Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 17:43     Subject: Re:Husband Turned Catholic on Me
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I totally feel for you, OP. I'm married to a Catholic - family is South American and he attended 12 years of Catholic school including all boy HS. I initially agreed to be married in the Catholic church. DH wanted the priest for whom he'd been an altar boy to marry us. We started taking the classes and, honestly, neither of us could continue. We couldn't agree to have a "Catholic" marriage and were, therefore, married by a clergywoman of a different faith.

My DH sounds a lot like yours. I think the Catholic Church has done great things for the impoverished and for social justice for some groups. A PP wrote that most Catholics don't agree with the more conservative aspects of Catholic church and just ignore what they don't like. That's not acceptable to the church. I did learn a lot about the Catholic Church and I know that the church would not consider those peoples to be Catholics in good standing and that they should not take communion - (and it says so on every program. DH still considers himself Catholic but he was not allowed to take communion at his mother's funeral. We tried a number of other churches but DH missed the rituals of the Catholic Church. It felt comforting and familiar to him. I get that. But, I'm not willing to teach our kids one thing and the church tell them something else.

It wouldn't bother me so much if my DH returned to church but it would bother me greatly if he made a unilateral decision to go to the 11AM mass on Sundays. I agree with a PP who suggested talking to him about what need is fulfilled by the church and how both of your needs could be met. If it were me, I could total seeing this sending us back to relationship counseling. I just can't see supporting an organization that is so diametrically opposed to and working against some issues that I feel so strongly about. There must be a different way to meet his needs. Hugs


You've been to every single Catholic church in the world and viewed their program? Wow. Funny, but mine doesn't say that. There's no litmus test before communion. My priest knows my feelings on many issues and has never told me I'm a Catholic in poor standing. Is the church perfect? No. Bur as both I and a PP have noted, OP, and several of her supporters, are as closed minded, bigoted and oppressive as any religious person I have ever met.


Your church may be more open but the church my DH grew up in - St. Louis Catholic Church in Alexandria - is not. Nor, with the exception of Good Shepherd, have we been to a Catholic Church near us that did not include that little program note asking people not to take communion if they were not in good standing. Could there be others that don't have that? Sure but the fact that the Church allows any of them to put that in the program shows that stance does not contradict Catholic Church doctrine - the Church supports that position. You may be willing to overlook or ignore the tenents of the Catholic faith that you don't like but you can't call people who disagree, or who find certain stances of the Catholic Church abhorrent, to be close minded/bigoted/oppressive. Actually, it's ironic that you'd consider us that since one of the reasons I couldn't be Catholic is that I believe there are many paths to heaven (not just through Jesus) and I believe in gay marriage. That's pretty much the opposite of close minded and bigoted. Of course, those may not be big issues for you. But, they are for a number of people, including OP. That you can't understand why those issues alone, not to mention birth control and the role of women in the church, would be deal breakers really shows how narrow minded you and those like you are. There's a reason the Catholic Church is dying in America. Growing numbers of Americans can no longer in good conscience follow its teachings.
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 17:43     Subject: Husband Turned Catholic on Me
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Ignore PP.

Sounds like you need a good therapist/counselor to help you and husband walk through this. There are strong feelings and mixed emotions. You would benefit from having a third, neutral party help navigate this minefield.

Tell your husband to want to see a counselor to help talk this through. You want to better understand where he's coming from and what this means for your family. Tell him that you have a lot of feelings and questions and feel it would be more productive to have someone facilitate that discussion.


Seriously????? He's coming back to the Church and finding his Faith. It's not like he's having an extramarrital affair or having addiction problems which do warrant therapy!


Come on, don't be so reactionary. This is clearly a hot-button issue for this couple. Or at the very least for this poster. Therapy isn't just when a spouse is having an affair. And it's not about fixing her husband or chastising him. It's about communicating effectively that you can better understand your partner. You can think what you want about OP, but her feelings are her feelings. She's upset and needs to work this through with her spouse. Since she is angry and because one's religion is a pretty intense and serious topic, having a third party help them through this might be a good idea.
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 17:40     Subject: Husband Turned Catholic on Me
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I'd meet with a divorce lawyer, to be honest. There's no space for oppressive religions in our marriage.


+1


+2
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 17:33     Subject: Re:Husband Turned Catholic on Me
My husband and I are not religious, but when our child was little she was an early riser. I checked out every sunday morning service in our area just for something to do with her when she was a toddler.

Amazingly, none of us were contaminated. We stopped visiting churches when my child began self-identifying as an atheist.

I'd suggest your husband take the children to church with him. Then you don't have to be angry about being left alone to deal with them and he can introduce them to something that's important to him. I shared the story above because exposing children to religion isn't a guarantee the children will take to religion.

