Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know they are almost everywhere, but where is this pervasive?

Is it common for the HOS to belong to an exclusive country club? Which schools have the HOS belonging to one of the same club as several governing board members and vip donors etc....?

Many. I don’t live in the DMV but membership has always been part of our contract negotiation process when hiring new heads. Only one declined over the years and that’s because they had young kids and were very involved at another club. Otherwise everyone has relocated and accepted it is a benefit.

I don’t belong to that club so I can’t share how it looks in practice in terms of socializing and stuff.

What are you talking about?? Your writing is very unclear. You don't live in the DMV but served on a board here? It makes no sense. I know for certain the current HOS at a few of the top schools absolutely DO NOT belong to a country club in the DMV. Most do not at least at the top schools maybe with the exception of one and it is frowned upon as it is a conflict of interest clearly when trying to address issues in the community....

Yes, I live out of the area but serve on a board in the dmv. I wouldn’t say it’s a top school, so I won’t pretend to know how those schools handle it.

In other areas we’ve lived, especially outside Philly and in TX, memberships for HOS is quite common. I think it probably depends on the culture of the school and how hard it is to access that kind of thing. In an area with really long wait lists or expensive initiation fees, it is nice for a HOS family to have access to local social opportunities.

My friend is a head in CA and she was offered a fancy tennis club membership which she accepted but which is mostly used by her children and DH, plus random one-off alumni social events and that kind of thing.

We only have a dd at one school..not at many so we don't know. You would need to have kids at multiple schools.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know they are almost everywhere, but where is this pervasive?

Is it common for the HOS to belong to an exclusive country club? Which schools have the HOS belonging to one of the same club as several governing board members and vip donors etc....?

Many. I don’t live in the DMV but membership has always been part of our contract negotiation process when hiring new heads. Only one declined over the years and that’s because they had young kids and were very involved at another club. Otherwise everyone has relocated and accepted it is a benefit.

I don’t belong to that club so I can’t share how it looks in practice in terms of socializing and stuff.

What are you talking about?? Your writing is very unclear. You don't live in the DMV but served on a board here? It makes no sense. I know for certain the current HOS at a few of the top schools absolutely DO NOT belong to a country club in the DMV. Most do not at least at the top schools maybe with the exception of one and it is frowned upon as it is a conflict of interest clearly when trying to address issues in the community....

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know they are almost everywhere, but where is this pervasive?

Is it common for the HOS to belong to an exclusive country club? Which schools have the HOS belonging to one of the same club as several governing board members and vip donors etc....?

Many. I don’t live in the DMV but membership has always been part of our contract negotiation process when hiring new heads. Only one declined over the years and that’s because they had young kids and were very involved at another club. Otherwise everyone has relocated and accepted it is a benefit.

I don’t belong to that club so I can’t share how it looks in practice in terms of socializing and stuff.

Anonymous wrote:I know they are almost everywhere, but where is this pervasive?

Is it common for the HOS to belong to an exclusive country club? Which schools have the HOS belonging to one of the same club as several governing board members and vip donors etc....?

Anonymous wrote:Eager to avoid Chevy parents en masse since our family's first exposure at a local preschool. It's hard to imagine their presence wouldn't exacerbate relational bullying.

With that in mind, does this sound like a good list for middle/upper?: GDS, Sheridan, Madeira, WIS, Burke. Welcome any other ideas

GDS for sure is a good bet -- the school works hard to address this specific issue and the families drawn to the school care about inclusiveness and avoiding cliques.

I've heard mixed things about WIS. I think it is cohort dependent. Have some friends with a boy there who is having a tough time but it seems like it might just be the boys in his particular cohort and not necessarily a school wide issue. The population here is obviously more international so I think the culture fluctuates a lot. We know others with kids there who love it.

If the commute is doable for you, I'd take a look at Sandy Spring Friends School. It has a great culture. It is not considered one of the top schools academically but there are plenty of smart kids there. But I know it's not convenient for a lot of families.

Eager to avoid Chevy parents en masse since our family's first exposure at a local preschool. It's hard to imagine their presence wouldn't exacerbate relational bullying.

With that in mind, does this sound like a good list for middle/upper?: GDS, Sheridan, Madeira, WIS, Burke. Welcome any other ideas

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know they are almost everywhere, but where is this pervasive?

Boys and girls can be equally mean for the record.

We have friends at a variety of private schools in the DC, MD, VA area. The most common theme I hear from friends at all of these schools including ours is that the schools that have a very high percentage of parents that belong to either Chevy or Congo tend to also have a very distinct culture of mean kid/mean parent behavior. Yes, mean parents tend to have mean kids and for whatever reason those families and parents tend to cluster together in a very unhealthy way.

Agree. The 8th grade class at SR has a large number of girls whose families belong to Congo or Chevy. It seems the girls have learned their elitist/exclusive behavior from their moms.

