Actually, there are a lot of SAHPs in our FSES neighborhood because it is more affordable to live on one income in Silver Spring than in more wealthier parts of the county.

Anonymous wrote:You said I wanted to be around people just like me, and that's not true. Let's just call a truce and move on? Fwiw, I think flora is a great school btw. My initial response was merely aimed at explaining why some of us look at ESOL and farms rates and what those rates translate to when you have very high farms and ESOL rates (and again, I don't know what the rates are at flora).

You are right, this has gotten away from either of our original points.
I just think think that FARMS rates are only part of a larger picture and that there are more accurate ways to garner the real info parents want.
Truce accepted...truth us we are probably a lot more alike than this debate would indicate.

You said I wanted to be around people just like me, and that's not true. Let's just call a truce and move on? Fwiw, I think flora is a great school btw. My initial response was merely aimed at explaining why some of us look at ESOL and farms rates and what those rates translate to when you have very high farms and ESOL rates (and again, I don't know what the rates are at flora).

Anonymous wrote:You sound really immature, pp. Your entire argument was based on the false premise that I'm a rich, white, yuppie mom living in Bethesda, and I am none of these things (well I am white). My kids are friends with classmates who at white, AA, Hispanic, and middle eastern. There are plenty of diverse schools that don't have high levels of farms and ESOL. And I don't think a school can be considered diverse if there are only one or two white kids in a class (like my nephew's class at a title I in SS). Having said all of this, Flora isn't a title I, so I'm not attributing my comments directly at Flora. Rather, my original post aimed to explain why some people care about farms and ESOL...and to point out that it isn't for some nefarious, racist purpose. I give up, too. You sound very narrow minded and unwilling to accept that many well educated, liberal, kind hearted people simply use such info when evaluating potential schools....especially if they are striving to buy a forever home and hope to establish a nice network of friends for themselves and their children. My neighbors have lived here for twenty years and know everyone in the neighborhood as well as the handful of other neighborhoods that feed into our schools. When I hit Starbucks or the grocery store I run into lots of families I know...do you? We chat about the latest news from school, church, and sports....do you? Maybe you don't care about such things9, but many of us do. Life is so crazy nowadays that it's nice to create a small village-like feel.

I never said you were rich or white

You sound really immature, pp. Your entire argument was based on the false premise that I'm a rich, white, yuppie mom living in Bethesda, and I am none of these things (well I am white). My kids are friends with classmates who at white, AA, Hispanic, and middle eastern. There are plenty of diverse schools that don't have high levels of farms and ESOL. And I don't think a school can be considered diverse if there are only one or two white kids in a class (like my nephew's class at a title I in SS). Having said all of this, Flora isn't a title I, so I'm not attributing my comments directly at Flora. Rather, my original post aimed to explain why some people care about farms and ESOL...and to point out that it isn't for some nefarious, racist purpose. I give up, too. You sound very narrow minded and unwilling to accept that many well educated, liberal, kind hearted people simply use such info when evaluating potential schools....especially if they are striving to buy a forever home and hope to establish a nice network of friends for themselves and their children. My neighbors have lived here for twenty years and know everyone in the neighborhood as well as the handful of other neighborhoods that feed into our schools. When I hit Starbucks or the grocery store I run into lots of families I know...do you? We chat about the latest news from school, church, and sports....do you? Maybe you don't care about such things, but many of us do. Life is so crazy nowadays that it's nice to create a small village-like feel.

Anonymous wrote:Pp, why aren't you listening? Our school is diverse, and my kids' best friends are AA. There is economic diversity, from 5% farms up to million dollar homes and everything in between. We hang with parents who are police officers, firefighters, military, nurses AND lawyers, bankers, corporate types. We are bleeding heart liberals and we have parents from school who are a true mix. I think you are just jealous, pp.

