I guess I am not hearing anyone say very clearly that they understand who their child is, or what they want. Many 18 year olds are not ready to make any choices. We sent our youngest to community college for two years, and let him work while he was there. He came out with 3.8 and then transferred to UVA, which is a Great state school. No pressure, and now he knows what he wants to accomplish and where his passion lies.

I don't hear anyone taking what their particular child needs or wants into account on this board.

Anonymous wrote:There's a huge difference between foundation, preparation, and pressure.

The foundation starts when the kid first enters formal school -- when you start to shape their attitude about learning being something they should want to do for a variety of reasons and when you emphasize to them that it's important to put honest good-faith effort into all of their work. These basic academic habits will serve them well from K through post-secondary education if they choose to go that route and hopefully will bleed over into other areas of their life beyond school.

Start the explicit preparation sometime in middle school -- if you think your child will probably want to go to college figure out the admission requirements most schools have in common as far as classes required in high school and make sure your kid stays on track to meet those requirements. This isn't about steering them to a specific school, it's about making sure to keep their options open. If you do this, it is unlikely that in 10th or 11th grade the student will realize they need a certain class but don't have the prerequisites.

As for the pressure, if possible don't start that ever, but definitely not before 10th or 11th grade when it's time to start thinking seriously about testing and applications.

This! You want to instill a work ethic into your child, but that means you want your child to work hard at whatever they choose, not necessarily at achieving your dream of having a kid who went to Yale.

You want to instill a love of learning, but that's so your child can take pleasure from ideas and books throughout his or her life, not necessarily to get straight As for Yale.

You want your child to understand the requirements for acceptance at a wide range of colleges. But that's so your child doesn't inadvertently close off future options by innocently believing that Cs are average so they will be good enough for the college of her choice.

You want to make sure your child is on the highest learning track appropriate to his or her interests and capabilities. This is because challenge is good, not coasting. And again because you don't want to inadvertently close off opportunities that your child may decide to pursue in 11th or 12th grade.

All of this is quite different from pressure in the form of, "your parents went to Yale so you must go to Yale too."

Anonymous wrote:^^^ Oh for goodness sakes. Her kid hasn't had concussions, a blessing for him, but you've got to keep hammering away at it. The kid was a standout athlete and is doing well at Stanford, how does that possibly affect you?

+1
Seriously, just shut up already. You come across as jealous and slightly unhinged. Why should you care if someone else's kid is at Stanford to play football, to to med school or just party their ass off. Not your kid, not your money and not your problem. Athletics are a huge hook at most every college...get over it.

^^^ Oh for goodness sakes. Her kid hasn't had concussions, a blessing for him, but you've got to keep hammering away at it. The kid was a standout athlete and is doing well at Stanford, how does that possibly affect you?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well ..... Your kids should be volunteering... Not to get into college ... But really, they need to be doing something for others.

I couldn't give two Sh-ts about whether my kids get into Ivies so long as they become happy, kind, and we'll rounded young adults. Amazing how parents put education above all else, even above the social well being of their child. To each their own I guess. I am confident that my kids will go to a good college of their choosing and they will find their path, not the path that I choose for them.

I actually have a child at an Ivy. And two in state schools. I was totally hands off. We never did test prep or any of that nonsense. All three are on academic scholarships, none of it need based. Two are on full rides.

You don't have to put tremendous pressure on your kids in order for them to succeed. You just have to be willing to accept that success looks different for everyone.

It's my understanding that Ivy League schools only award need-based financial aid, not academic scholarships.

+1. Typical Ivy parent who has to tell you their kid is at the top of their ivy and hence has an academic scholarship. They may have a fellowship or a special program but I highly doubt that came with money to entice the kid to attend the ivy -- the ivys aren't that desperate for students. -Signed an Ivy grad

Well, I'm no Ivy grad. But I know that there is a lot of scholarship money that does not come from the school. She received three different scholarships. Or maybe it's all a rouse and I'll get a massive bill when she graduated next year.

Plenty of private scholarship money out there -- it's a bit disingenuous to say that your kid is on an academic scholarship at an ivy as the money is not from that ivy, it is from whatever other private source; your kid would have been eligible for that even if they went to VCU.

+1000. Ivies, Stanford, MIT, etc. do not give "academic scholarships only need based.

I can't speak to the others but my DS is at Stanford on an athletic scholarship. BTW, he didn't even think about college till he was a rising junior. Graduated with a 3.5 GPA from an average high school. I feel sorry for those of you busting your hump to make your kids stand out from the pack.

