Anonymous
Post 03/20/2014 00:22     Subject: If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If he was turning out to be less successful professionally than you thought he would be (like not being partner material), would you consider divorce? What if you were getting the impression that he was turning out to be more "beta" than "alpha" mail in professional or social situations?


My husband as been under or unemployed for the 7+ years I've known him. I knew he was "behind" professionally and financially when we met, but I thought he had potential. I'm not so sure anymore. The more time that goes by, the more resentful I feel towards him and myself -- that I made such a poor choice in a partner.

DH is a terrific father to our toddler, he does more than his share of household upkeep, and he's one of the best persons I know in terms of character, generosity, integrity, etc. but all of this is overshadowed when I feel chronically stressed from the pressure of being the primary breadwinner. For this reason, I am no longer attracted to DH. I don't want or need a man to take care of me; I want a partnership where we are realizing our financial goals and dreams (college fund for DC, golden retirement, house, etc) together.

I feel lonely, depressed, and bleak about my future. I have no one to talk to about this, so I post anonymously on DCUM.


I feel exactly like what you wrote about 70% of the time. The rest of the time I'm so thankful to have a kind, generous, loving husband and father of my children. But that 70% feels pretty dark sometimes.


Add me to this group, and I'm not getting divorced. I married a man I thought was my equal and that we both wanted to work hard, pay off our student loans, and make a quiet life that minimized the rat race. Fast forward to him being unemployed for more than half of our marriage and me working 70+ hour weeks to pay for everything and having maybe 30 minutes a day to sit down. I pay for everything, and not because we agreed on it, but because he is always about to start looking for a job in "a couple of months." He is a great guy - good, kind, patient - and a solid, present father. He is an awful provider and an awful partner, though. Whatever OP's intentions, know that it isn't always black and white - winners and losers.
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 22:21     Subject: If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
Anonymous wrote:There are only so many slots in corporate America or a big law firm. Isn't it unrealistic to think that every educated man out there is going to make it to that level?


True, but as the saying goes, "if you're not the lead dog, the view always looks the same."
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 22:13     Subject: Re:If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:My DH turned out to be less intelligent and profound than he seemed when we were dating. I am attracted to men who are smarter than me, and unfortunately he is not.
I am not going to divorce him.

As to the "winner", I don't care about that.


This could have been me.


Wow is this harsh and critical.
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 22:08     Subject: Re:If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:My DH turned out to be less intelligent and profound than he seemed when we were dating. I am attracted to men who are smarter than me, and unfortunately he is not.
I am not going to divorce him.

As to the "winner", I don't care about that.


I can understand this if you were talking about a 3rd or 4th date. But you MARRIED the guy. Didn't you know him?


That's what I was thinking. We've all seen guys like this. But not for a third date.
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 21:40     Subject: If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:This happened to me, the morphing of a 'winner' into a beta that had setback after setback. Over the course of 15 years or so.

I was prepared to stick it out, come whatever may, because I actually believed in the vows I took. Call me old-fashioned. Also, a change in health status seemed to play a part, and I felt bad for him. Still, it was really hard to watch a C-level guy with so. much. potential. slip into a professional near-failure. But I kept silent and was supportive, helpful, and tried to be kind.

Here's the weird part: he turned on ME. Everything that happened to him, it turns out, was my fault. I wasn't an enthusiastic enough sex partner. I didn't spend enough time on my appearance. I didn't contribute enough to the HHI. I was "lazy." I was a hick. I was pedantic. I was negative. I was fat. I was entitled. My family was stupid and fat and entitled.

So, we went our separate ways. My compassion and support is completely gone, as you might suspect.


I have seen this in other cases, too. I hope that your life is better now.


Did he ever get assessed for depression? A man who becomes unproductive and slips into failure accompanied by newish anger, negativity and irritability. Sounds like depression.
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 21:27     Subject: Re:If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
Anonymous wrote:My DH turned out to be less intelligent and profound than he seemed when we were dating. I am attracted to men who are smarter than me, and unfortunately he is not.
I am not going to divorce him.

As to the "winner", I don't care about that.


This could have been me.
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 21:15     Subject: If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
As long as he wasn't hiding in the basement and refusing to work, hell no! And even if he was I would think he was mentally ill, thus the "in sickness and in health" part, so no again.
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 21:09     Subject: If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If he was turning out to be less successful professionally than you thought he would be (like not being partner material), would you consider divorce? What if you were getting the impression that he was turning out to be more "beta" than "alpha" mail in professional or social situations?


My husband as been under or unemployed for the 7+ years I've known him. I knew he was "behind" professionally and financially when we met, but I thought he had potential. I'm not so sure anymore. The more time that goes by, the more resentful I feel towards him and myself -- that I made such a poor choice in a partner.

DH is a terrific father to our toddler, he does more than his share of household upkeep, and he's one of the best persons I know in terms of character, generosity, integrity, etc. but all of this is overshadowed when I feel chronically stressed from the pressure of being the primary breadwinner. For this reason, I am no longer attracted to DH. I don't want or need a man to take care of me; I want a partnership where we are realizing our financial goals and dreams (college fund for DC, golden retirement, house, etc) together.

