Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I saw the topic title and did a double take, wondering if I'd written the post. So much of this resonates including the calm persona (or masking) that turned into a 180 a few years into parenting.

But actually I now see that a lot of the lack of fighting etc was actually part of being very poor at communicating about conflict and expressing emotions. If you're not in tune with your childhood, have had positive modeling or dealt with trauma etc., it eventually comes out. There's a lot of flags I see in retrospect. We both have cultural baggage that contributed to his childhood and my blinders.

I haven't successfully gotten DH to see a therapist. He acts like he'll just improve but doesn't obviously. And we did sign up for a virtual parenting class but he was so dismissive and stopped even being in the room for it. It can be very hard to get someone to recognize the depth of their problem or get them to care about actually changing.

I have been similar to you OP on not wanting to leave due to custody but I wouldn't tell DH "it's off the table." It's an enormous lever, don't let him assume you won't use it. I raised it after something that happened and in my own mind adjusted to the fact that I might need to. It makes me very sad but it's my kids' childhood (and my mental health too) and there's only so much mommy martyr I can do and only so much damage I can buffer.

In a similar situation but DH is like this to me too in addition to our child. He’s actually better with our child because at the end of the day she’s his child.

How do you talk to your DH about this? Mine is not willing to engage and just rages and storms off. Maybe then he also “retaliates” by being in a particularly terrible mood for the next week or so, and then further disrupting family life.

Bluntly I haven't been able to talk to him in an effective or productive way. I have tried, he shuts down or just gets more pissed off, and all it does is extend the unpleasantness. I walk on eggshells, always have an ear out, and certainly feel an unhealthy amount of stress.

Anonymous wrote:
Also, I'm not a permissive parent; we have several tools that I use to enforce loving boundaries, including 1-2-3- timeout, saying "try again", natural consequences, etc. My husband always forgets to use them no matter how many times I remind him. I'm not perfect either; I have yelled at my kids on occasion, though I'm generally pretty even-keeled. But even when I yell, I apologize profusely and repair the relationship. That's one of DH's big problems, is he never repairs adequately, so the hurts keep mounting.

I'm the prior PEP person. I will add: PEP would also be useful to you. Based on what you are describing here, you don't have the full repertoire of tools available to you either. You might consider taking the starter classes on encouragement & redefining discipline together.

Anonymous wrote:Parent class, and anger management course for him.
https://pepparent.org/

Anger Management Group

TUESDAYS, 6:30 – 8 PM, Virtual, Exact Start Date TBD

You are not alone. Our group offers a safe, compassionate, non-blaming space where your experiences are heard as we explore tools for how to manage strong emotions.

Therapeutic interventions & support group focus:

Understanding how anger works in the brain
Understanding personal triggers and sources of anger
Building up a toolbox to help reduce strong emotions

For Registration and Inquires: Call (571)385-1625

This class helped me SO MUCH.

Anonymous wrote:OP I saw the topic title and did a double take, wondering if I'd written the post. So much of this resonates including the calm persona (or masking) that turned into a 180 a few years into parenting.

But actually I now see that a lot of the lack of fighting etc was actually part of being very poor at communicating about conflict and expressing emotions. If you're not in tune with your childhood, have had positive modeling or dealt with trauma etc., it eventually comes out. There's a lot of flags I see in retrospect. We both have cultural baggage that contributed to his childhood and my blinders.

I haven't successfully gotten DH to see a therapist. He acts like he'll just improve but doesn't obviously. And we did sign up for a virtual parenting class but he was so dismissive and stopped even being in the room for it. It can be very hard to get someone to recognize the depth of their problem or get them to care about actually changing.

I have been similar to you OP on not wanting to leave due to custody but I wouldn't tell DH "it's off the table." It's an enormous lever, don't let him assume you won't use it. I raised it after something that happened and in my own mind adjusted to the fact that I might need to. It makes me very sad but it's my kids' childhood (and my mental health too) and there's only so much mommy martyr I can do and only so much damage I can buffer.

