Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anyway, it's a complicated issue, to be sure, but OP, I'm glad like all of these complex issues your acquaintances have managed to put these in the "Judgment Box" so they can avoid actually talking about it. Sigh.

Hello pot (calling the kettle black, as it were)! Judging me for putting on my judgey shoes? A little hypocritical?

Look, I posted something that I thought was ironic. I blatantly poked fun at myself in doing so, and made sure to note that what this woman does is none of my damn business.

This unanticipated discussion is important and relevant, and welcome. But deciding you know who I am, what my "acquaintances" talk about, and whether we're good people is going too far. We gave up our nearby families, friends, good schools, and home that we loved to come try to do a meaningful job that would help our country in our small way. The people I've met working for our country are dedicated and hard working, and treat the people who work with them kindly and respectfully. Don't sit at home and tell me who I am or what I believe in. Remember that there's a person on the other end of this, far away from home and doing her best. Discussions and questions are important. Throwing insults and *sighing* in your weary way, from the comfort of home, is insulting and hypocritical.

Oh please. State Department bureaucrats, totally self interested.

Shame on you. Really.

Oh is like the military now?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anyway, it's a complicated issue, to be sure, but OP, I'm glad like all of these complex issues your acquaintances have managed to put these in the "Judgment Box" so they can avoid actually talking about it. Sigh.

Hello pot (calling the kettle black, as it were)! Judging me for putting on my judgey shoes? A little hypocritical?

Look, I posted something that I thought was ironic. I blatantly poked fun at myself in doing so, and made sure to note that what this woman does is none of my damn business.

This unanticipated discussion is important and relevant, and welcome. But deciding you know who I am, what my "acquaintances" talk about, and whether we're good people is going too far. We gave up our nearby families, friends, good schools, and home that we loved to come try to do a meaningful job that would help our country in our small way. The people I've met working for our country are dedicated and hard working, and treat the people who work with them kindly and respectfully. Don't sit at home and tell me who I am or what I believe in. Remember that there's a person on the other end of this, far away from home and doing her best. Discussions and questions are important. Throwing insults and *sighing* in your weary way, from the comfort of home, is insulting and hypocritical.

Oh please. State Department bureaucrats, totally self interested.

http://www.npr.org/2013/04/08/176543510/smedinghoff-died-doing-what-she-loved

Yeah, she was totally self-interested.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anyway, it's a complicated issue, to be sure, but OP, I'm glad like all of these complex issues your acquaintances have managed to put these in the "Judgment Box" so they can avoid actually talking about it. Sigh.

Hello pot (calling the kettle black, as it were)! Judging me for putting on my judgey shoes? A little hypocritical?

Look, I posted something that I thought was ironic. I blatantly poked fun at myself in doing so, and made sure to note that what this woman does is none of my damn business.

This unanticipated discussion is important and relevant, and welcome. But deciding you know who I am, what my "acquaintances" talk about, and whether we're good people is going too far. We gave up our nearby families, friends, good schools, and home that we loved to come try to do a meaningful job that would help our country in our small way. The people I've met working for our country are dedicated and hard working, and treat the people who work with them kindly and respectfully. Don't sit at home and tell me who I am or what I believe in. Remember that there's a person on the other end of this, far away from home and doing her best. Discussions and questions are important. Throwing insults and *sighing* in your weary way, from the comfort of home, is insulting and hypocritical.

Oh please. State Department bureaucrats, totally self interested.

Shame on you. Really.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anyway, it's a complicated issue, to be sure, but OP, I'm glad like all of these complex issues your acquaintances have managed to put these in the "Judgment Box" so they can avoid actually talking about it. Sigh.

Hello pot (calling the kettle black, as it were)! Judging me for putting on my judgey shoes? A little hypocritical?

Look, I posted something that I thought was ironic. I blatantly poked fun at myself in doing so, and made sure to note that what this woman does is none of my damn business.

This unanticipated discussion is important and relevant, and welcome. But deciding you know who I am, what my "acquaintances" talk about, and whether we're good people is going too far. We gave up our nearby families, friends, good schools, and home that we loved to come try to do a meaningful job that would help our country in our small way. The people I've met working for our country are dedicated and hard working, and treat the people who work with them kindly and respectfully. Don't sit at home and tell me who I am or what I believe in. Remember that there's a person on the other end of this, far away from home and doing her best. Discussions and questions are important. Throwing insults and *sighing* in your weary way, from the comfort of home, is insulting and hypocritical.

