Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those big buildings you see lining Pennsylvania Ave are attributable to Marion Barry. In many ways, there could not have been an Anthony Williams had there not first been a Marion Barry.

It has always been sad to me that the second half of his life will overshadow the first. A cautionary tale about the dangers of believing your own press and surrounding yourself with yes men.

Very well said. We have to look at the man in the whole. Unfortunately I only became political aware during the time period of MB's cocaine escapades so that sits stronger in my head than his prior work. But its important we look at the whole. Frankly the drug issues and the the conceit of power of those later years must be remembered with the good the man did. We must always be aware of the potential for abuse that comes with power. When we do not, when we censure debate, we end up with college kids wearing Che Guevara T-shrits wholly unaware the man was responsible for the rape and murder of thousands.

I in no way am comparing the Mayor to Che… They Mayor had personal demons but I believe was a good man. I just wanted to further the cautionary tale point; it not only applies to those in power but to political forums which decide what is to be discussed and what is not.

(That said all discourse should be provided in respectable and decent manner, slinging expletives and insults should not be tolerated, not tolerated towards fellow debaters or the subjects of this forum)

Rest in Peace Mr. Mayor.

I'm not sure how many times posters and the moderator need to reiterate that discussion is not being censored but curtailed temporarily in respect for the mayor AND those who are mourning for him NOW. Additionally, numerous posters have mentioned the Mayor's shortcomings but also acknowledged his past successes.

No one disputes Barry's personal difficulties and freedom of speech is one of America's proudest attributes, but why anyone would even need to say to allow those mourning Barry a short respite (even for a few hours) is beyond me.

LOL, 'curtailed temporarily' is censored. This is like a page out of animal farm… All animals are equal, except some are more equal than others.

There will be no discussion during periods of mourning. There will be no periods other than mourning.

Even Mayor Barry would use a funeral to make a point if he felt it necessary, its childish to not think a politician's death is not an opportunity to advance the great debate. especially one who died of old age after a long and uniquely illustrious and controversial career. If he was perhaps assassinated young, while in office perhaps you may have a point but come now. This is a Political Discussion forum, not a mourners blog… mourners should be mourning and not surfing the web. MB would never be so thin skinned, why are you?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those big buildings you see lining Pennsylvania Ave are attributable to Marion Barry. In many ways, there could not have been an Anthony Williams had there not first been a Marion Barry.

It has always been sad to me that the second half of his life will overshadow the first. A cautionary tale about the dangers of believing your own press and surrounding yourself with yes men.

Very well said. We have to look at the man in the whole. Unfortunately I only became political aware during the time period of MB's cocaine escapades so that sits stronger in my head than his prior work. But its important we look at the whole. Frankly the drug issues and the the conceit of power of those later years must be remembered with the good the man did. We must always be aware of the potential for abuse that comes with power. When we do not, when we censure debate, we end up with college kids wearing Che Guevara T-shrits wholly unaware the man was responsible for the rape and murder of thousands.

I in no way am comparing the Mayor to Che… They Mayor had personal demons but I believe was a good man. I just wanted to further the cautionary tale point; it not only applies to those in power but to political forums which decide what is to be discussed and what is not.

(That said all discourse should be provided in respectable and decent manner, slinging expletives and insults should not be tolerated, not tolerated towards fellow debaters or the subjects of this forum)

Rest in Peace Mr. Mayor.

I'm not sure how many times posters and the moderator need to reiterate that discussion is not being censored but curtailed temporarily in respect for the mayor AND those who are mourning for him NOW. Additionally, numerous posters have mentioned the Mayor's shortcomings but also acknowledged his past successes.

No one disputes Barry's personal difficulties and freedom of speech is one of America's proudest attributes, but why anyone would even need to say to allow those mourning Barry a short respite (even for a few hours) is beyond me.

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you going to censor me again Jeff?

You did not censor people who said horrible things here when Margaret Thatcher died. And only I chided those who seem to be attached to the disreputable among us (not my exact words but i said nothing foul of offensive). For at the end of the day Marion Barry was a public figure and and deserves public scrutiny. Yet during his life time to offer scrutiny was to risk being libeled a racist by many who post here. And now in death you won't even allow the discussion. I won't play the hagiography game but if you censor this its far worse than hagiography you are playing at. This is the Political Discussion Forum Jeff, please allow the discourse.

There will be plenty of time in the future for discussion of all aspects of Barry's life. Today is a day for those who grieve. Those who don't can go to the Expectant Moms forum and discuss baby names.

