We just went through an annoying club experience.

My oldest is a 2010 and on top team and has been for 10+ years.

My youngest is a 2016. She started playing a little older but tore up the rec league and was moved into their all stars program and did the same.

They invited us to the competitive cattle call tryouts and my 2016 was put into the 4th group with the players wearing helmets.

I couldn't believe it. There was definitely a disconnect. I suppose I should have shmuzed up to the youngers doc or just went directly to the top team coach. But I thought the club was tracking success + would be a little more accommodating with top players younger siblings.

Meh, big deal. Their loss we went down the street to a smaller club. The parents are way nicer. The practice facilities are better. Coach played in college and is doing everything right. My kid has done the same thing at the new club and is scoring all the goals. Eventually we'll play and likely beat the big club the put my daughter in the "helmet crew" during tryouts and I fully expect coaches to be waiting to say hi in the parking lot.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While entire teams are not pre-made, the majority of them are. Perhaps 70-80% of the roster. This spring I knew two of the three coaches in my kid's age group. Both coaches told me exactly which kids were getting offers to which teams and exactly which kids were not getting offers.

So, while there is perhaps 1-4 potential open spots it's not uncommon for teams to be "pre-made". Now, the issue comes when clubs don't always place the best players with the top teams because they want all their teams to perform well so they spread out the bubble players. This is unfair to those players because proper development requires players to be around players of even skill (usually). Otherwise, it's a wasted season.

That’s because of positioning requirements.

18 person teams don’t need 4 keepers right? Same is true of other positions, they don’t need 6 forwards or 4 center backs. So yes, the top 6 forwards in a club’s age bracket are going to get broken up across the top two teams, even if forward number 5 is - on a 4 corners eval - better than 14 of the players on the top team.

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Not really, and especially not for something ENCL or MLSnext. There is a good chance that the 4th or fifth best forward at tryouts is a better left back than the second best left back. Talent tends to go to striker, center mid, and, to a lesser degree, center back. The top team is not going to keep a right mid when another kid who calls themselves a center mid could play the right mid better than them. The best teams are mostly former strikers and center mids who learned a new position.

I'll add one more... coaches that are not moving up to the next age bracket are barely asked for their opinion on current players. Current players are barely assessed by next years coaches. New (prospective) to club players are chosen over current players, thereby pushing current player to lower tier teams to accommodate new players (even when current players are just as good or better)... this might not be all clubs, but has been my recent experience.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While entire teams are not pre-made, the majority of them are. Perhaps 70-80% of the roster. This spring I knew two of the three coaches in my kid's age group. Both coaches told me exactly which kids were getting offers to which teams and exactly which kids were not getting offers.

So, while there is perhaps 1-4 potential open spots it's not uncommon for teams to be "pre-made". Now, the issue comes when clubs don't always place the best players with the top teams because they want all their teams to perform well so they spread out the bubble players. This is unfair to those players because proper development requires players to be around players of even skill (usually). Otherwise, it's a wasted season.

That’s because of positioning requirements.

18 person teams don’t need 4 keepers right? Same is true of other positions, they don’t need 6 forwards or 4 center backs. So yes, the top 6 forwards in a club’s age bracket are going to get broken up across the top two teams, even if forward number 5 is - on a 4 corners eval - better than 14 of the players on the top team.

What about 12 roster teams? Also, you're missing the point. The point is coaches already know who they want back regardless. So, the tryouts are not really tryouts. I do feel bad for some kids who try hard to get onto a team, only not to be selected because they were overlooked (even if they are better than an existing team player).

In the end the point was coaches already know who they want on the roster and do they do not. And most team managers are aware of this because they have to work together on rosters and guest players, etc.

Anonymous wrote:I think it’s important to realize that some clubs have 5-6 players who are going to be cut each year and replaced. Parents think going in that their kid will be on the team until the end of high school, but in reality they will make the team, sit the bench for a year and then get cut at the end of the year. I don’t know how to avoid that but coaches should be more transparent. This is obviously the more competitive teams, ECNL, ECNL-R, EDP, etc.

These players need to subsidize the discounts of the starters who play full game minutes.

Anonymous wrote:While entire teams are not pre-made, the majority of them are. Perhaps 70-80% of the roster. This spring I knew two of the three coaches in my kid's age group. Both coaches told me exactly which kids were getting offers to which teams and exactly which kids were not getting offers.