This is the pp to whom you are speaking.
I quit, I give, seriously when your kids gave black friends I am proven wrong.
I apologize and quit the convo.
LLOLIOLOLOLLLOLOLOL

Pp, why aren't you listening? Our school is diverse, and my kids' best friends are AA. There is economic diversity, from 5% farms up to million dollar homes and everything in between. We hang with parents who are police officers, firefighters, military, nurses AND lawyers, bankers, corporate types. We are bleeding heart liberals and we have parents from school who are a true mix. I think you are just jealous, pp.

Anonymous wrote:To 15:38 - how many parents volunteer in the classroom each week? Do you carpool with other parents? How many afternoons a week does your kid have a playdate with a classmate? Do your kid's classmates take dance lessons with your kid or play on the same basketball team? How about CCD or Hebrew school? That's what I'm getting at here. That's the real difference. Maybe it's not an issue for you, but it MIGHT be an issue for SOME....and that's precisely why people look at farms and ESOL rates. To sum up: my kids are in a school that has diversity, but very low ESOL and farms rates and I am truly grateful to the SAHMs who volunteer and are constantly at the school and readily available for car pools and everything else I mentioned. My best friends kids are in a title I in silver spring and she regrets that she is the go to mom for everything at the school, that playdates with classmates don't happen, and that she has to drive her kids to other areas for sports and religion (and thus her kids aren't hanging with classmates). Maybe this isn't an issue for you, but some parents want their kids to be in a community like Mayberry where parents and kids know each other very well thanks to the extracurricular activities and where parents rally around each other like a village. Maybe that happens at flora....but flora isn't title I.

WOW
you continue to amaze me
guess what
all this happens at flora singer
and OTES
bottom line you want an environment where everyone wirshios lije you
same HHI as you
does what you do
looks like you
That is fine
Than just say that
Do not cloak it in the ignorance and fear that folks who are different
or make less will corrupt or somehow degrade your child's idyllic childhood.

Anonymous wrote:Just checked out the Einstein stats, and only forty some percent of students took the SATs? That's worrisome. And fwiw, 65% of students are currently or have previously been on FARMs.

We loved Einstein. Both of our kids went there and did very well-son is now at a competitive liberal arts college, daughter in med school. Einstein has improved since they graduated.

Anonymous wrote:To 15:38 - how many parents volunteer in the classroom each week? Do you carpool with other parents? How many afternoons a week does your kid have a playdate with a classmate? Do your kid's classmates take dance lessons with your kid or play on the same basketball team? How about CCD or Hebrew school? That's what I'm getting at here. That's the real difference. Maybe it's not an issue for you, but it MIGHT be an issue for SOME....and that's precisely why people look at farms and ESOL rates. To sum up: my kids are in a school that has diversity, but very low ESOL and farms rates and I am truly grateful to the SAHMs who volunteer and are constantly at the school and readily available for car pools and everything else I mentioned. My best friends kids are in a title I in silver spring and she regrets that she is the go to mom for everything at the school, that playdates with classmates don't happen, and that she has to drive her kids to other areas for sports and religion (and thus her kids aren't hanging with classmates). Maybe this isn't an issue for you, but some parents want their kids to be in a community like Mayberry where parents and kids know each other very well thanks to the extracurricular activities and where parents rally around each other like a village. Maybe that happens at flora....but flora isn't title I.

Thank you for this. This is what I want for my son - to build a community of lifelong friends just like what I had growing up. Flora Singer may be fine but I don't think middle school and high school will be. I'd rather make a good choice from the start so that he can grow with the same kids and benefit from the community. I agree that FARMS and ESOL and eventually SAT rates and safety figures tell a lot.