In a similar situation but DH is like this to me too in addition to our child. He’s actually better with our child because at the end of the day she’s his child.

How do you talk to your DH about this? Mine is not willing to engage and just rages and storms off. Maybe then he also “retaliates” by being in a particularly terrible mood for the next week or so, and then further disrupting family life.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some adults truly do not understand child development. They react to chidren as if the behavior is coming from a human with a fully formed brain.

I think OP is on the right track with counseling and anger management, but I would also reocmmend that she make him read books on child development and parenting. And do it quickly, becuase your child's personality is being formed by these negative interactions.

Completely agree and I don't want to be pessimistic but I think so much of this behavior co-occurs with other destructive traits. I am the PP whose DH refused to even listen in on the PEP class. Absolutely doesn't understand development or what's age-appropriate behavior or processing but also just doesn't care / thinks he's smarter / always finds excuses why strategies wouldn't work vs trying to learn or try to see the takeaways.

My DH had a pile of ignored parenting books and classes that he signed up for in a showy way and never attended. He was in total denial of any concepts of parenting or child development, and as our DC got to the older elementary years he snapped. The idea that a child was a separate person with agency was too much for him and he went into a violent rage in relation to something DC was legitimately upset about.

His reaction to that was to serve me with divorce papers with no warning and to then start a custody battle. How dare anyone tell him how to parent!

It’s a nightmare. OP, I don’t want to scare you but do have some general safety and independence plans filed away in the back of your head.

This resonates so much. For us baby years were fine and issues started at age 5. There is the expectation of immediate compliance and everything is "disrespect"/unacceptable. And no thought to socio-emotional development and this being an actual person we are trying to raise for the world. I could write a novel with what all the underlying causes are but ultimately it's the here and now we all need to deal with.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some adults truly do not understand child development. They react to chidren as if the behavior is coming from a human with a fully formed brain.

I think OP is on the right track with counseling and anger management, but I would also reocmmend that she make him read books on child development and parenting. And do it quickly, becuase your child's personality is being formed by these negative interactions.

Completely agree and I don't want to be pessimistic but I think so much of this behavior co-occurs with other destructive traits. I am the PP whose DH refused to even listen in on the PEP class. Absolutely doesn't understand development or what's age-appropriate behavior or processing but also just doesn't care / thinks he's smarter / always finds excuses why strategies wouldn't work vs trying to learn or try to see the takeaways.

My DH had a pile of ignored parenting books and classes that he signed up for in a showy way and never attended. He was in total denial of any concepts of parenting or child development, and as our DC got to the older elementary years he snapped. The idea that a child was a separate person with agency was too much for him and he went into a violent rage in relation to something DC was legitimately upset about.

His reaction to that was to serve me with divorce papers with no warning and to then start a custody battle. How dare anyone tell him how to parent!

It’s a nightmare. OP, I don’t want to scare you but do have some general safety and independence plans filed away in the back of your head.

Anonymous wrote:Some adults truly do not understand child development. They react to chidren as if the behavior is coming from a human with a fully formed brain.

I think OP is on the right track with counseling and anger management, but I would also reocmmend that she make him read books on child development and parenting. And do it quickly, becuase your child's personality is being formed by these negative interactions.

Completely agree and I don't want to be pessimistic but I think so much of this behavior co-occurs with other destructive traits. I am the PP whose DH refused to even listen in on the PEP class. Absolutely doesn't understand development or what's age-appropriate behavior or processing but also just doesn't care / thinks he's smarter / always finds excuses why strategies wouldn't work vs trying to learn or try to see the takeaways.

Some adults truly do not understand child development. They react to chidren as if the behavior is coming from a human with a fully formed brain.

I think OP is on the right track with counseling and anger management, but I would also reocmmend that she make him read books on child development and parenting. And do it quickly, becuase your child's personality is being formed by these negative interactions.

