Anonymous wrote:The awful culture described here seems consistent with today's hook up culture. Kids are too self obsessed for relationships- yet feel entitled/empowered to act upon sexual urges with no strings attached. This cycle begins in middle school when kiDS start sending nudes and arranging hook ups - no dates or hand holding these days - just BJs in the bushes. This is typical "popular/cool kid behavior" in DC/NOVA. Add loads of alcohol and an entitled mob mentality and here we are folks. The admin is another story...wtf!!

Anonymous wrote:I went to two schools as an undergrad, in the early 1990s. One was small, liberal arts college and one was a state school. In both cases, I knew several women who were raped. Most of them were raped at fraternity houses. In all cases, the administration did its best to cover it up. The more violent and egregious the incident, the harder women were pressured to say nothing. This is how colleges operate. It's not unique to UVA.

Anonymous wrote:I went to an highly ranked academic school with a large fraternity/sorority scene. There are quite a few things that can be done without outlawing greek life entirely. First, warn students of the allegations. Second and the most obvious, encourage students and support them to refer matters to the police. Third, take action based on allegations -- Hopkins recently banned all fraternity parties until further notice in the wake of an allegation that a girl was assaulted at a fraternity party (allegedly by someone who wasn't a student)). Fourth, outlaw fraternity/sorority houses or make them non-residential.

Anonymous wrote:The awful culture described here seems consistent with today's hook up culture. Kids are too self obsessed for relationships- yet feel entitled/empowered to act upon sexual urges with no strings attached. This cycle begins in middle school when kiDS start sending nudes and arranging hook ups - no dates or hand holding these days - just BJs in the bushes. This is typical "popular/cool kid behavior" in DC/NOVA. Add loads of alcohol and an entitled mob mentality and here we are folks. The admin is another story...wtf!!

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Anonymous wrote:Why isn't the WaPo covering this????

Give it a day.

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Anonymous wrote:Really horrible. For the first time I am grateful my DC was waitlisted at UVA and went elsewhere. While I think there are issues everywhere I think it's a little more accepted at UVA and has been for a long time.

I strongly discouraged (successfully) my DD from applying to UVA. What a frightening article. I have family who live in Charlottesvile and worked at UVA and told stories about the frat culture that made my skin crawl.

I wouldn't go as far as disbanding all frats and sororities because many of them are academic and do wonderful community service. But the beer drinking, girl raping, belly bumping frats should have their chapters removed. Georgia Tech just had a chapter revoked because of rape bait emails.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The awful culture described here seems consistent with today's hook up culture. Kids are too self obsessed for relationships- yet feel entitled/empowered to act upon sexual urges with no strings attached. This cycle begins in middle school when kiDS start sending nudes and arranging hook ups - no dates or hand holding these days - just BJs in the bushes. This is typical "popular/cool kid behavior" in DC/NOVA. Add loads of alcohol and an entitled mob mentality and here we are folks. The admin is another story...wtf!!

Exactly, not to mention women who regularly hook up and thus give these animals a false impression that all women welcome their rapes.

Anonymous wrote:Ok, I'll say it: college fraternities need to be banned from campuses. They just need to be a thing of the past. What is the use of these organizations other than to shield and encourage pathological men and behaviors, such as binge drinking, sexual assault, misogyny?

Anonymous wrote:The awful culture described here seems consistent with today's hook up culture. Kids are too self obsessed for relationships- yet feel entitled/empowered to act upon sexual urges with no strings attached. This cycle begins in middle school when kiDS start sending nudes and arranging hook ups - no dates or hand holding these days - just BJs in the bushes. This is typical "popular/cool kid behavior" in DC/NOVA. Add loads of alcohol and an entitled mob mentality and here we are folks. The admin is another story...wtf!!

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Anonymous wrote:The victims MUST come forward. Isn't that the irony? "Jackie" in the story isn't sure she wants to come forward and yet SHE holds the key to their conviction. She was brutally attacked and yet she is unwilling to scream that out until she is heard and they pay. I understand there are costs for her to go forward, but it's kind of a conundrum that the article is saying "they all get away with it" and at the same time, reporting that the victims haven't wanted to make it a criminal case. Seems one is necessary for the other.

I can't imagine being so fully assaulted and NOT making someone pay. Hell to the no.

It would be useless for Jackie to come forward at this point because there is no evidence. She may inspire some future rape victim to report it to the POLICE (not UVA) and go straight to the police instead of showering away the evidence.

The sad fact is that those boys will never pay, they will never admit it and her lame friends will still not testify to much (not that even really matters).

there IS evidence. there were witnesses who saw her right afterward. And SHE is evidence -- she can testify. There may be members of the fraternity who would testify. To say there is NO evidence is just patently wrong.

Her "friends" didn't even think she was raped. They can only testify that she said she was raped and that she was upset. She could have gotten drunk and fallen down the steps and gotten the same injuries they saw. The bro's are not going to testify. Real evidence is something other than what you think it is.

That is evidence. They testify that they saw her with her clothing ripped or disheveled, a black eye, crying, whatever they saw. They also have the victim's testimony. There may be other evidence -- people who were at the party, even pictures. Trust me, one of these guys is going to break ranks and snitch, maybe more than one. Trust me, there will be a race to get that reduced sentence. If they want to claim she fell down the steps they'll have to offer up evidence of their own.

One witness doesn't tell the whole story. Its a brick in the total wall.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The victims MUST come forward. Isn't that the irony? "Jackie" in the story isn't sure she wants to come forward and yet SHE holds the key to their conviction. She was brutally attacked and yet she is unwilling to scream that out until she is heard and they pay. I understand there are costs for her to go forward, but it's kind of a conundrum that the article is saying "they all get away with it" and at the same time, reporting that the victims haven't wanted to make it a criminal case. Seems one is necessary for the other.

I can't imagine being so fully assaulted and NOT making someone pay. Hell to the no.

What if you were made to doubt your own recollection of the event? What if your friends didn't support you? What if the school's actions made you feel that its reputation and honor code were more important than your physical and mental health?

One of the worst parts of the story is her friends' reactions when they saw her immediately after the gang rape. Only one of them (a guy) wanted to take her to the hospital while the others were only concerned about THEIR reputations. Jackie had NO support and she was a freshman who'd been in college less than month. Not only is there a huge problem with the dude bro culture, but there's a huge problem with everyone else who lets them get away with it.