Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is an insane expense for a depreciating asset. That’s why I drove an old crappy corrolla. Try to keep costs low as possible. If you want wheels if you can manage to keep the annualized cost incl insurance to around 100/mo on average that’s a “good” deal. So if you want wheels - 100/mo minimum and that’s driving some old pos

I have a 19 year old honda and insurance is only $400 a year (Maryland). Maintenance probably another $250/year.

How much do you drive? Seems like you aren't factoring in new tires, brakes, battery, etc. that likely had to be replaced several times, assuming you drive say 1000 miles per month. However, if you only drive 5,000 miles a year...probably a different story.

DP but this is another huge benefit of working from home. Now, I drive around 3,000 miles per year. I just spent $700 putting new tires on my 2018 Corolla—it was kind of a shock to learn that cars can actually cost money because that’s the first time in seven years I’ve had to spend more than the cost of an oil change on my car.

And of course, since it’s a Corolla, I paid cash—so no car payments or the rip-off comprehensive insurance coverage that lenders require.

Serious question, though, how does everyone rack up so many miles on their cars?

DH used to drive 44 miles (one way) to work. So about 100 miles M-F if he wasn't traveling.
With 2 kids and their activities, I used to put 75-100mile per day driving them to/from activities (tag teaming with drop-offs and pickups) and preschool was 10 miles each way just to start when younger.
So it's not difficult to put 1.5-2K per month on a car

Now we live in a city, so I drive DH to work (1.3 miles each way) and pick up. We walk most places, but I drive to grocery store about once per week, because while we can walk 6-7 blocks, it's difficult to carry everything home.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is worse in my opinion is the normalization of $500+/month car payment. I don't care how much you make a month, $500/month just for the car note is wild.

Not nearly as wild as $1000/mo car insurance.

who pays $12K/year for car insurance for one car?!?!?!

Lot of car haters here. I lived in the Netherlands and absolutely hated walking and biking everywhere and everyone living on top of each other. I delight in driving around in my car now.

Supposedly, the annual cost of owning a medium SUV per year is around $6700 (which assumes you don't have a car loan).

This is just looking at annual fuel, insurance, maintenance and license/registration/taxes, assuming you drive 15,000 miles per year. In theory, if you pay cash, you would add the interest you aren't earning on that money to the annual total as well.

Fuel costs are $2,200 of the above number, so if you drive 5,000 miles you would reduce the fuel cost accordingly.

I was actually shocked at how cheap used cars are now. Our 7 year old car recently was in a small accident and was declared a total loss because its value was only $16,000. It was a perfectly good car that ran fine with zero maintenance costs and was electric so no gas costs or oil changes either. I was really tempted to just replace it with exactly the same year/model.

Repairs are ridiculously expensive since everything breaks at the slightest impact — not like the old days when you’d get a small dent and hammer it out. And insurance, as a result, is also ridiculous.

But given how much inflation has been over my lifetime, I’m actually surprised cars are as cheap as they are. $1 in 1998 is worth $2 today but I don’t think car prices have doubled since 1998. (I just looked up a Chrysler minivan and it was 26-35 thousand then and 40-48 now.).

I’ve actually never had a car loan as I bought old used ones until I had the money to buy new. I still take buses or metro most places rather than driving. I agree that for many people, taking public transportation and the occasional rental/uber is cheaper than car ownership — that’s what I did all through my 20s. But of course that depends on where your job is. I finally broke down and got a car when I had a job 40 miles out into the boonies.

Why do we have such ridiculous policies that harm the middle and lower class? Democrats ir a new party need to focus on changing stupid policies.
.
The Chicken Tax is a 25% tariff on imported light trucks, imposed by the U.S. in 1964 as a response to European tariffs on American chicken. This tax has significantly influenced the automotive market by protecting U.S. manufacturers from foreign competition.

So foreign car manufactures started assembling the final product in the US to get around the tariff. In the 1980s into the 1990s, there were numerous small pickup options. Today, there are none. Even the “small” pickups today are at least mid-size and based on things like the Ford Explorer platform. There used to be small pickups from Toyota, Nissan and even the Ford Ranger.

So what happened?

The EPA regulations on mileage are based on the physical dimensions of the truck – basically length x width.

A small truck of the 1980s, like the Toyota pickup, would need to get 45-50 mpg today – a requirement that cannot be met or at least not met at a profitable price point.

But full-size pickups need only achieve upper 20s mpg. Consequently, auto makers have chosen to build not just large pickups but often to make them even larger than they were before so of course they are more expensive.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel this way as well. We have a teen driver. What used to be a right of passage and no big deal, is now a huge financial undertaking. Insurance alone is exorbitant. Plus gas. I live in a HCOL area where there is a lot of driving and no public transportation. I hope my own car lasts a long time because I have zero interest in replacing it.

It is weird. When I was a kid around the turn of the century, teens were able to pick up working cars for under $1K and insurance was very manageable. I feel like everything is becoming dystopian.

Yes, and then Obama "stimulated" our economy with the Cash for Clunkers program that got rid of these inexpensive used cars.  At the same time, he made sure that new cars would be more expensive by instituting emission standards based on the car's "footprint," which incentivized automakers to focus on producing larger, more expensive vehicles.

Health insurance also used to be affordable before the Affordable Care Act.  Racial tensions were at all-time lows before he inflamed them.  Lots of things worsened because of Obama.  Were you not aware of this?  It's why Republicans have dominated Americans politics since his departure.