I grew up with a verbally abusive parent. The other parent was a gem. But, that didn't compensate for the abuse, which warped me and my siblings and have made us unable to find and maintain long term partnerships. I have had 2 primary intimate relationships - both many years -- and both of which were ultimately abusive.

I left my exDH when he started abusing and manipulating me, because I never wanted my kids to be impacted like I was.

I know people think they are protecting their kids when they stay with an abuser, but you're actually just teaching your kids that abuse is OK and that it is one person's job to monitor and correct another person's bad behavior. IMO, it's far better to have 50% of the time in a normal, healthy home and 50% of the time with an abuser, unprotected and give the children access to a therapist that can help them navigate the abuse (and be a mandated, independent reporter). Over time, the abusive parent will either change, or the kids will drift away from them emotionally and physically.

And, for the PP who feared the loss of a "male influence," the last thing I wanted for my male child was to have his abusive father as his model. I found other male influences for my son -- my brothers, my father, even some activity leaders (although you do have to be careful to make sure your kid is not groomed or abused by others.) I'm sorry for whatever happened to your brothers after divorce, but IME, staying with someone who is emotionally, verbally or physically abusive is not a solution. BTW, "throwing things out of anger" is a specific kind of domestic violence called "coercive control."

OP, I had a similar issue when my kids got to be teens. Primarily our two sons (he’s different with our DD), my husband went from pretty-good dad, to emotionally immature a-hole when they reached the age where they no longer idolized him, when he couldn’t control them easily, when they had their own thoughts and opinions.

Yes document. My DH didn’t touch the boys, but he did throw things out of anger. I took pictures of the aftermath and have hung on to them for years. We’re still married, but I wish I’d have left a decade ago. I kept thinking that even with a father like this, it was better for my boys to have that male influence, after watching what happened my my brother when my parents divorced.

I’m sorry you have to experience this. Like some others, I also recommend personal therapy.

OP I saw the topic title and did a double take, wondering if I'd written the post. So much of this resonates including the calm persona (or masking) that turned into a 180 a few years into parenting.

But actually I now see that a lot of the lack of fighting etc was actually part of being very poor at communicating about conflict and expressing emotions. If you're not in tune with your childhood, have had positive modeling or dealt with trauma etc., it eventually comes out. There's a lot of flags I see in retrospect. We both have cultural baggage that contributed to his childhood and my blinders.

I haven't successfully gotten DH to see a therapist. He acts like he'll just improve but doesn't obviously. And we did sign up for a virtual parenting class but he was so dismissive and stopped even being in the room for it. It can be very hard to get someone to recognize the depth of their problem or get them to care about actually changing.

I have been similar to you OP on not wanting to leave due to custody but I wouldn't tell DH "it's off the table." It's an enormous lever, don't let him assume you won't use it. I raised it after something that happened and in my own mind adjusted to the fact that I might need to. It makes me very sad but it's my kids' childhood (and my mental health too) and there's only so much mommy martyr I can do and only so much damage I can buffer.

Anonymous wrote:Parent class, and anger management course for him.
https://pepparent.org/

Anger Management Group

TUESDAYS, 6:30 – 8 PM, Virtual, Exact Start Date TBD

You are not alone. Our group offers a safe, compassionate, non-blaming space where your experiences are heard as we explore tools for how to manage strong emotions.

Therapeutic interventions & support group focus:

Understanding how anger works in the brain
Understanding personal triggers and sources of anger
Building up a toolbox to help reduce strong emotions

For Registration and Inquires: Call (571)385-1625

I, female, had an angry parenting problem early on, because I was raising my kids the way my mom raised me. I recognized it was wrong and ineffective and wanted to parent differently. These PEP classes above helped me to change. I would suggest you and DH take the multi-week PEP parenting class together - it works better if you and he are a team and support each other’s parenting and develop a common framework.

The person with anger can take the anger management as well.