So, while there is perhaps 1-4 potential open spots it's not uncommon for teams to be "pre-made". Now, the issue comes when clubs don't always place the best players with the top teams because they want all their teams to perform well so they spread out the bubble players. This is unfair to those players because proper development requires players to be around players of even skill (usually). Otherwise, it's a wasted season.

That’s because of positioning requirements.

18 person teams don’t need 4 keepers right? Same is true of other positions, they don’t need 6 forwards or 4 center backs. So yes, the top 6 forwards in a club’s age bracket are going to get broken up across the top two teams, even if forward number 5 is - on a 4 corners eval - better than 14 of the players on the top team.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While entire teams are not pre-made, the majority of them are. Perhaps 70-80% of the roster. This spring I knew two of the three coaches in my kid's age group. Both coaches told me exactly which kids were getting offers to which teams and exactly which kids were not getting offers.

So, while there is perhaps 1-4 potential open spots it's not uncommon for teams to be "pre-made". Now, the issue comes when clubs don't always place the best players with the top teams because they want all their teams to perform well so they spread out the bubble players. This is unfair to those players because proper development requires players to be around players of even skill (usually). Otherwise, it's a wasted season.

We found the one whose kid is passed on year to year ^^^

Lol. You have such an “in” that they tell you all the other kids’ business

Late response, but no. The reason I know these things is because I'm a team manager and I speak with the coaches within my kid's age regularly.

Geez I guess I should be a team manager too. Although I didn’t think any of the team managers we’ve had so far had that level of inside info.

They knew. They just didn't tell you.

+1000

It’s a trade off, no doubt. Why is it that most, but not all, Team Managers have the DC that’s on the bubble, or rather, should be?

Because they know their kid is on the bubble and they think being team manager is a way to secure their kid's spot on the team. I have seen this on multiple teams my kid has been on. One of the kids did eventually get moved down and literally everyone, including the kids, knew it should have happened a long time before it did.

Definitely coaches have favorites.or kids they just don’t like. I know a player who got cut and no one could figure out why. Teammates went to bat for them, other coaches loved them… there seemed to be no good reason. But the coach basically replaced them with someone from the high school he coached at.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While entire teams are not pre-made, the majority of them are. Perhaps 70-80% of the roster. This spring I knew two of the three coaches in my kid's age group. Both coaches told me exactly which kids were getting offers to which teams and exactly which kids were not getting offers.

So, while there is perhaps 1-4 potential open spots it's not uncommon for teams to be "pre-made". Now, the issue comes when clubs don't always place the best players with the top teams because they want all their teams to perform well so they spread out the bubble players. This is unfair to those players because proper development requires players to be around players of even skill (usually). Otherwise, it's a wasted season.

We found the one whose kid is passed on year to year ^^^

Lol. You have such an “in” that they tell you all the other kids’ business

Late response, but no. The reason I know these things is because I'm a team manager and I speak with the coaches within my kid's age regularly.

Geez I guess I should be a team manager too. Although I didn’t think any of the team managers we’ve had so far had that level of inside info.

They knew. They just didn't tell you.

+1000

It’s a trade off, no doubt. Why is it that most, but not all, Team Managers have the DC that’s on the bubble, or rather, should be?

I think it’s a fair trade, being a team manager sucks balls. I’ve put in about 80-100 hours of volunteer work putting together player cards, registering for tournaments and collecting fees each year for the last 3 years. Each coach has given my kid a little extra attention because of it. -That’s life and yet, I’m ready for another parent to step up to be the team manager next year. I’m quitting this crap next year. Good luck organizing the socials, game day rosters and updating PlayMetrics.

I’m not a team manager…but agreed. They’re on the hook for a lot of things, and a lot of things can go wrong. Our team manager just shakes his head when talking about his role. It’s not a fun job and is a pretty big sacrifice on behalf of the team.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While entire teams are not pre-made, the majority of them are. Perhaps 70-80% of the roster. This spring I knew two of the three coaches in my kid's age group. Both coaches told me exactly which kids were getting offers to which teams and exactly which kids were not getting offers.

So, while there is perhaps 1-4 potential open spots it's not uncommon for teams to be "pre-made". Now, the issue comes when clubs don't always place the best players with the top teams because they want all their teams to perform well so they spread out the bubble players. This is unfair to those players because proper development requires players to be around players of even skill (usually). Otherwise, it's a wasted season.

We found the one whose kid is passed on year to year ^^^

Lol. You have such an “in” that they tell you all the other kids’ business

Late response, but no. The reason I know these things is because I'm a team manager and I speak with the coaches within my kid's age regularly.