For religious people who are wondering why I took my kid to churches, I was raised in a church and it was wonderful for me as a child. We visited churches both to expose my child to the experience but also to see if there happened to be a church that had a social environment similar to the church in which I grew up. It made sense to me when I was brain storming what there was to do with a child at 6am on a sunday.
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 17:02     Subject: Husband Turned Catholic on Me
DH is not imposing his need for spiritual life on his DW. It is the same as if he chose to go to the gym on Sunday morning. I don't understand why OP and some of the other PPs think this is such a big deal.
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 16:41     Subject: Husband Turned Catholic on Me
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:NP here. I would get to a marriage counselor and work out how you are going to handle his spiritual practice, his expectations of you, and the raising of your children.

I grew up Catholic, left the church, would not chosen a Catholic partner, and would never allow my children to be taken to a Catholic church, CCD, a Catholic school, or taught to be Catholic. A conversion (or renewal of faith) on the part of my husband in this regard would be the cause for some serious conversations that would be best facilitated by a marriage counselor. He (my DH) is a non-practicing Episcopalian, and the same would be true if he wanted us to start going to church with him. (Going to church on his own would be fine with me, if I had a different block of time during the week for my own use.)


Okay, here's a tip for folks out there - atheists and people if any religious background should probably not marry.


Are you the same poster who said that about jews and nonjews? Because I still think your logic is inherently flawed. Marriage is not simply about religion. Religion is just one aspect of marital life, like sex, ILs, children, friends, extended family gatherings, holidays, work and parenting styles, and interests in common. I'm an ex-Catholic married to a non-practicing Jew and we've been happily married for nearly two decades now. It's not about religion, but about proportion: can each person respect the other's need for religion v. secularism? If one can't accept the other's view point, or if one or both partners change views to the point of incompatibility, a conflict occurs. This can even occur within marriages of the same denomination if one partner suddenly becomes radically more devout than the other.

Simply blaming the problem on intermarriage ignores the fact that the conflict is between two people, rather than the religions (or any demographic, IMHO) involved.
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 16:39     Subject: Husband Turned Catholic on Me
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Op, why don't you and the kids go with dh to church, before you decide it's so horrible??? At least try it.


Instead, go with DH to mass on a Saturday evening, keep the kids at home, get a sitter, go to dinner afterward and discuss your concerns between the two of you. Catholicism is a big, big commitment, and a lot of work, which is one of the reasons that I left.


I wouldn't say that it is a big commitment and a lot of work. I'm no longer Catholic but when I was I just went when I felt like it.


+1. You people are hilarious. The church doesn't threaten or harass you if you don't come to Mass.


But, if you don't go to mass and follow Catholic tenents then the church doesn't consider you Catholic and you're not allowed to fully participate. I don't get why people think they're Catholic if they don't follow the teachings of the church.


Are you 85 years old? In the years since Vatican II, almost all American Catholics use birth control. More than half are I'm favor of gay marriage. The bishops and parish priests know this. They don't ask because if they did, they know they'd have no church left. And as Catjolics, we don't throw out the baby with the bathwater.
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 16:35     Subject: Husband Turned Catholic on Me
Op, did you do any premarital counselling where these issues weee discussed?
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 16:33     Subject: Re:Husband Turned Catholic on Me
Anonymous wrote:I totally feel for you, OP. I'm married to a Catholic - family is South American and he attended 12 years of Catholic school including all boy HS. I initially agreed to be married in the Catholic church. DH wanted the priest for whom he'd been an altar boy to marry us. We started taking the classes and, honestly, neither of us could continue. We couldn't agree to have a "Catholic" marriage and were, therefore, married by a clergywoman of a different faith.

My DH sounds a lot like yours. I think the Catholic Church has done great things for the impoverished and for social justice for some groups. A PP wrote that most Catholics don't agree with the more conservative aspects of Catholic church and just ignore what they don't like. That's not acceptable to the church. I did learn a lot about the Catholic Church and I know that the church would not consider those peoples to be Catholics in good standing and that they should not take communion - (and it says so on every program. DH still considers himself Catholic but he was not allowed to take communion at his mother's funeral. We tried a number of other churches but DH missed the rituals of the Catholic Church. It felt comforting and familiar to him. I get that. But, I'm not willing to teach our kids one thing and the church tell them something else.

It wouldn't bother me so much if my DH returned to church but it would bother me greatly if he made a unilateral decision to go to the 11AM mass on Sundays. I agree with a PP who suggested talking to him about what need is fulfilled by the church and how both of your needs could be met. If it were me, I could total seeing this sending us back to relationship counseling. I just can't see supporting an organization that is so diametrically opposed to and working against some issues that I feel so strongly about. There must be a different way to meet his needs. Hugs


You've been to every single Catholic church in the world and viewed their program? Wow. Funny, but mine doesn't say that. There's no litmus test before communion. My priest knows my feelings on many issues and has never told me I'm a Catholic in poor standing. Is the church perfect? No. Bur as both I and a PP have noted, OP, and several of her supporters, are as closed minded, bigoted and oppressive as any religious person I have ever met.
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 16:29     Subject: Husband Turned Catholic on Me
Anonymous wrote:NP here. I would get to a marriage counselor and work out how you are going to handle his spiritual practice, his expectations of you, and the raising of your children.