Obama inflamed racial tensions? Not Trump fake birther claims against Obama?
Take it to the politics forum. Fake news from the right.

With so many floods and natural disasters the used car market has become even sketchier. I would constantly worry that a car was considering had been in a flood.

I drive 4000 miles a year and this includes 2-mile commute to my part time job.
Bought the car new for $30k, 0% loan.
Hoping to drive the car for 15 years at least. I don't like to change cars. The insurance is $180 a month, but nothing I can do about that.
18-year old just bought $26k brand new civic, but the car is under his uncle's name. The insurance was going to be just too much for a new driver. They will give him the car after 3 years of driving.

Anonymous wrote:I have not had a car payment since 2020. I have 3 older cars worth a total of about $15k. 3 drivers in the family. Only 2 of the cars still have comprehensive coverage. I do my own oil, brakes, and other small repairs. Insurance is $6k a year and making me feel car poor. Its demoralizing that the high cost of living is inescapable.

Omg that is cray! We have 2 drivers and 2 cars, annual insurance is $2600 with comprehensive. I guess because only adults?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is an insane expense for a depreciating asset. That’s why I drove an old crappy corrolla. Try to keep costs low as possible. If you want wheels if you can manage to keep the annualized cost incl insurance to around 100/mo on average that’s a “good” deal. So if you want wheels - 100/mo minimum and that’s driving some old pos

I have a 19 year old honda and insurance is only $400 a year (Maryland). Maintenance probably another $250/year.

How much do you drive? Seems like you aren't factoring in new tires, brakes, battery, etc. that likely had to be replaced several times, assuming you drive say 1000 miles per month. However, if you only drive 5,000 miles a year...probably a different story.

DP but this is another huge benefit of working from home. Now, I drive around 3,000 miles per year. I just spent $700 putting new tires on my 2018 Corolla—it was kind of a shock to learn that cars can actually cost money because that’s the first time in seven years I’ve had to spend more than the cost of an oil change on my car.

And of course, since it’s a Corolla, I paid cash—so no car payments or the rip-off comprehensive insurance coverage that lenders require.

Serious question, though, how does everyone rack up so many miles on their cars?

Wow, I don’t commute at all and I put 12k miles on my car. But I drive a kid to school and I drive to my hobbies and I drive to the grocery store, and to the beach a few times a year. We also do closer driving getaways a few times a year.

I have not had a car payment since 2020. I have 3 older cars worth a total of about $15k. 3 drivers in the family. Only 2 of the cars still have comprehensive coverage. I do my own oil, brakes, and other small repairs. Insurance is $6k a year and making me feel car poor. Its demoralizing that the high cost of living is inescapable.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:yup....avg price of new car this year at $50K. If you live in Fairfax County, you will pay 6% car tax, the crazy insurance rates, etc which essentially has made new car purchases for the wealth. No different now vs homes, and other high price items where MC "realistic and best value" route is purchasing a used car. Hoping EVs will lower new car price, but EV prices likely contributing to the inflation here.

Or you could get a used Altima for $7k and pay the VA DMV a $500 fee for permission to drive without insurance. The working class can still manage to have a car.

YES..the working class will "options" but will not be "owners" of future new cars.

?What. Do you mean lower income families? I never understood working class as a phase because that describes a majority of people in their 20s through 60s. Usually 25 year olds have lower incomes and they’ll buy a used car. As income increases there are more options.

We had used cars that we drove into the ground in our 20s. Now we just bought a new $45k car, paid with cash. I wanted a Genesis but the price was too high for us. Maybe next car or maybe a used car who knows.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel this way as well. We have a teen driver. What used to be a right of passage and no big deal, is now a huge financial undertaking. Insurance alone is exorbitant. Plus gas. I live in a HCOL area where there is a lot of driving and no public transportation. I hope my own car lasts a long time because I have zero interest in replacing it.

It is weird. When I was a kid around the turn of the century, teens were able to pick up working cars for under $1K and insurance was very manageable. I feel like everything is becoming dystopian.

Yes, and then Obama "stimulated" our economy with the Cash for Clunkers program that got rid of these inexpensive used cars.  At the same time, he made sure that new cars would be more expensive by instituting emission standards based on the car's "footprint," which incentivized automakers to focus on producing larger, more expensive vehicles.

Health insurance also used to be affordable before the Affordable Care Act.  Racial tensions were at all-time lows before he inflamed them.  Lots of things worsened because of Obama.  Were you not aware of this?  It's why Republicans have dominated Americans politics since his departure.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is an insane expense for a depreciating asset. That’s why I drove an old crappy corrolla. Try to keep costs low as possible. If you want wheels if you can manage to keep the annualized cost incl insurance to around 100/mo on average that’s a “good” deal. So if you want wheels - 100/mo minimum and that’s driving some old pos

I have a 19 year old honda and insurance is only $400 a year (Maryland). Maintenance probably another $250/year.

How much do you drive? Seems like you aren't factoring in new tires, brakes, battery, etc. that likely had to be replaced several times, assuming you drive say 1000 miles per month. However, if you only drive 5,000 miles a year...probably a different story.

DP but this is another huge benefit of working from home. Now, I drive around 3,000 miles per year. I just spent $700 putting new tires on my 2018 Corolla—it was kind of a shock to learn that cars can actually cost money because that’s the first time in seven years I’ve had to spend more than the cost of an oil change on my car.

And of course, since it’s a Corolla, I paid cash—so no car payments or the rip-off comprehensive insurance coverage that lenders require.

Serious question, though, how does everyone rack up so many miles on their cars?