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you going to censor me again Jeff?

You did not censor people who said horrible things here when Margaret Thatcher died. And only I chided those who seem to be attached to the disreputable among us (not my exact words but i said nothing foul of offensive). For at the end of the day Marion Barry was a public figure and and deserves public scrutiny. Yet during his life time to offer scrutiny was to risk being libeled a racist by many who post here. And now in death you won't even allow the discussion. I won't play the hagiography game but if you censor this its far worse than hagiography you are playing at. This is the Political Discussion Forum Jeff, please allow the discourse.

There will be plenty of time in the future for discussion of all aspects of Barry's life. Today is a day for those who grieve. Those who don't can go to the Expectant Moms forum and discuss baby names.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not an analogy...a contrast.

Google "compare and contrast"...it's a skill taught to kindergarteners.

And class is not something you learned.

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did he get caught up on his back income taxes? If not, will his estate remain responsible?

Please try to be respectful at this time. Barry meant a great deal to many in this city and they deserve to grieve in peace.

+1. Very classy of you, Jeff.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Yes, the summer jobs program was a good initiative, but you need more than that to be a good mayor.

How about completely transforming the Georgetown waterfront?

And the vision to revitalize burnt out U Street, Shaw. He fought to put the new District building there, believing that it would spur development. He was right.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you going to censor me again Jeff?

You did not censor people who said horrible things here when Margaret Thatcher died. And only I chided those who seem to be attached to the disreputable among us (not my exact words but i said nothing foul of offensive). For at the end of the day Marion Barry was a public figure and and deserves public scrutiny. Yet during his life time to offer scrutiny was to risk being libeled a racist by many who post here. And now in death you won't even allow the discussion. I won't play the hagiography game but if you censor this its far worse than hagiography you are playing at. This is the Political Discussion Forum Jeff, please allow the discourse.

I just read the Margaret Thatcher thread. I fail to see anything "horrible" in it. http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/299723.page This, despite the fact that she is a foreign political figure, not American much less DC's former mayor.

Maybe you could point out what you think is worthy of deletion for being "horrible". I don't think you are showing much perspective here.

That an entire thread is a debate about her politics and whether it was good or bad for the UK and the world. Plenty of negative comments about her. If Jeff is deleting anything negative about Barry in this, he's showing a double standard.

This is not the UK and the world. This is DC, and many of its people are grieving.

The white yuppies of DC are grieving? Really?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you going to censor me again Jeff?

You did not censor people who said horrible things here when Margaret Thatcher died. And only I chided those who seem to be attached to the disreputable among us (not my exact words but i said nothing foul of offensive). For at the end of the day Marion Barry was a public figure and and deserves public scrutiny. Yet during his life time to offer scrutiny was to risk being libeled a racist by many who post here. And now in death you won't even allow the discussion. I won't play the hagiography game but if you censor this its far worse than hagiography you are playing at. This is the Political Discussion Forum Jeff, please allow the discourse.

I just read the Margaret Thatcher thread. I fail to see anything "horrible" in it. http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/299723.page This, despite the fact that she is a foreign political figure, not American much less DC's former mayor.

Maybe you could point out what you think is worthy of deletion for being "horrible". I don't think you are showing much perspective here.

That an entire thread is a debate about her politics and whether it was good or bad for the UK and the world. Plenty of negative comments about her. If Jeff is deleting anything negative about Barry in this, he's showing a double standard.

This is not the UK and the world. This is DC, and many of its people are grieving.

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you going to censor me again Jeff?

You did not censor people who said horrible things here when Margaret Thatcher died. And only I chided those who seem to be attached to the disreputable among us (not my exact words but i said nothing foul of offensive). For at the end of the day Marion Barry was a public figure and and deserves public scrutiny. Yet during his life time to offer scrutiny was to risk being libeled a racist by many who post here. And now in death you won't even allow the discussion. I won't play the hagiography game but if you censor this its far worse than hagiography you are playing at. This is the Political Discussion Forum Jeff, please allow the discourse.

There will be plenty of time in the future for discussion of all aspects of Barry's life. Today is a day for those who grieve. Those who don't can go to the Expectant Moms forum and discuss baby names.

Jeff I'm starting to see how important you are to this city. Thank you for being responsible with this forum.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The censorship is unfortunate but probably necessary.

It doesnt seem Barry operated for personal gain - he was basically bankrupt. Did he enrage others? Probanly. But his legacy is pretty amazing. Last of the biggest city bosses to go. Now we get hacks like Gray, diblasio, etc.