Your kid wouldn't be at Stanford if he wasn't a jock, you realize. If he wasn't a jock, he would have had to have thought a little harder about college before 11th grade.

And if your son is who I think he is, he was a standout in his sport as a freshman and an all-American as a senior. He didn't have to think about where he was going. The colleges would come to him.

Its true he turned down multiple offers from great schools but Stanford offered the best blend of academics and athletics. He works extremely hard on and off the field. His high school coach drilled into him 'some may be faster, some may be bigger but no one will work harder." I credit football with giving him tremendous focus and teaching him how rewarding commitment and a strong work ethic can be

How many concussions has he had?

He hasn't had a concussion.He's used Brain Sentry for a while and he plays with a custom helmet that cost a small fortune. He also understands and has been taught good body mechanics to lessen the chance of concussive injury.
Actually per the CDC, the incidence of concussions in football is 0.47 per 1000 athletic exposures so having a collegiate football player that's never had a concussion is not really unusual.
He trains hard to stay healthy, I do worry about his head and knees. That being said, I worry about him driving too.

You missed a word, reported The % of reported concussions is low. How many concussions go unreported? The incentive is to under report.

Anonymous wrote:If my kids want to work to get into a certain college - I'll do everything I can to help them. If they don't - I'll leave them be. I'm not crazy about forcing every child to go to college X and get degree X and whatnot...as long as my kids are happy then so am I, regardless of college or not, what college, what degree etc.

YAY! a voice of sanity!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well ..... Your kids should be volunteering... Not to get into college ... But really, they need to be doing something for others.

I couldn't give two Sh-ts about whether my kids get into Ivies so long as they become happy, kind, and we'll rounded young adults. Amazing how parents put education above all else, even above the social well being of their child. To each their own I guess. I am confident that my kids will go to a good college of their choosing and they will find their path, not the path that I choose for them.

I actually have a child at an Ivy. And two in state schools. I was totally hands off. We never did test prep or any of that nonsense. All three are on academic scholarships, none of it need based. Two are on full rides.

You don't have to put tremendous pressure on your kids in order for them to succeed. You just have to be willing to accept that success looks different for everyone.

It's my understanding that Ivy League schools only award need-based financial aid, not academic scholarships.

+1. Typical Ivy parent who has to tell you their kid is at the top of their ivy and hence has an academic scholarship. They may have a fellowship or a special program but I highly doubt that came with money to entice the kid to attend the ivy -- the ivys aren't that desperate for students. -Signed an Ivy grad

Well, I'm no Ivy grad. But I know that there is a lot of scholarship money that does not come from the school. She received three different scholarships. Or maybe it's all a rouse and I'll get a massive bill when she graduated next year.

Plenty of private scholarship money out there -- it's a bit disingenuous to say that your kid is on an academic scholarship at an ivy as the money is not from that ivy, it is from whatever other private source; your kid would have been eligible for that even if they went to VCU.

+1000. Ivies, Stanford, MIT, etc. do not give "academic scholarships only need based.

I can't speak to the others but my DS is at Stanford on an athletic scholarship. BTW, he didn't even think about college till he was a rising junior. Graduated with a 3.5 GPA from an average high school. I feel sorry for those of you busting your hump to make your kids stand out from the pack.

Your kid wouldn't be at Stanford if he wasn't a jock, you realize. If he wasn't a jock, he would have had to have thought a little harder about college before 11th grade.

And if your son is who I think he is, he was a standout in his sport as a freshman and an all-American as a senior. He didn't have to think about where he was going. The colleges would come to him.

Its true he turned down multiple offers from great schools but Stanford offered the best blend of academics and athletics. He works extremely hard on and off the field. His high school coach drilled into him 'some may be faster, some may be bigger but no one will work harder." I credit football with giving him tremendous focus and teaching him how rewarding commitment and a strong work ethic can be

How many concussions has he had?

He hasn't had a concussion.He's used Brain Sentry for a while and he plays with a custom helmet that cost a small fortune. He also understands and has been taught good body mechanics to lessen the chance of concussive injury.
Actually per the CDC, the incidence of concussions in football is 0.47 per 1000 athletic exposures so having a collegiate football player that's never had a concussion is not really unusual.
He trains hard to stay healthy, I do worry about his head and knees. That being said, I worry about him driving too.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well ..... Your kids should be volunteering... Not to get into college ... But really, they need to be doing something for others.

