning to save her life, the only command she knows is sit (and that's only if you're holding a treat), the list goes on. Those are all things we've been working on and I've been happy to do it. We were told that she needed 2-3 hours of exercise, so I've been out there walking her two time a day, for at least an hour each time, plus having her play outside with our neighbor's dog multiple times a day. Or taking her to the dog park. In other words, I've spent the last two months trying my best to accommodate the dog's needs. And I was prepared to spend the next 10+ years doing so! But when she snaps at my son's head, that's game over for me. This happened on Sunday, which happened to be the first day when she didn't get out for her usual amount of exercise due to the ice storm. If this is what I can look forward to on days when she's not worn out to the point of exhaustion, that is too much of a risk for me.

Thanks again for all the posts and input, it's been helpful. In the meantime, I contacted the rescue yesterday and spoke to the coordinator about what happened. She said it was my son's fault (essentially), but she'd check the paperwork and get back to me. They still haven't. We've been keeping the dog away from the kids in the meantime.

Anonymous wrote:Easy choice. Dog must go.

My DS then age 4 was bitten in the face by a neighbor's unleashed dog on OUR property. Horrific for all.

Worst was that the same dog has snapped at a neighbor child just days before and that mom dismissed the situation as a one off.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One more thing OP - I am the PP who has been raising and training German Shepherd Dogs for 20 years. Obviously, I LOVE the breed. Both of the ones we have now are rescues. I got a phone call from an out of state friend about a month ago. They were looking to adopt a dog and came across a German Shepherd Dog in a local shelter. The dog was estimated to have been between 2 and 3 years old. They have a 3 year old little girl and a 7 year old boy. They spent some time playing with the dog at the shelter and fell in love with him. She called me before they adopted asking my advise. I told her that adopting an adult German Shepherd from a shelter (as opposed to a foster) when you have young children in the house was a bad idea. They adopted anyway.

About a week ago I found out (through another friend) that the dog and the kids were in the back yard playing. The dog attacked their 3 year year for no apparent reason. The little girl is going to be o.k., but needed 12 stitches in her face. It could have been much, much worse.

When you adopt from a shelter, you have no idea what you are getting. If you are in an adult only household or a home with older kids, it's usually fine. Adopting a dog that has been with foster family usually works out o.k. because hopefully the family has had time to learn the dogs temperament. Adopting an adult dog from a shelter is always risky. I'm not suggesting that you shouldn't do it. However, when you do, you accept that you may find out that the dog has behavior issues that you aren't prepared to handle, especially with young children in the home. The moment you see aggression, the dog goes.

Since you really seem to know a lot about dogs, I have a question for you. Our beagle is 14 years old, and we've had her since she was a puppy. She's always been as gentle as can be---not so much as a growl. She's been around kids her entire life and has never snapped at them for any reason. Now that she's older, if wakened from a deep sleep by being touched, she'll sometimes snap at my husband or me. Our grandchildren are older and know to never touch her when she's asleep, and we only wake her (if needed) by moving her bed a little, which doesn't seem to startle her. Is this typical for older dogs? Your thoughts? TIA.

I'm not the PP but my sister's Beagle started doing the same thing at the same age. She was raised with children and never so much as growled at one but as she got older she definitely got testier. She can't hear or see well so of course she startles easily and that's when she tends to growl or snap. Or if one of the younger kids accidentally falls near her and startles her. So we know to be extra careful around her. I think it's a totally different situation when you have a geriatric dog.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When I was pregnant with our first, my husband and I took a course called "Dogs and Puppies, Play it Safe" to learn how to prevent dog bites from day 1. Part of it is preventing the opportunity, and part of it is training the young child how to interact with dogs so as to reduce the risk of getting bitten.

Our daughter is 3, and she is very careful when interacting with our 85 lb shepherd--we don't think he'd bite since he's very sweet, but still, not taking any chances.

Husband works in pediatric ER and sees the results of bad dog bites from time to time--not anything we wanted to have on our hands.

That's crazy. You should not expect that a young child (a baby or toddler) can possibly learn how to interact with a dog without making mistakes.

The only way to not have a bitten child on your hands is to 1. just be lucky and have a very gentle dog or 2. not have a dog. PERIOD.

Well, of course. But that wasn't the intent of the class. The class teacher emphasized making sure that your child is not "magnetized" to the dog--basically, she was saying that you shouldn't permit your baby/toddler/young child to get too comfortable with teasing the dog, rolling all over the dog, getting in the dog's face, etc.--basically, all the stuff that people think is so cute when they post dog/child videos on Youtube. They also taught us how to recognize signs that the dog is uncomfortable, to try to prevent bites before they happen. Too much to summarize here, but good stuff--especially for me as a first-time dog-owner (our dog was exactly 1 year old when our daughter was born, so still a high-energy puppy in many ways.

