Anonymous
06/13/2011 10:31
Subject: paying for "extras" on top of child support
Another evil stepmom here.
Yes, I knew DH had kids when we got married. I didn't know until we were engaged that his ex got 65% of his income. 65%. Wow. I didn't even think that was legal. She lied about how much she made. I found out through public records (she's a state employee) years after the divorce that all state employees received a raise the month of the hearing. She used an old pay stub and when asked if it was accurate she said yes (I have the transcripts). She purposely took a low paying job to make it seem like she had no ability to make money. So, she only made $38k (with a BS in Computer Science), but low and behold, when child support was re-addressed 3 years later (oldest had turned 18), she was making $75k. Wow. That's pretty transparent that she was trying to suck money out of her ex.
But to the point... for an 8 year old child of a teacher, before and after school care should be below $300/month. Groceries, more like $200/month. Clothes? Not like he's outgrowing them every month, so $100/month. Additional housing cost? $500. So, less than $1000, split between 2 people (the father and mother) is $500/month each. $1400 is generous. Paying 100% of extra curricular activities is more than generous.
Camp is glorified daycare. If you don't need it (ie - aren't working) there is no need for camp. Particulalry since he's already getting 4 weeks of it through his time with his father.
Our court order (and yes, I'll call it ours since it affects OUR finances) has my DH paying $2800 in alimony (never mind she makes almost as much as him), $800/month in child support, he provides medical and dental insurance, they split 50/50 the co-pays. Any extra curricular activities are up to her to pay. He's paid for more than half of college for the older child, and gives the younger one a monthly allowance.
Frankly, its f-ed up. She's told the kids he pays very little in child support. Which is true. But what hasn't been disclosed to the kids is the HUGE amount she gets in alimony. If there was any fairness to it, there would be no alimony and the child support should be higher.
Yes, I knew DH had kids when we got married. I didn't know until we were engaged that his ex got 65% of his income. 65%. Wow. I didn't even think that was legal. She lied about how much she made. I found out through public records (she's a state employee) years after the divorce that all state employees received a raise the month of the hearing. She used an old pay stub and when asked if it was accurate she said yes (I have the transcripts). She purposely took a low paying job to make it seem like she had no ability to make money. So, she only made $38k (with a BS in Computer Science), but low and behold, when child support was re-addressed 3 years later (oldest had turned 18), she was making $75k. Wow. That's pretty transparent that she was trying to suck money out of her ex.
But to the point... for an 8 year old child of a teacher, before and after school care should be below $300/month. Groceries, more like $200/month. Clothes? Not like he's outgrowing them every month, so $100/month. Additional housing cost? $500. So, less than $1000, split between 2 people (the father and mother) is $500/month each. $1400 is generous. Paying 100% of extra curricular activities is more than generous.
Camp is glorified daycare. If you don't need it (ie - aren't working) there is no need for camp. Particulalry since he's already getting 4 weeks of it through his time with his father.
Our court order (and yes, I'll call it ours since it affects OUR finances) has my DH paying $2800 in alimony (never mind she makes almost as much as him), $800/month in child support, he provides medical and dental insurance, they split 50/50 the co-pays. Any extra curricular activities are up to her to pay. He's paid for more than half of college for the older child, and gives the younger one a monthly allowance.
Frankly, its f-ed up. She's told the kids he pays very little in child support. Which is true. But what hasn't been disclosed to the kids is the HUGE amount she gets in alimony. If there was any fairness to it, there would be no alimony and the child support should be higher.
Anonymous
06/13/2011 09:54
Subject: paying for "extras" on top of child support
Anonymous wrote:He'd never, ever, pull the crap that many PPS seems to suggest, that somehow my views are less important than his, or that it is less "my business" than his, about how we spend our marital property.
Sorry but that's not the legal construct! You have no legal obligation to your stepchildren. His income is what determines child support. Trust me, if your marriage ended in divorce and your husband remarried, your views on this would change!
This circles back to the OP's point. If someone wants to be a total a$$ about it, his only legal obligation as the non CP is the child support. Everything spent above and beyond that is marital property of the second marriage. Like it or not, the stepparent and that marriage do have a role.
And, even if it isn't the legal construct, it should hopefully be the one that's best for the kids. PPs have said how sad it would be if a parent considered their obligation to end with the legally-mandated child support, even if they can afford to provide more for their kids. Well, there's no legal construct to require that. But, it's hopefully what good people do in the best interests of their family - work together to provide the best possible life for kids from a first marriage, the currently married couple, and any kids from that second marriage.
Anonymous
06/13/2011 09:23
Subject: paying for "extras" on top of child support
Anonymous wrote:He'd never, ever, pull the crap that many PPS seems to suggest, that somehow my views are less important than his, or that it is less "my business" than his, about how we spend our marital property.