I grew up Catholic, left the church, would not chosen a Catholic partner, and would never allow my children to be taken to a Catholic church, CCD, a Catholic school, or taught to be Catholic. A conversion (or renewal of faith) on the part of my husband in this regard would be the cause for some serious conversations that would be best facilitated by a marriage counselor. He (my DH) is a non-practicing Episcopalian, and the same would be true if he wanted us to start going to church with him. (Going to church on his own would be fine with me, if I had a different block of time during the week for my own use.)


Okay, here's a tip for folks out there - atheists and people if any religious background should probably not marry.
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 16:26     Subject: Husband Turned Catholic on Me
Anonymous wrote:OP here. Here is what I know from my years of marriage to my DH. He attended Catholic schools, as did his parents and grand-parents and he strongly identifies with the Church culturally. He is of Polish-American heritage, so the Catholicism also plays into his strong sense of Polish - American ethnic identity. He says he strongly believes in what he sees as the Church's social mission - to educate the ignorant, feed the hungry, clothe the naked, take care of the sick, etc. He is conflicted about issues like abortion (not birth control though), and can see how there is a human rights argument to be made for protecting the unborn, as well as the aged and sick when it comes to issues like euthanasia. As far as the whole marriage equality thing goes, he has friends who are gay, says gay marriage is a civil not a religious matter and that no one - gay or straight - needs to be married in the Church.

I grew up in a basically atheist family and have no religious upbringing or background. I just don't understand what he would find he needs in the Church. I am able to get along without God.


Well, your last two sentences show the extent to which your mind is closed. I doubt you will ever be able to speak with DH in a productive way or try to accept his beliefs or feelings. So again I say, I feel sorry for him. It would be hard to be married to someone with that kind of narrow mindset.
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 16:25     Subject: Husband Turned Catholic on Me
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Op, why don't you and the kids go with dh to church, before you decide it's so horrible??? At least try it.


Instead, go with DH to mass on a Saturday evening, keep the kids at home, get a sitter, go to dinner afterward and discuss your concerns between the two of you. Catholicism is a big, big commitment, and a lot of work, which is one of the reasons that I left.


I wouldn't say that it is a big commitment and a lot of work. I'm no longer Catholic but when I was I just went when I felt like it.


+1. You people are hilarious. The church doesn't threaten or harass you if you don't come to Mass.


But, if you don't go to mass and follow Catholic tenents then the church doesn't consider you Catholic and you're not allowed to fully participate. I don't get why people think they're Catholic if they don't follow the teachings of the church.
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 16:21     Subject: Husband Turned Catholic on Me
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Op, why don't you and the kids go with dh to church, before you decide it's so horrible??? At least try it.


Instead, go with DH to mass on a Saturday evening, keep the kids at home, get a sitter, go to dinner afterward and discuss your concerns between the two of you. Catholicism is a big, big commitment, and a lot of work, which is one of the reasons that I left.


I wouldn't say that it is a big commitment and a lot of work. I'm no longer Catholic but when I was I just went when I felt like it.


+1. You people are hilarious. The church doesn't threaten or harass you if you don't come to Mass.
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 16:03     Subject: Husband Turned Catholic on Me
This would not be OK with me.

I would have it out with him in huge detail, go over all the reasons why the whole business is ridiculous. from Noah's Arc to the virgin birth to the priestly celibacy, to the bread and wine literally turning into the body and blood of Christ, not to mention the kiddy-fiddling and whatever else.

If after all of that he still wanted to go to church, I would let him, but my affection would inevitably be somewhat tempered with contempt.
Anonymous
Post 01/05/2014 15:52     Subject: Husband Turned Catholic on Me
OP, I think it probably makes sense to at least meet a few times with a marriage counselor--not because either of you is in the wrong, but because this sounds like a major shift in the marriage and it does bring up some questions about the raising of your children.

DH and I have very different worldviews. He is an avowed atheist and I don't think that will ever change. Though I am not religious I consider myself to be a spiritual person and I pray daily, read spiritual books, etc, etc. I spend a couple hours every week meeting with a group of likeminded spiritual thinkers and to me, this is essential to my being a good wife and mom. Like your DH, I don't ask or expect DH or our kids to take part.

I have offered DH an evening a week to recharge his batteries in whatever way he sees fit, which I think is fair, and it seems like in your case maybe he would do the same for you as PPs have suggested. I think there's a long track record of interfaith couples in which one partner's faith is atheism, so I don't think this spells doom, but it's important to keep in mind that we all have different needs, beliefs, and paths to take in life.