The city will move on, and maybe faster than it otherwise w/o have. But it may lose some of the unique character Barry nurtured.

Being from Chicago and home of one of the biggest, baddest late bosses, Richard J Daley (1955-1976), I can appreciate your statement.

Daley, like Barry, was never in it for personal gain and both had dubious moments. I remember my grandfather saying he never really liked or trusted Daley but always voted for him "because my trash gets picked up, the street lights are on, and the precinct captain always checks in to make sure everything is alright."

Sounds like bosses Daley and Barry had much in common.

Are you kidding me? Clearly you didn't live in ward three during the 90s. Our trash got picked up maybe twice a month and if you called with a service request like fixing a streetlight the city would retaliate against you by fining your house for a minor infraction.

Looks like you missed the point which is many benefited from the bosses and those who did, voted for them.

I just don't think it is appropriate to compare basic city services like trash pickup that Daley was good at in Chicago to the same services that barry provided. Daley is known for being very good at providing those services; barry is known for being bad at services like trash pickup and fixing lights. Not fair to Daley.
Yes, the summer jobs program was a good initiative, but you need more than that to be a good mayor.

You folks don't understand the definition of a 'boss' in politics. This isn't about trash pickup. It's about political control, effective or not. Never make a regional political comment where people really don't understand.

I was responding to his grandfather's quote. People in Chicago often used to say the city was corrupt, but stuff got done. The trash was picked up, basic services were provided. I seriously doubt you can find many people who grew up in DC during the Marion Barry years of the 1990s who would say that trash got picked up, etc. Maybe the services were better east of the park, but west of the park, I can assure you, no one would have said what his grandfather said of Daley. It is not an apt historical comparison.

Anonymous wrote:

Yes, the summer jobs program was a good initiative, but you need more than that to be a good mayor.

How about completely transforming the Georgetown waterfront?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The censorship is unfortunate but probably necessary.

It doesnt seem Barry operated for personal gain - he was basically bankrupt. Did he enrage others? Probanly. But his legacy is pretty amazing. Last of the biggest city bosses to go. Now we get hacks like Gray, diblasio, etc.

The city will move on, and maybe faster than it otherwise w/o have. But it may lose some of the unique character Barry nurtured.

Being from Chicago and home of one of the biggest, baddest late bosses, Richard J Daley (1955-1976), I can appreciate your statement.

Daley, like Barry, was never in it for personal gain and both had dubious moments. I remember my grandfather saying he never really liked or trusted Daley but always voted for him "because my trash gets picked up, the street lights are on, and the precinct captain always checks in to make sure everything is alright."

Sounds like bosses Daley and Barry had much in common.

Are you kidding me? Clearly you didn't live in ward three during the 90s. Our trash got picked up maybe twice a month and if you called with a service request like fixing a streetlight the city would retaliate against you by fining your house for a minor infraction.

Looks like you missed the point which is many benefited from the bosses and those who did, voted for them.

I just don't think it is appropriate to compare basic city services like trash pickup that Daley was good at in Chicago to the same services that barry provided. Daley is known for being very good at providing those services; barry is known for being bad at services like trash pickup and fixing lights. Not fair to Daley.
Yes, the summer jobs program was a good initiative, but you need more than that to be a good mayor.

You folks don't understand the definition of a 'boss' in politics. This isn't about trash pickup. It's about political control, effective or not. Never make a regional political comment where people really don't understand.

I was responding to his grandfather's quote. People in Chicago often used to say the city was corrupt, but stuff got done. The trash was picked up, basic services were provided. I seriously doubt you can find many people who grew up in DC during the Marion Barry years of the 1990s who would say that trash got picked up, etc. Maybe the services were better east of the park, but west of the park, I can assure you, no one would have said what his grandfather said of Daley. It is not an apt historical comparison.

If you take trash out of the picture (both cities are more than that), it's about the power that was wielded under the definition of 'boss.'

In that respect, there is a comparison, though limited for very obvious reasons, where you have the definition of boss mayor who answered to no one. Read 'Boss: Richard J Daley of Chicago' by Mike Royko. As you read, it's far, far more than trash. And obviously, you can't compare Chicago to DC but their is similar sentiment about power.

Again, try and not focus exclusively on the trash aspect. If you didn't live in Chicago during the time the Boss governed, you might get more insight from the book rather than a few lines on DCUM please.