I feel lonely, depressed, and bleak about my future. I have no one to talk to about this, so I post anonymously on DCUM.


I feel exactly like what you wrote about 70% of the time. The rest of the time I'm so thankful to have a kind, generous, loving husband and father of my children. But that 70% feels pretty dark sometimes.
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 20:57     Subject: If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
Anonymous wrote:Why do I get this feeling that this was posted by a guy who wants to show how awful those womenfolk are?


+1000
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 20:40     Subject: If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
Anonymous wrote:There are only so many slots in corporate America or a big law firm. Isn't it unrealistic to think that every educated man out there is going to make it to that level?


Or that they'd want it? Like pp, I enjoy having a husband who's an active partner in our family, not just a paycheck.
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 20:29     Subject: If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
There are only so many slots in corporate America or a big law firm. Isn't it unrealistic to think that every educated man out there is going to make it to that level?
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 20:04     Subject: Re:If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
I don't think I would divorce my husband because he didn't make partner etc, I would however want to go to counseling if we had fundamental differences on what we valued and could not agree on the sacrifices to get there. For example if DH came home and decided to quit his job and start a business I would be upset. He could be working more hours getting the business off the ground while all household and childcare falls on me. We have financial obligations, I.e. mortgage, that we have to meet while the business is starting up. My job can be demanding at certain times and if I become the primary breadwinner I wouldn't want to jeopardize my job performance (just think of the 10 unexpected snow days). I'm not saying I wouldn't support DH but if he didn't think to include me in the decision making process and didn't have a plan to deal with the changes (I.e. could we rent out a room to help bring in extra income or his mom agrees to help out in the beginning), we would have big problems. The fact I had a family that struggled with money and value being frugal and planning way ahead with finances for the things that can be planned I would have lots of difficulty if I married a man that either was not like that or didn't bend enough my way that we could find a compromise.

So to the initial question if DH had the material expectations or lifestyle of a partner but never made partner or blamed me for not making partner then we would have a big problem. If he was lazy or had issues that he refused to address (ADD, depression, addiction etc) that resulted in him being unable to keep a job, again we would have issues. Short of those things, I don't care if DH didn't make partner, goes into upper management etc.
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 17:56     Subject: If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
Anonymous wrote:Dh will always be "winner material" in my eyes, always has been. I can't see that changing, ever.


+1 Over time, no partner will always make perfect decisions, but wedding vows and a lifetime commitment to the person we view as a "winner" can make all the difference in a marriage.
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 17:50     Subject: If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:When I met my DH at the age of 20, I just fell in love. It did not even cross my brain if he was alpha or his earing potential. As far as earning potential, we are truly a team and I've never though of him as someone who is required to support me. I've always thought that we would support US and that is how it has been.

In my case, my DH turned out to be a hard worker and moderately ambitious, but he puts family first so he will never be a c-level exec. He enjoys coaching sports teams and likes to be home early. We will "make do" on his 180K/yr salary and mine that is close behind.

I'm in it for life, going 17 years strong since the day we met.



180k salary is pretty successful in my book.


I think my DH is successful, don't get me wrong, but the question was about someone making partner. Clearly if someone was disappointed that their DH was a loser because he did not make partner, they would think my DH a huge loser. Partners make much more than my DH.

Frankly, I could never be married to a man who is married to his job, which is one of the reasons I work. If my DH were the primary earner, I would be he would have to work a heck of a lot more in a more stressful job. No thanks, I like having dinner each night with the whole family at 6PM.


+1! I love having DH come home for dinner every night. "Alpha" and "winner" are childish terms used by immature people. OP, is your partner there for his kids? For you? How much of your DH's time, love and psyche are you willing to sacrifice for superficial benchmarks? Here's an alternative: If you're so dissatisfied, why don't you go out and be "alpha" and/or "winner" yourself?
Anonymous
Post 03/19/2014 17:47     Subject: If you decided your husband was no longer "winner" material, would you divorce him?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:When I met my DH at the age of 20, I just fell in love. It did not even cross my brain if he was alpha or his earing potential. As far as earning potential, we are truly a team and I've never though of him as someone who is required to support me. I've always thought that we would support US and that is how it has been.

In my case, my DH turned out to be a hard worker and moderately ambitious, but he puts family first so he will never be a c-level exec. He enjoys coaching sports teams and likes to be home early. We will "make do" on his 180K/yr salary and mine that is close behind.

I'm in it for life, going 17 years strong since the day we met.



180k salary is pretty successful in my book.


I think my DH is successful, don't get me wrong, but the question was about someone making partner. Clearly if someone was disappointed that their DH was a loser because he did not make partner, they would think my DH a huge loser. Partners make much more than my DH.

Frankly, I could never be married to a man who is married to his job, which is one of the reasons I work. If my DH were the primary earner, I would be he would have to work a heck of a lot more in a more stressful job. No thanks, I like having dinner each night with the whole family at 6PM.