Here is a group of husbands and wives working through mental illness issues.
http://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?board=6.0

When we encounter high conflict or destructive relationship behaviors it is important for us to know that the problems can be caused by a broad range of things that look a lot a like:

immaturity,
short term mental illness (e.g., depression),
substance induced illness (e.g., alcoholism),
a mood disorder (e.g., bipolar),
an anxiety disorder (e.g., PTSD),
a personality disorder (e.g., BPD, NPD, 8 others),
a neurodevelopmental disorder (e.g., ADHD, Aspergers), or
any combination of the above (i.e., co-morbidity).

This video may help:

That's a tough situation.

If drugs/alcohol are involved, you could try Al-Anon. They might be able to help you out. But, if this was happening at such as early age, I wonder if there is a brain development issue.

People sometimes change only when they hit "rock-bottom," which usually requires them to sincerely believe that they are about to die, and the mortal terror shocks them into changing. Either that (or because of that) they get super-religious and sublimate their craziness into now being crazy for Jesus.

OMG, I have knots in my stomach after reading this thread. I hope some of the obviously enlightened previous posters can answer a few questions for me.

A little background.
I'm the Father of a Beautiful, very smart and kindest, sweetest young Adult daughter in the World. Except when she has "spells"`.

She started these uncontrollable rage episodes around 12. We discovered she was cutting herself around 14 after it had been going on for some time. We took her to a Therapists, of which after a few visits, then refused to go back. We've taken her to the ER after one night of severe cutting and talk of suicide. It would take a few thousand words on my part to fully describe her behavior and the anguish of it all. I have made mistakes dealing with those behaviors, thinking it was just an unruly child. Not one time did anyone suggest a cause or possible diagnosis. Two yrs ago after a length of rage after turning 18, I convinced her to see a Psychiatrist. Being of legal age, we are no longer privy to her medical care. She was put on anit-anxiety medication after the first session. No Therapy at all. The Psychiatrist simply keeps filling the prescription. Which has helped with the rage issue, but nothing else. It wasn't until a couple mths ago that I came across the BPD description. It floored me. I have no doubt she's afflicted with it. I have read much on the Internet. I've pretty much concluded that it is beyond my ability to help her and that she needs a professional therapist. She simply is failing at everything in life right now. She has a good heart and does want to succeed. She just can't get her life turned around.

I've tried talking her into going to a Therapists, but she refuses and says she only needs the drugs for anxiety. I've read so many conflicting things about BPD that I don't know what to believe. It saddens me that this thread is so conflicting and there doesn't appear to be more agreement on specific treatments. My impression is that most Professionals think it is a mistake to tell the person they have BPD. Is that the thought of the experienced posters that have lived this journey ? I keep thinking if I tell her about the possible cause of her behavior, that it might be the motivation to get her into Therapy. If not that, then how do I convince her to seek professional help ?

I'm so lost. My daughter is in danger every day she doesn't get better.

Sure, sometimes.

But her spouse hasn't been diagnosed with anything. She talked to a therapist who offered a speculative "diagnosis" someone she has never met.

Or that people are leaving marriages for the right reasons (self preservation, protection of children) rather than leaving because of a fixable issue like boredom, poor communication etc. Living with a BPD spouse will take you and your kids DOWN.

It just seems like everyone's ex has BPD, is a sociopath, is a narcissist, etc.

People may talk about BPD more these days but I don't think it's more common. Just that people have access to more information about it and can identify it as a possible reason for the bat-shit crazy.

Anonymous wrote:Borderline Personality Disorder is the new black these days.

No therapist has any business opining that someone may have BPD unless that therapist has evaluated the person. BPD is very difficult to diagnose -- you don't do it secondhand.

And your therapist is wrong. BPD is not all about thoughts. It is all about emotions. The emotions always come first. Then the thoughts. Then the actions. BPD is about emotion disregulation.

And yes, there are successful treatments for BPD. The include Dialectical Behavioral Therapy, Schema Therapy, and Mentalization Based therapy. Many people with BPD get better.

I also recommend reading "When Hope is not Enough" by Bon Dobbs and visiting his website www.anythingtostopthepain.com. He can give you tools to save your marriage.

But that's not what you want to hear. You want a pass to leave your spouse, and I'll leave everyone else on DCUM to give it to you. No mental illness is more stigmatized or more misunderstood than BPD. So grab yourself a copy of Randi Kreger's Stop Walking on Eggshells, a couple cookies and a nice cup of tea. That book will have you filing for divorce before you can finish it. And since it so terribly written, that may be half the reason.