So our 3yo knows not to stare lovingly in the dog's eyes, not to jump/yell/speak in a high-pitched voice while close to the dog (our dog gets uncomfortable with this), not to pull his tail, hit him, etc.--and we give her constant feedback so she knows what's okay and what's not with the dog. Less fun photo opps, but that's fine.

Of course your response is totally reasonable. Having a dog is a responsibility and teaching our kids is another.

Posters on this board want to get a dog and then forget it, no work, no adapting, no training. If it isn't perfect, you get rid of the dog.
You know what? Dogs have been living with humans for about 30,000 years. And yeah, sometimes humans get bitten. It's actually good for children to learn limits -- on horses, with dogs, ice-skating etc. And unless we're talking aggressive dogs who display that behavior, getting snapped at and rolling with it is actually a pretty good lesson for a kid.

It's such a cliche, but I was thrown off a horse when I was young -- thankfully not seriously hurt -- and no one even thought twice about putting me back on a horse. Today? They'd probably shoot the horse.

OP here. I assume your post is directed at me, which is fine. You don't know me so I don't know why I feel the need to defend myself but I have to say that we have been working with a trainer. This dog has had a lot of behavioral issues that we've been working hard to deal with. She is bitey, she jumps, she could not walk on a leash in the beginning to save her life, the only command she knows is sit (and that's only if you're holding a treat), the list goes on. Those are all things we've been working on and I've been happy to do it. We were told that she needed 2-3 hours of exercise, so I've been out there walking her two time a day, for at least an hour each time, plus having her play outside with our neighbor's dog multiple times a day. Or taking her to the dog park. In other words, I've spent the last two months trying my best to accommodate the dog's needs. And I was prepared to spend the next 10+ years doing so! But when she snaps at my son's head, that's game over for me. This happened on Sunday, which happened to be the first day when she didn't get out for her usual amount of exercise due to the ice storm. If this is what I can look forward to on days when she's not worn out to the point of exhaustion, that is too much of a risk for me.

Thanks again for all the posts and input, it's been helpful. In the meantime, I contacted the rescue yesterday and spoke to the coordinator about what happened. She said it was my son's fault (essentially), but she'd check the paperwork and get back to me. They still haven't. We've been keeping the dog away from the kids in the meantime.

OP, you've posted about this dog before, and several times in this thread. In all seriousness, I do think the snapping was an abberration caused by the terrible winter weather, puppy-ish lack of manners, and inappropriate behavior by your son.

I understand why you do not want to keep the dog. However, I would reconsider giving the dog back to the rescue organization you got her from. They've lied to you about her breeding, and now they're not getting back to you? You could start with a craigslist posting, and look for a better more reputable rescue agency to rehome the dog.

Anonymous wrote:The answer is easy, the dog needs to be put down. The dog isn't safe around your kids, and it wouldn't be right to let another family adopt the dog and have the dog bite another child.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One more thing OP - I am the PP who has been raising and training German Shepherd Dogs for 20 years. Obviously, I LOVE the breed. Both of the ones we have now are rescues. I got a phone call from an out of state friend about a month ago. They were looking to adopt a dog and came across a German Shepherd Dog in a local shelter. The dog was estimated to have been between 2 and 3 years old. They have a 3 year old little girl and a 7 year old boy. They spent some time playing with the dog at the shelter and fell in love with him. She called me before they adopted asking my advise. I told her that adopting an adult German Shepherd from a shelter (as opposed to a foster) when you have young children in the house was a bad idea. They adopted anyway.

About a week ago I found out (through another friend) that the dog and the kids were in the back yard playing. The dog attacked their 3 year year for no apparent reason. The little girl is going to be o.k., but needed 12 stitches in her face. It could have been much, much worse.

When you adopt from a shelter, you have no idea what you are getting. If you are in an adult only household or a home with older kids, it's usually fine. Adopting a dog that has been with foster family usually works out o.k. because hopefully the family has had time to learn the dogs temperament. Adopting an adult dog from a shelter is always risky. I'm not suggesting that you shouldn't do it. However, when you do, you accept that you may find out that the dog has behavior issues that you aren't prepared to handle, especially with young children in the home. The moment you see aggression, the dog goes.

Since you really seem to know a lot about dogs, I have a question for you. Our beagle is 14 years old, and we've had her since she was a puppy. She's always been as gentle as can be---not so much as a growl. She's been around kids her entire life and has never snapped at them for any reason. Now that she's older, if wakened from a deep sleep by being touched, she'll sometimes snap at my husband or me. Our grandchildren are older and know to never touch her when she's asleep, and we only wake her (if needed) by moving her bed a little, which doesn't seem to startle her. Is this typical for older dogs? Your thoughts? TIA.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How did your son push her away? Maybe by the face, and his finger tip went in her eye? Or maybe the dog is just head-shy and his going to push her face away spooked her.