Sorry but that's not the legal construct! You have no legal obligation to your stepchildren. His income is what determines child support. Trust me, if your marriage ended in divorce and your husband remarried, your views on this would change!
Actually, other than a parent fulfilling legal obligations, it IS the legal construct. Every time my husband pays for something for his kids above and beyond what is legally required, that money is coming from our marital property. Each time my husband, his kids, and our kids go out together, our kids learn from his behavior toward his older kids, and from their conduct as well. Each time he and his ex-wife have a disagreement, his kids and our kids learn about how families deal with conflict. My DH and his ex-wife had their chance to have full say over what happened with their kids. It was a disaster, with blame that can easily be distributed evenly. Now they don't have that ability, through their own choices. As for what I would think if we divorced, I would hope that I would try not to take advantage of some other man I marry.
Anonymous
06/13/2011 09:14
Subject: Re:paying for "extras" on top of child support
Anonymous wrote:And this from the parents who couldn't even manage to keep their family and marriage intact. A bit like letting the patients run the asylum.
I think this is really unfair. Sometimes the combination of two people is just not right - that doesn't mean that they are incapable of being in a good relationship with someone else, or that they are bad parents.
Nor, though, does it mean that the people who put their kids through a divorce should have the right to ask another adult (a new spouse) to have his or her marriage be secondary. People keep posting that step-parents know what they are getting into hen they marry a parent. I'd say the same is true for parent who remarries. If you are going to have a healthy, respectful partnership with your new spouse, deciding to make decisions (other than legal obligations) without discussion, consultation and compromise should be off the table. Why for goodness sake should your new spouse be viewed as an enemy of sorts when you were the one who screwed up, big time, in the first place. Everyone screws up sometimes, but it surely doesn't mean you get to ride on a high horse and not consult with your new spouse about matters that directly impact him or her.
Anonymous
06/13/2011 09:02
Subject: paying for "extras" on top of child support
He'd never, ever, pull the crap that many PPS seems to suggest, that somehow my views are less important than his, or that it is less "my business" than his, about how we spend our marital property.
Sorry but that's not the legal construct! You have no legal obligation to your stepchildren. His income is what determines child support. Trust me, if your marriage ended in divorce and your husband remarried, your views on this would change!
Sorry but that's not the legal construct! You have no legal obligation to your stepchildren. His income is what determines child support. Trust me, if your marriage ended in divorce and your husband remarried, your views on this would change!
Anonymous
06/13/2011 08:27
Subject: Re:paying for "extras" on top of child support
And this from the parents who couldn't even manage to keep their family and marriage intact. A bit like letting the patients run the asylum.
I think this is really unfair. Sometimes the combination of two people is just not right - that doesn't mean that they are incapable of being in a good relationship with someone else, or that they are bad parents.
Anonymous
06/12/2011 22:50
Subject: Re:paying for "extras" on top of child support
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:It is pretty annoying that step-parents get such a bad rap. We're usually the only people who were not responsible for the demise of the child's family, and yet we get blamed so easily for pretty much everything. And then we're expected to defer on all points to the child's parents, regardless of how their decisions impact our nuclear families. And this from the parents who couldn't even manage to keep their family and marriage intact. A bit like letting the patients run the asylum.
And yet, you married one of them.
PP here. I did marry a divorced man with children. We were very clear with each other that our marriage would be as important as his relationship with his kids from a prior marriage, and as important as our relationship with the children we would have (and now do have) with each other. In our view, the adults' marriage is the central relationship in a family, and the relationships with children grow from, and model, that core. We are happily married, and have strong relationships with all of our kids, including his kids from a prior marriage. Everything that he does for/with his kids is a subject of marital conversation the same way it is for the kids we have together. Small things we don't touch base about, large things we do. We touch base about any unexpected expense over a few hundred dollars (around $400-$500), whether it's about his kids, our kids, or our own personal spending. It is our marital property being spent, so why wouldn't we? He'd never, ever, pull the crap that many PPS seems to suggest, that somehow my views are less important than his, or that it is less "my business" than his, about how we spend our marital property. Everyone make mistakes, but his failed married is not something he or his ex are proud of, and it's certainly not something that they can point to as an example of good parenting. Luckily, they don't, because it wouldn't get them for with me or with her new husband.
Anonymous
06/12/2011 21:53
Subject: paying for "extras" on top of child support
test
Anonymous
06/11/2011 13:43
Subject: paying for "extras" on top of child support
8:55
He's underpaying her child support per OP.
I think they should leave it as is.
OP wanted to know what other folks did.
It's all over the map.
Another approach is coming up with an annual list of expenses, and seeing if it's financially feasible, summer and school year. It will change over time.
Even if DSS's mother isn't in an expensive area, if she's on her own, she's on her own. So different, one income household versus two.
He's underpaying her child support per OP.
I think they should leave it as is.