I couldn't give two Sh-ts about whether my kids get into Ivies so long as they become happy, kind, and we'll rounded young adults. Amazing how parents put education above all else, even above the social well being of their child. To each their own I guess. I am confident that my kids will go to a good college of their choosing and they will find their path, not the path that I choose for them.

I actually have a child at an Ivy. And two in state schools. I was totally hands off. We never did test prep or any of that nonsense. All three are on academic scholarships, none of it need based. Two are on full rides.

You don't have to put tremendous pressure on your kids in order for them to succeed. You just have to be willing to accept that success looks different for everyone.

It's my understanding that Ivy League schools only award need-based financial aid, not academic scholarships.

+1. Typical Ivy parent who has to tell you their kid is at the top of their ivy and hence has an academic scholarship. They may have a fellowship or a special program but I highly doubt that came with money to entice the kid to attend the ivy -- the ivys aren't that desperate for students. -Signed an Ivy grad

Well, I'm no Ivy grad. But I know that there is a lot of scholarship money that does not come from the school. She received three different scholarships. Or maybe it's all a rouse and I'll get a massive bill when she graduated next year.

Plenty of private scholarship money out there -- it's a bit disingenuous to say that your kid is on an academic scholarship at an ivy as the money is not from that ivy, it is from whatever other private source; your kid would have been eligible for that even if they went to VCU.

+1000. Ivies, Stanford, MIT, etc. do not give "academic scholarships only need based.

I can't speak to the others but my DS is at Stanford on an athletic scholarship. BTW, he didn't even think about college till he was a rising junior. Graduated with a 3.5 GPA from an average high school. I feel sorry for those of you busting your hump to make your kids stand out from the pack.

Your kid wouldn't be at Stanford if he wasn't a jock, you realize. If he wasn't a jock, he would have had to have thought a little harder about college before 11th grade.

And if your son is who I think he is, he was a standout in his sport as a freshman and an all-American as a senior. He didn't have to think about where he was going. The colleges would come to him.

Its true he turned down multiple offers from great schools but Stanford offered the best blend of academics and athletics. He works extremely hard on and off the field. His high school coach drilled into him 'some may be faster, some may be bigger but no one will work harder." I credit football with giving him tremendous focus and teaching him how rewarding commitment and a strong work ethic can be

How many concussions has he had?

And an interesting word for all of you highly educated parents out there - for all that you are pushing to get into top colleges and then paying, have you any idea who is actually teaching your college aged undergraduate. Let's see who could it possibly be???

- A graduate student in a Teaching Assistant slot - English speaking if are lucky and at least with a knowledge of the subject matter.

- A newly minted foreign young professor with limited English capacity and a lot of pressure to get research going and a lab set up in at least many of the STEM fields

- A random adjunct brought in to fill a slot at around $6,000 a course or so and quite possibly earning less than the TA

- Finally, better yet a "hanger on" around the department or school who is not on tenure track and will do anything that is teach anything to stay around.....

And why - because in most top colleges which are also research university, guess what is at the very, very bottom of the tenure track evaluation? And if your kids seem to mention that their classes do not seem to be going down as they move on to junior status, then you can bet your good old hard earned dollars, it is because the university is funding and educating the foreign graduate students on the backs of your hard charging sons and daughters. Things will not improve until parents start to look a it deeper into what their children are getting for their money. [b]This is one aspect of the immigration issue on the higher education end that is never dealt with. Why do American companies seek foreign graduate students to remain here for open slots, rather then pressuring American colleges to better prepare American undergraduates for grad school and the jobs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well ..... Your kids should be volunteering... Not to get into college ... But really, they need to be doing something for others.

I couldn't give two Sh-ts about whether my kids get into Ivies so long as they become happy, kind, and we'll rounded young adults. Amazing how parents put education above all else, even above the social well being of their child. To each their own I guess. I am confident that my kids will go to a good college of their choosing and they will find their path, not the path that I choose for them.

I'm a pediatric ICU nurse. One patient that I will never forget was a 16yo girl who attempted suicide because she could no longer deal with the pressure her parents were putting on her about school. She was at a top school in the area, very talented in science and math but she cracked under the pressure from school and home. Her parents had her on a course for Yale from the crib.

We told her mom "she needs some things from home. Next time you go home could you please bring her some underwear, pajamas, hair brush and so forth". Her mom goes home and comes back in a couple of hours with her school work. No clothes, no underwear, just school work. Her mom started to berate her about getting behind in school because she was in the hospital.

It was so bizarre. This girl would rather kill herself than disappoint her parents because as hard as she worked, she couldn't make the grades they expected her to make.

What did you all do for that family in terms of talking some sense into them or was it a lost cause?