+1

Anonymous wrote:I posted way back somewhere in this thread. I divorced a NPD who is either a sociopath, or at the very least was diagnosed as engaging in sociopathic behaviors.

My heart goes out to you too, OP. I wish I could help.

Hang in there. He's never going to get better, and I'm so sorry.

+10000
For all of us going through this. It's rough stuff, but being out is the first and most important step. Now you can begin to heal.

I posted way back somewhere in this thread. I divorced a NPD who is either a sociopath, or at the very least was diagnosed as engaging in sociopathic behaviors.

My heart goes out to you too, OP. I wish I could help.

Hang in there. He's never going to get better, and I'm so sorry.

Anonymous wrote:OP here. We do have a child, and no currently my husband has decided he does NOT need help and does NOT need to get better.

I do hear of people with BPD coming to terms with the DX and doing what they can to manage their condition. I do not hold out hope for my soon to be ex husband because he has committed to doing it "his way" which consists of doing whatever he wants and smoking weed.

I'm the PP with the BPD ex-fiance.

I don't know if they aren't aware of their issues, or feel they'll be destroyed (abandoned) if they admit any flaw. Certainly the overt blame for any problems always fell on the 'healthy' partner.

Oddly, smoking weed was the single thing that seemed to alleviate her all consuming anxiety, fear or paranoia...your stbex is likely self-medicating.

Yeah, your DD may mourn the loss of the old dad, but she's better off growing up out from underneath of a toxic person.

Anonymous wrote:Key thing for you: does he recognize something is wrong? Seeking psychiatric treatment? DBT probably good treatment and can even help healthy people in emotional regulation, so make sure you pursue that. May be worth looking at long term residency programs if you have the financial resources such as Gunderson Reisdence at McLean Hospital; long term intensive therapy can make lasting changes. Key is he has to want to change.

OP - I am so sorry. If you don't have kids, then all the better. You are describing my ex. I have posted here before, and I spent years, $$$, trying to get him help, which he refused because he didn't believe he had a problem. Or he would show up to a couple of appointments and play the sensitive nice guy and fool the therapist. My health suffered tremendously, I saw myself becoming a person I didn't like in response to his illness and inconsistent behavior and irresponsibility. Becoming a caretaker/parent for a spouse can set you up for a rough dynamic, especially if the spouse doesn't recognize they need help. In my case I believe it was always there, but he was able to compensate for it until life got stressful and more difficult (recession, middle age, kids, being a grown up).

So I left him since we were at an impasse, and he said he would not stay in the marriage if it meant getting help. My kids and I are grieving, but in a healthier environment and getting good therapy. Ex is sponging off friends, unemployed, no car, no house, and still believes nothing is his fault or responsibility. I agree that a marriage can be saved, and a person with BPD can function and get help, but only if they are willing to do the hard work. He needs to get a neuropsych eval, take meds as rx'd, eat well, exercise, do some BMT. Whatever helps. But if he can't see that there is a problem, then I don't see much hope for your relationship. You will lose yourself trying to save him.

OP here. We do have a child, and no currently my husband has decided he does NOT need help and does NOT need to get better. This is why leaving was the only option (its now been almost a month)

Before the diagnosis he had admitted to having problems but that the only REAL problem was that I should forgive him for his rages and abuse. But before THAT he was actually slightly more aware and seemed to want to improve himself but didnt know how.

So as he got more and more ridiculously toxic it just became clear that the impasse was never going to go away. In fact, I had begun to suspect that he would never improve as long as I remained with him.

My daughter and I do grieve the loss of "Daddy One", meaning the guy that has been replaced with the current version, which is agitated, edgy, looking for opportunities to be offended and wears a forced smile. Its hard to watch but we have good therapy in place and are doing the best we can.

I do hear of people with BPD coming to terms with the DX and doing what they can to manage their condition. I do not hold out hope for my soon to be ex husband because he has committed to doing it "his way" which consists of doing whatever he wants and smoking weed.

Key thing for you: does he recognize something is wrong? Seeking psychiatric treatment? DBT probably good treatment and can even help healthy people in emotional regulation, so make sure you pursue that. May be worth looking at long term residency programs if you have the financial resources such as Gunderson Reisdence at McLean Hospital; long term intensive therapy can make lasting changes. Key is he has to want to change.