Oh please. State Department bureaucrats, totally self interested.

Anonymous wrote:
Anyway, it's a complicated issue, to be sure, but OP, I'm glad like all of these complex issues your acquaintances have managed to put these in the "Judgment Box" so they can avoid actually talking about it. Sigh.

Hello pot (calling the kettle black, as it were)! Judging me for putting on my judgey shoes? A little hypocritical?

Look, I posted something that I thought was ironic. I blatantly poked fun at myself in doing so, and made sure to note that what this woman does is none of my damn business.

This unanticipated discussion is important and relevant, and welcome. But deciding you know who I am, what my "acquaintances" talk about, and whether we're good people is going too far. We gave up our nearby families, friends, good schools, and home that we loved to come try to do a meaningful job that would help our country in our small way. The people I've met working for our country are dedicated and hard working, and treat the people who work with them kindly and respectfully. Don't sit at home and tell me who I am or what I believe in. Remember that there's a person on the other end of this, far away from home and doing her best. Discussions and questions are important. Throwing insults and *sighing* in your weary way, from the comfort of home, is insulting and hypocritical.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a high level job at a local sub of a huge south Asian co. My foreign coworkers tell me if I had the equivalent job in their country I'd have a nanny, a cook, a gardener, and a driver. Sounds good to me! As it is I'm on mat leave with my 7 month old (Canada) and my house is never as tidy as I want it to be, I seldom look as great as I want and it's a huge production just to go out for a pedicure (coordinating with dh so he could watch her).

But here's the thing that I think is being missed. In a number of those countries where labor is cheap enough for a middle class American to live on one income and still have a crew of domestic help, the reality is that those societies have very strong caste systems that make it difficult for people to move up in income and status. There are complicated issues. There is a reason why the labor is so cheap. And upward mobility is limited, especially in places where there are very strong ideas about class.

No, there's nothing wrong with employing a nanny. But I think the people who are commenting about having a cushy embassy hobby job and a team of domestic help are really commenting on participating in a certain kind of system where most people don't really have a lot of choice in what careers they pursue.

+1. One issue that arises for me personally is that our family in India both love their cheap labor and-- and this seems common-- mistrusts them at a deep level, as is true in any society where there are great disparities in wealth that the rich and (in India) middle class are able to take advantage of.

What would bother me is letting someone care for my children when my relatives won't allow someone to clean their houses unsupervised for fear that they will steal from them. (At least my Indian relatives follow the maid around with eagle eyes.)

Another thing that bugs me is because of our ideas about work and notions about what makes certain chores tedious beyond any measure of worth are grounded in capitalism and the market economy, the people who have LONG cared for children in these societies at all but the loneliest upper strata-- grandmothers, aunts, older sisters, mothers-- are being outsourced. Now, this is for their own good, we say, and there is sense to it: when women control their own checkbooks, they have power. Still. People can CLAIM there is no difference in a child's happiness, health, or future success-- however you define it-- if they are in the care of nannies most of the time, with only a kiss good-night to dear old mum, or if it's a cadre of raucous relatives caring for them (unrealistic, obviously, for OP, but not for many people in countries where the extended family system is now being eroded). Not to mention the gross injustice that many of these nannies caring for your kids are doing so at the expense of their own families. (To read: Mona Simpson's My Hollywood.)

Anyway, it's a complicated issue, to be sure, but OP, I'm glad like all of these complex issues your acquaintances have managed to put these in the "Judgment Box" so they can avoid actually talking about it. Sigh.

Anonymous wrote:I really don't understand why sahms need a nanny.

Signed
Wah/sahm

The good news is that if you feel like you don't need a nanny, then you don't have to have a nanny!

Anonymous wrote:I really don't understand why sahms need a nanny.

Signed
Wah/sahm

I am wah and sooo need a nanny. Even then I am overwhelmed with no time for me and DH gets to spend playtime with LO since I am cooking. Hats off to working moms!