I tend to assume human error. I would not get rid of the dog based on this. I would retrain all family members in how to command the dog, how to touch/play/pet the dog, and would firm up the training of the dog.

This is why you pet people are psycho. You'd rather your child be traumatized and eventually mauled than give up a pet you just got.

I'm not at all psycho. Her dog didn't bite the kid, the dog snapped at him. It was the dog's way of giving a warning, which is why I asked HOW he pushed the dog away. You helicopter moms are psycho. See how that feels? Don't call names. Once, when my son was around 1, he wanted to pet the dog. They were both on my bed. He kept crawling after her and she kept moving away from him. Finally, she snapped at him. He cried. He was not traumatized. We changed the way we allowed them to interact, and she never snapped or bit anyone again in her more than dozen years past that.

I'm a dog lover and I think you're crazy too. A good family dog moves away from a child who plays too roughly.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When I was pregnant with our first, my husband and I took a course called "Dogs and Puppies, Play it Safe" to learn how to prevent dog bites from day 1. Part of it is preventing the opportunity, and part of it is training the young child how to interact with dogs so as to reduce the risk of getting bitten.

Our daughter is 3, and she is very careful when interacting with our 85 lb shepherd--we don't think he'd bite since he's very sweet, but still, not taking any chances.

Husband works in pediatric ER and sees the results of bad dog bites from time to time--not anything we wanted to have on our hands.

That's crazy. You should not expect that a young child (a baby or toddler) can possibly learn how to interact with a dog without making mistakes.

The only way to not have a bitten child on your hands is to 1. just be lucky and have a very gentle dog or 2. not have a dog. PERIOD.

Well, of course. But that wasn't the intent of the class. The class teacher emphasized making sure that your child is not "magnetized" to the dog--basically, she was saying that you shouldn't permit your baby/toddler/young child to get too comfortable with teasing the dog, rolling all over the dog, getting in the dog's face, etc.--basically, all the stuff that people think is so cute when they post dog/child videos on Youtube. They also taught us how to recognize signs that the dog is uncomfortable, to try to prevent bites before they happen. Too much to summarize here, but good stuff--especially for me as a first-time dog-owner (our dog was exactly 1 year old when our daughter was born, so still a high-energy puppy in many ways.

So our 3yo knows not to stare lovingly in the dog's eyes, not to jump/yell/speak in a high-pitched voice while close to the dog (our dog gets uncomfortable with this), not to pull his tail, hit him, etc.--and we give her constant feedback so she knows what's okay and what's not with the dog. Less fun photo opps, but that's fine.

Of course your response is totally reasonable. Having a dog is a responsibility and teaching our kids is another.

Posters on this board want to get a dog and then forget it, no work, no adapting, no training. If it isn't perfect, you get rid of the dog.
You know what? Dogs have been living with humans for about 30,000 years. And yeah, sometimes humans get bitten. It's actually good for children to learn limits -- on horses, with dogs, ice-skating etc. And unless we're talking aggressive dogs who display that behavior, getting snapped at and rolling with it is actually a pretty good lesson for a kid.

It's such a cliche, but I was thrown off a horse when I was young -- thankfully not seriously hurt -- and no one even thought twice about putting me back on a horse. Today? They'd probably shoot the horse.

OP here. I assume your post is directed at me, which is fine. You don't know me so I don't know why I feel the need to defend myself but I have to say that we have been working with a trainer. This dog has had a lot of behavioral issues that we've been working hard to deal with. She is bitey, she jumps, she could not walk on a leash in the beginning to save her life, the only command she knows is sit (and that's only if you're holding a treat), the list goes on. Those are all things we've been working on and I've been happy to do it. We were told that she needed 2-3 hours of exercise, so I've been out there walking her two time a day, for at least an hour each time, plus having her play outside with our neighbor's dog multiple times a day. Or taking her to the dog park. In other words, I've spent the last two months trying my best to accommodate the dog's needs. And I was prepared to spend the next 10+ years doing so! But when she snaps at my son's head, that's game over for me. This happened on Sunday, which happened to be the first day when she didn't get out for her usual amount of exercise due to the ice storm. If this is what I can look forward to on days when she's not worn out to the point of exhaustion, that is too much of a risk for me.

Thanks again for all the posts and input, it's been helpful. In the meantime, I contacted the rescue yesterday and spoke to the coordinator about what happened. She said it was my son's fault (essentially), but she'd check the paperwork and get back to me. They still haven't. We've been keeping the dog away from the kids in the meantime.