Agree with all of this. Boys can also be very cruel and always get a pass. It seems that in addition to the country club culture, you find especially mean kids in Lacrosse. The kids of both create a culture of exclusivity that usually extends from their parents behavior.

Also the 10th grade class at SR is chock full of mean girls. Several girls switched schools because the bullying was so bad. Heard the same about 9th and now 8th too, something toxic is going on over there in the SR school culture.

DP. It is the parents. Some of the same parents have kids at STA or used to have kids at STA and other schools like Visi and Holy Child and they have the same issues there. The schools will not tell you.

Op my advice for you is you have to sort of ask around to people you trust. It is difficult to ask and get an honest answer because most do not want to get involved with talking about this sort of thing. That is when this site comes in handy because you may get some insight that you will not get in person from others who understandably do not want to engage.

As a parent at a school with a toxic boy culture but thankfully truly lovely girls in my kid’s grade, I would caution you from thinking you might get an honest answer about school culture form anyone but a sibling or your very best friend. I thought I would be honest about my kid’s school if asked, but once I was, I changed my mind. As much as I’ve wanted to discourage people from applying into bad cohorts at my kid’s school, I’ve thought twice about it because of the potential consequences of honesty. People have to find this out on their own, especially because everyone perceives this stuff differently. Also, private schools are small universes and once you start overlapping with clubs and other schools, you realize that you can’t risk honesty. Schools and mean families know this and thrive because the stakes of telling the truth are too high.

We are moving our kid to a “lesser” school this year because we’ve had it with all of this.

Highschool?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know they are almost everywhere, but where is this pervasive?

Boys and girls can be equally mean for the record.

We have friends at a variety of private schools in the DC, MD, VA area. The most common theme I hear from friends at all of these schools including ours is that the schools that have a very high percentage of parents that belong to either Chevy or Congo tend to also have a very distinct culture of mean kid/mean parent behavior. Yes, mean parents tend to have mean kids and for whatever reason those families and parents tend to cluster together in a very unhealthy way.

Agree. The 8th grade class at SR has a large number of girls whose families belong to Congo or Chevy. It seems the girls have learned their elitist/exclusive behavior from their moms.

Agree with all of this. Boys can also be very cruel and always get a pass. It seems that in addition to the country club culture, you find especially mean kids in Lacrosse. The kids of both create a culture of exclusivity that usually extends from their parents behavior.

Also the 10th grade class at SR is chock full of mean girls. Several girls switched schools because the bullying was so bad. Heard the same about 9th and now 8th too, something toxic is going on over there in the SR school culture.

DP. It is the parents. Some of the same parents have kids at STA or used to have kids at STA and other schools like Visi and Holy Child and they have the same issues there. The schools will not tell you.

Op my advice for you is you have to sort of ask around to people you trust. It is difficult to ask and get an honest answer because most do not want to get involved with talking about this sort of thing. That is when this site comes in handy because you may get some insight that you will not get in person from others who understandably do not want to engage.

As a parent at a school with a toxic boy culture but thankfully truly lovely girls in my kid’s grade, I would caution you from thinking you might get an honest answer about school culture form anyone but a sibling or your very best friend. I thought I would be honest about my kid’s school if asked, but once I was, I changed my mind. As much as I’ve wanted to discourage people from applying into bad cohorts at my kid’s school, I’ve thought twice about it because of the potential consequences of honesty. People have to find this out on their own, especially because everyone perceives this stuff differently. Also, private schools are small universes and once you start overlapping with clubs and other schools, you realize that you can’t risk honesty. Schools and mean families know this and thrive because the stakes of telling the truth are too high.

We are moving our kid to a “lesser” school this year because we’ve had it with all of this.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised to see so much Holton on here. I haven't heard that. Is it based on recent info? Or a few years ago (when I did hear it more)?

No, recent.

The thing about Holton is that if the girl fits certain profiles, she can go straight through with no issues at all. And if she doesn't, it's a nightmare. And the behavior is true, classic relational aggression, not straight up bullying. So for the outsider girls, there's no concrete behavior to point to and say "this is hurtful." Instead, it's just being iced out, pitied, quietly sidelined in activities and classes. There is nothing to fight. You are simply invisible.

It is not an inclusive place. At all.

What are the “certain profiles”?

Sporty, outgoing, no academic struggles (does not need to be an academic superstar, but no obvious academic weaknesses, or if she has them, parents are 100% on top of them with tutors and support), on the preppy side (not overly artsy or alternative), parents should be sociable but not overbearing, no known family drama.

I wonder why the artsy/alternative/nerdy girls don’t band together and be their own group and just ignore the drama from the preppy ones.

They just wait until adulthood and have happy successful lives.

So true!!

I think the moms at STA deserve their own thread. So mean.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know they are almost everywhere, but where is this pervasive?

Boys and girls can be equally mean for the record.