I lived overseas many years and know many families who have nannies. I always laugh (to myself) when I see that the children almost always prefer the company of the nannies over the parents. While waiting in line at a restaurant, a nanny was brought along (so that the parents could eat their meal while the nanny looked after the kids). The entire time, the kids would interact with the nanny while the parents just stood there.

Anonymous wrote: But I think the people who are commenting about having a cushy embassy hobby job and a team of domestic help are really commenting on participating in a certain kind of system where most people don't really have a lot of choice in what careers they pursue.

I think they're commenting on participating in a certain kind of system where labor is cheap because many people are very poor. But if you want to call that "little choice in careers", ok.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That's funny OP. Just goes to show that people will always judge regardless. We judge you for having a nanny while staying at home and you in turn judge someone for having two nannies.

+2

thanks for posting this OP.
It goes to show that everything is relative.

Which country are you at, and are the women that are judgy towards the 3-nanny-SAHM other American expats or locals?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You have no idea what goes on in her house or her life. She may be the world's greatest mom.

'

Why do people love to assert that everyone has "no idea" what goes on in someone's house or life? Most people have some idea of what goes on in people's homes and lives. Unless you are actively hiding a major drug habit, domestic abuse, or terminal illness, it's usually pretty obvious pretty soon after getting to know someone.

Not that it's a reason to judge or be a bitch, it just irritates me that people act like all other humans' home lives are this unfathomable mystery when the habits and patterns are all pretty much the same with a few common variations.

People show you what they want you to see. That's how people end up marrying sociopaths, idiot. You get to "know" what people want you to know.

Anonymous wrote:I have a high level job at a local sub of a huge south Asian co. My foreign coworkers tell me if I had the equivalent job in their country I'd have a nanny, a cook, a gardener, and a driver. Sounds good to me! As it is I'm on mat leave with my 7 month old (Canada) and my house is never as tidy as I want it to be, I seldom look as great as I want and it's a huge production just to go out for a pedicure (coordinating with dh so he could watch her).

But here's the thing that I think is being missed. In a number of those countries where labor is cheap enough for a middle class American to live on one income and still have a crew of domestic help, the reality is that those societies have very strong caste systems that make it difficult for people to move up in income and status. There are complicated issues. There is a reason why the labor is so cheap. And upward mobility is limited, especially in places where there are very strong ideas about class.

No, there's nothing wrong with employing a nanny. But I think the people who are commenting about having a cushy embassy hobby job and a team of domestic help are really commenting on participating in a certain kind of system where most people don't really have a lot of choice in what careers they pursue.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OMG people. OF COURSE it would be great to have a huge class of domestic laborers to exploit. This has gone far beyond the Sah-woh debate.

Like that's not the reality today? Who the heck do you think picks your seedless grapes and packs your peaches in cling syrup? They are being exploited now. What I don't understand is, why is my nanny who is being paid $35,000+ a year, works not a minute over full-time, very regular hours, some bennies, apparently a living, breathing example of my apparent exploitative capitalistic evil, and yet you can sit back and stuff your face with all the fruits and vegetables at the grocery store that are there at those prices because many, many faceless and nameless people have worked under the hot sun for pennies to bring them to you? Do you not see your hypocrisy?

Exploitation goes on PLENTY in our bountiful wealthy country, and it's not the nannies that first spring to mind.

I have no issue with people who pay nannies (who are legally eligible to work in this country) a reasonable wage AND pay taxes.

The issue I have is with the many people (read some posts in other threads) who pay their nannies under the table and don't pay taxes or confirm residency status.

And frankly, I also take issue with other industries that exploit people. It's not like I'm *okay* with other people being exploited for labor. None of it is acceptable.

Anonymous wrote:You have no idea what goes on in her house or her life. She may be the world's greatest mom.

'

Why do people love to assert that everyone has "no idea" what goes on in someone's house or life? Most people have some idea of what goes on in people's homes and lives. Unless you are actively hiding a major drug habit, domestic abuse, or terminal illness, it's usually pretty obvious pretty soon after getting to know someone.

Not that it's a reason to judge or be a bitch, it just irritates me that people act like all other humans' home lives are this unfathomable mystery when the habits and patterns are all pretty much the same with a few common variations.