jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Folks can try to nitpick all they like, folks can try to shoot the messenger all they like, but none of that is relevant, from a big-picture standpoint.

Bottom line is, there is analysis after analysis out there, whether from conservative, liberal, or non-partisan sources - analyses using official DCPS and OSSE data and ALL showing DCPS spending per student to be well into the high 20,000s per student, if not higher.

Correct me if I am wrong, but aren't those figures arrived at by taking the total amount of spending and dividing by the total number of students? Because not all students receive an equal amount of funding, that figure is not particularly helpful -- other than to point out that it is way more than it should be. What I've heard from Catania is that the budget is so opaque that nobody really knows where the money is spent. A more helpful figure would be the number of dollars per student that actually make it down to the schools for the purpose of education.

well, whose fault is that, if it never makes it down to the schools? Doesn't that affrim the need for autonomous charters and fallacy of economies of scale, at least with respect to DCPS?

Anonymous wrote:The obvious problem here is that there simply aren't enough seats at "good schools". Enough seats would eliminate every paranoid scenario. Let's support the creation of schools parents want.

Having good schools in the first place would eliminate the paranoid scenario. But DCPS has not accomplished that.

As for the purpose charters serve best, it's in providing specialized offerings to fill in the gaps that DCPS obviously cannot fill.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP, first of all, I don't think anyone is seriously pursuing replacing the entire system - though if DCPS cannot get its act together, I would not be surprised if someone does propose a new model at some point. As for where they would go, there already are charters that specialize in things like disciplinary problems, special needs and so on - the things that kids might otherwise be "counseled out" for.

I guess that it doesn't count as serious, but the poster at 22:45 did write:

"Hopefully, the successful charters will ultimately expand to the point that DCPS is swept out..."

Don't fool yourself. There is a group in DC that I call "Charter fundamentalists" that fervently wants DCPS to be replaced entirely by Charter schools.

Personally, I think the disappearance of the neighborhood school would be a big loss.

I'm a charter supporter (not fundamentalist) and I agree with you that the loss of quality neighborhood schools would be a big loss. The operative word however is quality. Replacing the high performing schools - almost exclusively west of the park - with charters for no reason other than a policy agenda would be beyond foolish. Charter supporters would do well to acknowledge and respect the valuable ingredient successful schools bring to their neighborhoods. By the same token, poor performing neighborhood schools are one more institution that helps to ossify the dysfunctional dynamics in many of the lower SES, high crime neighborhoods, of which this city has all too many. The value of some of those schools is largely historical, and the fact that new charters can come in to the same neighborhoods and educate the same students with superior outcomes is is powerful evidence of the need for an alternate path.

So am I reading right that you support neighborhood preferences for charter school admissions?

Not necessarily. I'm just willing to keep an open mind to good arguments on either side.

For example, if several circumstances applied such as: A) no good school (defined by performance data) within a certain radius of child's home; and B) good charter is within a certain radius of child's home; then possibly a weighted formula that would increase the child's odds would have merit. I'm thinking specifically of the many schools that have been closed east of the river. There are a lot of young children whose neighborhood school is being closed or has been closed; meanwhile there is a high concentration of charters in Wards 7 & 8. Some of them (at least a couple of KIPP schools, I believe) have good track records. Depending on the specifics, I might be able to support some sort of weighting or preference system that would increase the opportunities for such children to attend a school that's not on the other side of town.

OTOH, if we're talking about a school like Latin, which attracts students from all over the city and is not very from the best DCPS MS in the city, then no. I'm highly sceptical that neighborhood preference would be in the best interests of any but a select few, and in fact would actually work to the detriment of many.

The obvious problem here is that there simply aren't enough seats at "good schools". Enough seats would eliminate every paranoid scenario. Let's support the creation of schools parents want.

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP, first of all, I don't think anyone is seriously pursuing replacing the entire system - though if DCPS cannot get its act together, I would not be surprised if someone does propose a new model at some point. As for where they would go, there already are charters that specialize in things like disciplinary problems, special needs and so on - the things that kids might otherwise be "counseled out" for.

I guess that it doesn't count as serious, but the poster at 22:45 did write:

"Hopefully, the successful charters will ultimately expand to the point that DCPS is swept out..."

Don't fool yourself. There is a group in DC that I call "Charter fundamentalists" that fervently wants DCPS to be replaced entirely by Charter schools.

Personally, I think the disappearance of the neighborhood school would be a big loss.

I'm a charter supporter (not fundamentalist) and I agree with you that the loss of quality neighborhood schools would be a big loss. The operative word however is quality. Replacing the high performing schools - almost exclusively west of the park - with charters for no reason other than a policy agenda would be beyond foolish. Charter supporters would do well to acknowledge and respect the valuable ingredient successful schools bring to their neighborhoods. By the same token, poor performing neighborhood schools are one more institution that helps to ossify the dysfunctional dynamics in many of the lower SES, high crime neighborhoods, of which this city has all too many. The value of some of those schools is largely historical, and the fact that new charters can come in to the same neighborhoods and educate the same students with superior outcomes is is powerful evidence of the need for an alternate path.

So am I reading right that you support neighborhood preferences for charter school admissions?

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP, first of all, I don't think anyone is seriously pursuing replacing the entire system - though if DCPS cannot get its act together, I would not be surprised if someone does propose a new model at some point. As for where they would go, there already are charters that specialize in things like disciplinary problems, special needs and so on - the things that kids might otherwise be "counseled out" for.

I guess that it doesn't count as serious, but the poster at 22:45 did write:

"Hopefully, the successful charters will ultimately expand to the point that DCPS is swept out..."

Don't fool yourself. There is a group in DC that I call "Charter fundamentalists" that fervently wants DCPS to be replaced entirely by Charter schools.

Personally, I think the disappearance of the neighborhood school would be a big loss.

I'm a charter supporter (not fundamentalist) and I agree with you that the loss of quality neighborhood schools would be a big loss. The operative word however is quality. Replacing the high performing schools - almost exclusively west of the park - with charters for no reason other than a policy agenda would be beyond foolish. Charter supporters would do well to acknowledge and respect the valuable ingredient successful schools bring to their neighborhoods. By the same token, poor performing neighborhood schools are one more institution that helps to ossify the dysfunctional dynamics in many of the lower SES, high crime neighborhoods, of which this city has all too many. The value of some of those schools is largely historical, and the fact that new charters can come in to the same neighborhoods and educate the same students with superior outcomes is is powerful evidence of the need for an alternate path.

Anonymous wrote:PP, first of all, I don't think anyone is seriously pursuing replacing the entire system - though if DCPS cannot get its act together, I would not be surprised if someone does propose a new model at some point. As for where they would go, there already are charters that specialize in things like disciplinary problems, special needs and so on - the things that kids might otherwise be "counseled out" for.

I guess that it doesn't count as serious, but the poster at 22:45 did write:

"Hopefully, the successful charters will ultimately expand to the point that DCPS is swept out..."

Don't fool yourself. There is a group in DC that I call "Charter fundamentalists" that fervently wants DCPS to be replaced entirely by Charter schools.

Personally, I think the disappearance of the neighborhood school would be a big loss.

Anonymous wrote:Those analysis had add-one such as special need spending and spending on children attending schools in PG, MoCo, Alexandria schools. I assume those are foster children placed in homes in those jurisdictions. I guess DC is required to reimburse the school districts, since technically he children are district residents.

I think it might be based on the court that has jurisdiction, but who actually pays, is it the regular school district budget or is there yet another pot of money?