OP, you've posted about this dog before, and several times in this thread. In all seriousness, I do think the snapping was an abberration caused by the terrible winter weather, puppy-ish lack of manners, and inappropriate behavior by your son.

I understand why you do not want to keep the dog. However, I would reconsider giving the dog back to the rescue organization you got her from. They've lied to you about her breeding, and now they're not getting back to you? You could start with a craigslist posting, and look for a better more reputable rescue agency to rehome the dog.

The rescue contract requires that we would surrender the dog to the rescue if we had to give her up.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When I was pregnant with our first, my husband and I took a course called "Dogs and Puppies, Play it Safe" to learn how to prevent dog bites from day 1. Part of it is preventing the opportunity, and part of it is training the young child how to interact with dogs so as to reduce the risk of getting bitten.

Our daughter is 3, and she is very careful when interacting with our 85 lb shepherd--we don't think he'd bite since he's very sweet, but still, not taking any chances.

Husband works in pediatric ER and sees the results of bad dog bites from time to time--not anything we wanted to have on our hands.

That's crazy. You should not expect that a young child (a baby or toddler) can possibly learn how to interact with a dog without making mistakes.

The only way to not have a bitten child on your hands is to 1. just be lucky and have a very gentle dog or 2. not have a dog. PERIOD.

Well, of course. But that wasn't the intent of the class. The class teacher emphasized making sure that your child is not "magnetized" to the dog--basically, she was saying that you shouldn't permit your baby/toddler/young child to get too comfortable with teasing the dog, rolling all over the dog, getting in the dog's face, etc.--basically, all the stuff that people think is so cute when they post dog/child videos on Youtube. They also taught us how to recognize signs that the dog is uncomfortable, to try to prevent bites before they happen. Too much to summarize here, but good stuff--especially for me as a first-time dog-owner (our dog was exactly 1 year old when our daughter was born, so still a high-energy puppy in many ways.

So our 3yo knows not to stare lovingly in the dog's eyes, not to jump/yell/speak in a high-pitched voice while close to the dog (our dog gets uncomfortable with this), not to pull his tail, hit him, etc.--and we give her constant feedback so she knows what's okay and what's not with the dog. Less fun photo opps, but that's fine.

Of course your response is totally reasonable. Having a dog is a responsibility and teaching our kids is another.

Posters on this board want to get a dog and then forget it, no work, no adapting, no training. If it isn't perfect, you get rid of the dog.
You know what? Dogs have been living with humans for about 30,000 years. And yeah, sometimes humans get bitten. It's actually good for children to learn limits -- on horses, with dogs, ice-skating etc. And unless we're talking aggressive dogs who display that behavior, getting snapped at and rolling with it is actually a pretty good lesson for a kid.

It's such a cliche, but I was thrown off a horse when I was young -- thankfully not seriously hurt -- and no one even thought twice about putting me back on a horse. Today? They'd probably shoot the horse.

OP here. I assume your post is directed at me, which is fine. You don't know me so I don't know why I feel the need to defend myself but I have to say that we have been working with a trainer. This dog has had a lot of behavioral issues that we've been working hard to deal with. She is bitey, she jumps, she could not walk on a leash in the beginning to save her life, the only command she knows is sit (and that's only if you're holding a treat), the list goes on. Those are all things we've been working on and I've been happy to do it. We were told that she needed 2-3 hours of exercise, so I've been out there walking her two time a day, for at least an hour each time, plus having her play outside with our neighbor's dog multiple times a day. Or taking her to the dog park. In other words, I've spent the last two months trying my best to accommodate the dog's needs. And I was prepared to spend the next 10+ years doing so! But when she snaps at my son's head, that's game over for me. This happened on Sunday, which happened to be the first day when she didn't get out for her usual amount of exercise due to the ice storm. If this is what I can look forward to on days when she's not worn out to the point of exhaustion, that is too much of a risk for me.

Thanks again for all the posts and input, it's been helpful. In the meantime, I contacted the rescue yesterday and spoke to the coordinator about what happened. She said it was my son's fault (essentially), but she'd check the paperwork and get back to me. They still haven't. We've been keeping the dog away from the kids in the meantime.

OP, you've posted about this dog before, and several times in this thread. In all seriousness, I do think the snapping was an abberration caused by the terrible winter weather, puppy-ish lack of manners, and inappropriate behavior by your son.

I understand why you do not want to keep the dog. However, I would reconsider giving the dog back to the rescue organization you got her from. They've lied to you about her breeding, and now they're not getting back to you? You could start with a craigslist posting, and look for a better more reputable rescue agency to rehome the dog.