Also were they Asian? Not trying to be offensive as I am Asian and have known kids who are about to break.

Yes, they were Asian. There was absolutely no talking sense into the mom. The father was far too meek to stand up to her, he stated repeatedly that he and the kids were afraid of her. It became a CPS case, I don't know what happened long term but I think of her often.

If my kids want to work to get into a certain college - I'll do everything I can to help them. If they don't - I'll leave them be. I'm not crazy about forcing every child to go to college X and get degree X and whatnot...as long as my kids are happy then so am I, regardless of college or not, what college, what degree etc.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well ..... Your kids should be volunteering... Not to get into college ... But really, they need to be doing something for others.

I couldn't give two Sh-ts about whether my kids get into Ivies so long as they become happy, kind, and we'll rounded young adults. Amazing how parents put education above all else, even above the social well being of their child. To each their own I guess. I am confident that my kids will go to a good college of their choosing and they will find their path, not the path that I choose for them.

I actually have a child at an Ivy. And two in state schools. I was totally hands off. We never did test prep or any of that nonsense. All three are on academic scholarships, none of it need based. Two are on full rides.

You don't have to put tremendous pressure on your kids in order for them to succeed. You just have to be willing to accept that success looks different for everyone.

It's my understanding that Ivy League schools only award need-based financial aid, not academic scholarships.

+1. Typical Ivy parent who has to tell you their kid is at the top of their ivy and hence has an academic scholarship. They may have a fellowship or a special program but I highly doubt that came with money to entice the kid to attend the ivy -- the ivys aren't that desperate for students. -Signed an Ivy grad

Well, I'm no Ivy grad. But I know that there is a lot of scholarship money that does not come from the school. She received three different scholarships. Or maybe it's all a rouse and I'll get a massive bill when she graduated next year.

Plenty of private scholarship money out there -- it's a bit disingenuous to say that your kid is on an academic scholarship at an ivy as the money is not from that ivy, it is from whatever other private source; your kid would have been eligible for that even if they went to VCU.

+1000. Ivies, Stanford, MIT, etc. do not give "academic scholarships only need based.

I can't speak to the others but my DS is at Stanford on an athletic scholarship. BTW, he didn't even think about college till he was a rising junior. Graduated with a 3.5 GPA from an average high school. I feel sorry for those of you busting your hump to make your kids stand out from the pack.

Your kid wouldn't be at Stanford if he wasn't a jock, you realize. If he wasn't a jock, he would have had to have thought a little harder about college before 11th grade.

And if your son is who I think he is, he was a standout in his sport as a freshman and an all-American as a senior. He didn't have to think about where he was going. The colleges would come to him.

Its true he turned down multiple offers from great schools but Stanford offered the best blend of academics and athletics. He works extremely hard on and off the field. His high school coach drilled into him 'some may be faster, some may be bigger but no one will work harder." I credit football with giving him tremendous focus and teaching him how rewarding commitment and a strong work ethic can be

I guess I don't understand all the pressure for my DS to make the most top tier school. I would be beyond thrilled if my son graduated from UMD. It's a great public school at a great price. If his grades were good there, he could go to pretty much any grad school that he wished.

There's a huge difference between foundation, preparation, and pressure.

The foundation starts when the kid first enters formal school -- when you start to shape their attitude about learning being something they should want to do for a variety of reasons and when you emphasize to them that it's important to put honest good-faith effort into all of their work. These basic academic habits will serve them well from K through post-secondary education if they choose to go that route and hopefully will bleed over into other areas of their life beyond school.

Start the explicit preparation sometime in middle school -- if you think your child will probably want to go to college figure out the admission requirements most schools have in common as far as classes required in high school and make sure your kid stays on track to meet those requirements. This isn't about steering them to a specific school, it's about making sure to keep their options open. If you do this, it is unlikely that in 10th or 11th grade the student will realize they need a certain class but don't have the prerequisites.

As for the pressure, if possible don't start that ever, but definitely not before 10th or 11th grade when it's time to start thinking seriously about testing and applications.

A book I would recommend to people already stressing about their elementary school child's college choice is "How to be a High School Superstar" by Cal Newport.

Rather than prep your kid by having him/her take the same courses and superficially participate in all the service activities as everyone else, it talks about how to truly set them apart - and in the process help them live a life that is actually interesting and rewarding.

I'd say summer before 8th grade is a good time to read it and think about how to apply its ideas. I didn't read it until last year, but my oldest child had already kind of lucked into an approach similar to the one the book outlines.