To 15:38 - how many parents volunteer in the classroom each week? Do you carpool with other parents? How many afternoons a week does your kid have a playdate with a classmate? Do your kid's classmates take dance lessons with your kid or play on the same basketball team? How about CCD or Hebrew school? That's what I'm getting at here. That's the real difference. Maybe it's not an issue for you, but it MIGHT be an issue for SOME....and that's precisely why people look at farms and ESOL rates. To sum up: my kids are in a school that has diversity, but very low ESOL and farms rates and I am truly grateful to the SAHMs who volunteer and are constantly at the school and readily available for car pools and everything else I mentioned. My best friends kids are in a title I in silver spring and she regrets that she is the go to mom for everything at the school, that playdates with classmates don't happen, and that she has to drive her kids to other areas for sports and religion (and thus her kids aren't hanging with classmates). Maybe this isn't an issue for you, but some parents want their kids to be in a community like Mayberry where parents and kids know each other very well thanks to the extracurricular activities and where parents rally around each other like a village. Maybe that happens at flora....but flora isn't title I.

Anonymous wrote:Just checked out the Einstein stats, and only forty some percent of students took the SATs? That's worrisome. And fwiw, 65% of students are currently or have previously been on FARMs.

The safety report is worrisome as well - way more suspensions than BCC or other high schools.

Anonymous wrote:Here's the thing: I actually know people with kids at OT, Flora, a couple title 1s in Silver Spring, as well as more upscale schools (for lack of a better descriptor) in Bethesda, Potomac, Kensington, olney and brookeville. I know teachers and principals in mcps at the best and worst schools as well. And I have kids in mcps. I'm not making this stuff up. I'm not saying working parents aren't active in schools. I am saying farms parents typically do not volunteer in the classroom to assist with math and reading twice a week...but that does happen in more affluent schools with lots of SAHMs. And ESOL parents definitely do not volunteer in the classroom on a regular basis either. To be clear (since the pp seems a bit confused), I'm not saying these parents don't care about their kids and don't show up at school events (although any mcps teacher at a title I or focus school will tell you who does and does not show up for back to school night and class parties). And my other point about social and childcare issues is spot on as well. The simple fact is that it is rather easy to set up playdates and carpools at schools with lots of SAHMs (or nannies who drive). There was another thread about these sorts of observations recently...I think it centered on a school in Rockville...and a poster explained all of this much more eloquently than I can (haven't slept all week thanks to multiple sick kids).

wow
I guess I should have based my school choice on the number of SAHM and nannues who drive.
DAYUM I blew that one
by the way
I actually have a kid at Flora Singer
I don't just know people
it has a very active latin parent community
there is a rainbow of parents in the PTA
my child could not tell you who gets free lunch
I could only guess but why would I?
I would likely be wrong

FSES parent here. Yes, I'm concerned about what will happen down the road, but we're not there yet. I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE Singer. I am so happy we decided to keep our DD in public - she started at OTES and is in 1st at Singer.

It has a higher FARMS % than OTES, that was one of the points made when they split the schools.

Facts:
**The school has translators at PTA events and has a Latino parents weekly morning meeting.
**There are plenty of non-native English speakers who are highly involved in the school.
**There are also plenty of white, higher income families who don't have the time to volunteer in the classroom.
**The class sizes are so small that, while DD has some kids for whom English isn't their first language in her class, all students get a very significant amount of individual attention.
**The administration is outstanding - responsive, dedicated, and organized.
**The teachers are enthusiastic - Mr. Heatwole was able to hand pick the teachers he wanted and did an amazing job from what I've seen.
**The facility is incredible - there are more resources at this school than some local privates.

Opinions:
**One of the reason we decided to send DD to public was for the diversity (racial, ethnic, SES).
**From what I hear (to echo a PP) from friends with kids in schools in Bethesda & Kensington, DD gets way more individualized attention.
**Test scores (please note this is under opinion) - they are disproportionately brought down by a high number of kids for whom English isn't their first language or who are in a low SES situation. Standardized tests are culturally biased. DD is advanced in reading and math and is being challenged beyond the 1st grade level.


Request - can we please not stoop to the sniping that happens on some other boards. FSES is such an awesome community, I don't want to be associated with that kind of behavior.

Just checked out the Einstein stats, and only forty some percent of students took the SATs? That's worrisome. And fwiw, 65% of students are currently or have previously been on FARMs.