OP wanted to know what other folks did.
It's all over the map.
Another approach is coming up with an annual list of expenses, and seeing if it's financially feasible, summer and school year. It will change over time.
Even if DSS's mother isn't in an expensive area, if she's on her own, she's on her own. So different, one income household versus two.
Anonymous
06/11/2011 10:35
Subject: Re:paying for "extras" on top of child support
Anonymous wrote:It is pretty annoying that step-parents get such a bad rap. We're usually the only people who were not responsible for the demise of the child's family, and yet we get blamed so easily for pretty much everything. And then we're expected to defer on all points to the child's parents, regardless of how their decisions impact our nuclear families. And this from the parents who couldn't even manage to keep their family and marriage intact. A bit like letting the patients run the asylum.
And yet, you married one of them.
Anonymous
06/11/2011 08:55
Subject: paying for "extras" on top of child support
If you and DH think the camp would be fun for the child and can afford it, you should pay for it this time. However, maybe DH should conisder sending his ex a message along these lines:
Dear X,
I am willing to pay for the camp for DS this time because I want him to have a fun summer and I don't want him to be disappointed now that he has been told he can go. However, in the future, if there are extracurricular activities that you would like me to contribute to above my child support, you need to consult me first so that we can discuss it and ensure that it is financially feasible. We need to have this discussion before you sign DS up, and before you tell him that he can go. Thanks for your understanding.
Dear X,
I am willing to pay for the camp for DS this time because I want him to have a fun summer and I don't want him to be disappointed now that he has been told he can go. However, in the future, if there are extracurricular activities that you would like me to contribute to above my child support, you need to consult me first so that we can discuss it and ensure that it is financially feasible. We need to have this discussion before you sign DS up, and before you tell him that he can go. Thanks for your understanding.
Anonymous
06/11/2011 00:08
Subject: Re:paying for "extras" on top of child support
It is pretty annoying that step-parents get such a bad rap. We're usually the only people who were not responsible for the demise of the child's family, and yet we get blamed so easily for pretty much everything. And then we're expected to defer on all points to the child's parents, regardless of how their decisions impact our nuclear families. And this from the parents who couldn't even manage to keep their family and marriage intact. A bit like letting the patients run the asylum.
Anonymous
06/08/2011 13:16
Subject: Re:paying for "extras" on top of child support
Anonymous wrote:Op here. No I was not PP. My income is not a factor into the child support payments although it is my understanding that if DH lost his job it would become one. We live in DC.
Just an update DH is going to pay for camp. He is going to use it as an opportunity to open up a dialogue with his ex. To the Pps who recommended mediation- thanks. He will probably have to go that route as he and his ex have a lot of difficulty communicating. But that is another post for another day. Also DH currently pays all medical and gives his ex money in the beginning of the school year for clothes. Our concern initially arose out of the tone of his ex's email regarding camp but we definitely want an amicable relationship for the sake of DSS and yes, after thinking things through we want to avoid court.
Thanks to the PPs who shared their experiences. These situations always seem to be complicated, and it is important for me and DH to always remember it is about DSS. I'm just being totally honest when I say it is easy to get wrapped up in emotional responses. Thanks again.
OP, as you can see the child support discussion is pretty sensitive to everyone (the givers and receivers). My daughters father is paying based upon the DC child support calculator, based upon his income, my income, her child care needs (including camps so I can work), and health needs. I think he pays quite a lot, but raising a child in NW DC is quite expensive... that said, almost every month he points out what a financial burdon it is, and that is doing the legal minimum. I do applaud your husband for stepping away from what could be a lot of hostility with his ex's mother, and ending up hurting his child. I'd reccomend starting with this web site which works out what the assumed child support would be in a judge mandated it http://csgc.oag.dc.gov/application/main/intro.aspx
I'd also read (in red on the link) the DC Child supprt guideline which explains more on how the rate was set, and assumptions in support.
Anonymous
06/08/2011 12:09
Subject: paying for "extras" on top of child support
"Apologies if I'm just not noticing it (and I'm totally referring to just thus forum, not to what people have to deal with in real life) but why the special level of nastiness towards steps? "
Why the special level of nastiness towards ILs?
Why the special level of nastiness towards ILs?
Anonymous
06/08/2011 10:38
Subject: paying for "extras" on top of child support
"And, therefore it's okay to be completely bigoted and anti-stepparents based on the subset of stepparents that you do know? I've seen my share of non-custodial divorced/single parents who absolutely suck, both moms and dads. Does that mean that all non-custodial parents suck?
I'm presuming that you would never respond to a post by someone who said "all black people are...", because in your mind sweeping generalizations about a group are okay. "
Cuckoo bird.
I'm presuming that you would never respond to a post by someone who said "all black people are...", because in your mind sweeping generalizations about a group are okay. "
Cuckoo bird.