OP - I am so sorry. If you don't have kids, then all the better. You are describing my ex. I have posted here before, and I spent years, $$$, trying to get him help, which he refused because he didn't believe he had a problem. Or he would show up to a couple of appointments and play the sensitive nice guy and fool the therapist. My health suffered tremendously, I saw myself becoming a person I didn't like in response to his illness and inconsistent behavior and irresponsibility. Becoming a caretaker/parent for a spouse can set you up for a rough dynamic, especially if the spouse doesn't recognize they need help. In my case I believe it was always there, but he was able to compensate for it until life got stressful and more difficult (recession, middle age, kids, being a grown up).

So I left him since we were at an impasse, and he said he would not stay in the marriage if it meant getting help. My kids and I are grieving, but in a healthier environment and getting good therapy. Ex is sponging off friends, unemployed, no car, no house, and still believes nothing is his fault or responsibility. I agree that a marriage can be saved, and a person with BPD can function and get help, but only if they are willing to do the hard work. He needs to get a neuropsych eval, take meds as rx'd, eat well, exercise, do some BMT. Whatever helps. But if he can't see that there is a problem, then I don't see much hope for your relationship. You will lose yourself trying to save him.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:- signed, someone who left a BPD (who lost her shit for about oh 2 weeks, then hooked the next guy).

OP here- WOW this thread being bumped back up is SO timely. My husband has in the meantime been definitively diagnosed with BPD by his psychiatrist. I left him just before, when he had another and FINAL rage outburst, this time in front of our daughter, charging at me getting in my face AGAIN. And it was game over.

My reasons for wanting to know what I was dealing with diagnosis wise OR understanding wise was so I could have some idea if it was fixable. Interestingly, I have figured out that the meds he was on for depression cleared up some of his fog, but only revealed more deep underlying severe problems in relating to the world. The unstable sense of self is at the core. I could not tell for a while if he was "losing it" and could regain it or if he was simply cracking at the foundation that was not up to code in the first place.

Im not sure how pathologizing figures in here as a negative. He has pathological behaviors and there is no other way to acknowledge them except to do that. You are right, I did not need the diagnosis to know if I had enough, but I personally did need to know the diagnosis to know if there was any point in trying to reason with him. Again, the meds cleared his depression but revealed his very clear deliberate toxic choices.

Im on a support group now for spouses of BPD, and I agree with a previous poster that if its your KID, its another matter. I would go to the ends of the earth to try to help my kid if she had it. My husband I needed to cut loose to survive emotionally and now rescue my daughter from more damage than already has been done by his recent behavior towards her.

I still need to call that therapist and tell her she nailed it, eventhough she never definitively said that was the diagnosis, only that his behaviors and attitudes sounded like it.

Anyone dealing with BPD in a loved one, you might want to try this forum: http://outofthefog.net/

I'm the person you quoted.

My reason for making a big deal about pathologizing your husband is that often people feel the need to erroneously paint people black in order to do what they want and know they need to do OR they use lack of a definitive diagnosis as an excuse to avoid doing the same.

My response was from your original post, but your husband, based on your follow-up comments, was pretty clearly abusive regardless of diagnosis. That's reason enough to leave, particularly if there are children involved. Good for you that you went ahead and did that.

BPD is a sneaky nightmare. I was stunned at how much better I felt almost immediately after freeing myself of my fiance. She managed to get pregnant by the next guy, very quickly, so he's on the hook.

I feel so bad for the kid.

OP here. So sorry to hear. Its amazing how many people deal with this type of situation. Im only a few weeks into the separation and already my husband has lost it on our kid, for, GET THIS: telling me his new housemate creeped her out by taking her picture and saying he is going to send it to his friend and tell him she is his new girlfriend. He is 49 and she is 8. So he REAMED her for having told ME first- it had just happened while I was on the phone with DH and all DH cared about was that this was an affront to HIS control. She should have told HIM first because he was with her, not me.

?!?!?

Way to go dad. She told him what he was saying was "stupid". Good for her. BONUS CONCERN: new housemate, creep? DH has known him for years, and it may have just been a joke, but DH used this moment to ream our daughter, and then tell her that "I cant live with your mommy because she is controlling".

Wheeeee. its gonna be a fun ride. But every single instance that I am here and he is not, and I have my child with me (overnights only at his parents house because she is creeped out by creepy comment guy as would anyone who is normal) life IS better.

But there will be dreadful business ahead for sure.