We have friends at a variety of private schools in the DC, MD, VA area. The most common theme I hear from friends at all of these schools including ours is that the schools that have a very high percentage of parents that belong to either Chevy or Congo tend to also have a very distinct culture of mean kid/mean parent behavior. Yes, mean parents tend to have mean kids and for whatever reason those families and parents tend to cluster together in a very unhealthy way.

Agree. The 8th grade class at SR has a large number of girls whose families belong to Congo or Chevy. It seems the girls have learned their elitist/exclusive behavior from their moms.

Agree with all of this. Boys can also be very cruel and always get a pass. It seems that in addition to the country club culture, you find especially mean kids in Lacrosse. The kids of both create a culture of exclusivity that usually extends from their parents behavior.

Also the 10th grade class at SR is chock full of mean girls. Several girls switched schools because the bullying was so bad. Heard the same about 9th and now 8th too, something toxic is going on over there in the SR school culture.

DP. It is the parents. Some of the same parents have kids at STA or used to have kids at STA and other schools like Visi and Holy Child and they have the same issues there. The schools will not tell you.

Op my advice for you is you have to sort of ask around to people you trust. It is difficult to ask and get an honest answer because most do not want to get involved with talking about this sort of thing. That is when this site comes in handy because you may get some insight that you will not get in person from others who understandably do not want to engage.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know they are almost everywhere, but where is this pervasive?

Boys and girls can be equally mean for the record.

We have friends at a variety of private schools in the DC, MD, VA area. The most common theme I hear from friends at all of these schools including ours is that the schools that have a very high percentage of parents that belong to either Chevy or Congo tend to also have a very distinct culture of mean kid/mean parent behavior. Yes, mean parents tend to have mean kids and for whatever reason those families and parents tend to cluster together in a very unhealthy way.

Agree. The 8th grade class at SR has a large number of girls whose families belong to Congo or Chevy. It seems the girls have learned their elitist/exclusive behavior from their moms.

Agree with all of this. Boys can also be very cruel and always get a pass. It seems that in addition to the country club culture, you find especially mean kids in Lacrosse. The kids of both create a culture of exclusivity that usually extends from their parents behavior.

Also the 10th grade class at SR is chock full of mean girls. Several girls switched schools because the bullying was so bad. Heard the same about 9th and now 8th too, something toxic is going on over there in the SR school culture.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

You'd be hard pressed to find a mean girl at Madeira.



Hard-pressed to find a mean girl at Madeira? There are mean girls at Madeira, just not as many as at some schools. Someone is obviously drinking the Madeira Kool-Aid and also smoking something while she drinks.

I dunno, PP. My daughter, who is quite sensitive and has definitely seen mean girl behaviors at her K-8, says that she has absolutely not met any mean girls at Madeira. She is rather in awe of that, actually.

From what I understand, there are some students who can be kinda annoying or snotty, but I haven't heard about any "mean girl" behavior. If it does happen it's not super common.

I don't have experience at Madeira, but I think the distinction being made here is important.

There are mean kids (not just girls) everywhere, private or public. Some kids are snotty or rude, some are entitled, etc. You aren't going to find a school where there is just no behavior like this at all. Just like all schools have shy kids, or kids who love to talk, or competitive kids, or whatever. These are just personality traits.

But what I take OP, and most PPs, to be talking about is not an individual behavior but a group behavior. Groups of girls who engage in exclusion, cliques, gossip, or strict social hierarchies (especially if based on stuff like wealth or status of parents). Some schools are worse in this respect. Schools and parents can prevent this behavior by encouraging students to be respectful of all kids, refusing to give special status to kids from certain family (and having a culture of families who don't demand special status because of who they are or how much money they donate), and ensuring there are plenty of opportunities of students to intermix and get to know each other to reduce cliques.

But some schools, and some family communities, lean into these behaviors. If you want to avoid it, ask schools directly how they handle these issues, and also talk to as many families at the school as possible and especially talk to families who don't necessarily have high social status because their experience will help tell you how much of an impact wealth/status has on the experience of individual kids at the school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know they are almost everywhere, but where is this pervasive?

Boys and girls can be equally mean for the record.

We have friends at a variety of private schools in the DC, MD, VA area. The most common theme I hear from friends at all of these schools including ours is that the schools that have a very high percentage of parents that belong to either Chevy or Congo tend to also have a very distinct culture of mean kid/mean parent behavior. Yes, mean parents tend to have mean kids and for whatever reason those families and parents tend to cluster together in a very unhealthy way.

Agree. The 8th grade class at SR has a large number of girls whose families belong to Congo or Chevy. It seems the girls have learned their elitist/exclusive behavior from their moms.

That is too bad. I thought it was primarily the current 9th at SR plus some of the upper school grades.

There seems to be a lot of cross over with these types of families at SR, Holy Child, Visi with STA? Sort of surprising being it is episcopal and others are Catholic?