Geez I guess I should be a team manager too. Although I didn’t think any of the team managers we’ve had so far had that level of inside info.

They knew. They just didn't tell you.

+1000

It’s a trade off, no doubt. Why is it that most, but not all, Team Managers have the DC that’s on the bubble, or rather, should be?

I think it’s a fair trade, being a team manager sucks balls. I’ve put in about 80-100 hours of volunteer work putting together player cards, registering for tournaments and collecting fees each year for the last 3 years. Each coach has given my kid a little extra attention because of it. -That’s life and yet, I’m ready for another parent to step up to be the team manager next year. I’m quitting this crap next year. Good luck organizing the socials, game day rosters and updating PlayMetrics.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While entire teams are not pre-made, the majority of them are. Perhaps 70-80% of the roster. This spring I knew two of the three coaches in my kid's age group. Both coaches told me exactly which kids were getting offers to which teams and exactly which kids were not getting offers.

So, while there is perhaps 1-4 potential open spots it's not uncommon for teams to be "pre-made". Now, the issue comes when clubs don't always place the best players with the top teams because they want all their teams to perform well so they spread out the bubble players. This is unfair to those players because proper development requires players to be around players of even skill (usually). Otherwise, it's a wasted season.

We found the one whose kid is passed on year to year ^^^

Lol. You have such an “in” that they tell you all the other kids’ business

Late response, but no. The reason I know these things is because I'm a team manager and I speak with the coaches within my kid's age regularly.

Geez I guess I should be a team manager too. Although I didn’t think any of the team managers we’ve had so far had that level of inside info.

They knew. They just didn't tell you.

+1000

It’s a trade off, no doubt. Why is it that most, but not all, Team Managers have the DC that’s on the bubble, or rather, should be?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While entire teams are not pre-made, the majority of them are. Perhaps 70-80% of the roster. This spring I knew two of the three coaches in my kid's age group. Both coaches told me exactly which kids were getting offers to which teams and exactly which kids were not getting offers.

So, while there is perhaps 1-4 potential open spots it's not uncommon for teams to be "pre-made". Now, the issue comes when clubs don't always place the best players with the top teams because they want all their teams to perform well so they spread out the bubble players. This is unfair to those players because proper development requires players to be around players of even skill (usually). Otherwise, it's a wasted season.

We found the one whose kid is passed on year to year ^^^

Lol. You have such an “in” that they tell you all the other kids’ business

Late response, but no. The reason I know these things is because I'm a team manager and I speak with the coaches within my kid's age regularly.

Geez I guess I should be a team manager too. Although I didn’t think any of the team managers we’ve had so far had that level of inside info.

They knew. They just didn't tell you.

What if I asked? Are they allowed to tell me?

Also- we are talking about parent volunteer team managers right? Not like paid employees of the club?

With a question like that you don't have a kid in travel. Don't worry about it.

LOL. I have more than one actually. They’re pretty young though, and maybe being a team manager for kids old enough for ECNL is more involved.

I know it was a newbie question, and yes I know there’s a treasurer and the social media coordinator and all that, I’m not that dumb haha. But we know our team manager parents and just have a hard time picturing them knowing all this intel when, for example, just a few days ago one wasn’t even sure if their own kid was going to be moved down. We’re not like BFFs or anything but feel they would at least be transparent about not being able to tell us, if they knew.

The one exception I’ve been told (IRL, not the internet) is team managers knowing mid-season roster changes, which is consistent with the examples described here. But such changes, at least for us, have been rare so far, and isn’t our concern right now anyway.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While entire teams are not pre-made, the majority of them are. Perhaps 70-80% of the roster. This spring I knew two of the three coaches in my kid's age group. Both coaches told me exactly which kids were getting offers to which teams and exactly which kids were not getting offers.

So, while there is perhaps 1-4 potential open spots it's not uncommon for teams to be "pre-made". Now, the issue comes when clubs don't always place the best players with the top teams because they want all their teams to perform well so they spread out the bubble players. This is unfair to those players because proper development requires players to be around players of even skill (usually). Otherwise, it's a wasted season.

We found the one whose kid is passed on year to year ^^^

Lol. You have such an “in” that they tell you all the other kids’ business

Late response, but no. The reason I know these things is because I'm a team manager and I speak with the coaches within my kid's age regularly.

Geez I guess I should be a team manager too. Although I didn’t think any of the team managers we’ve had so far had that level of inside info.

They knew. They just didn't tell you.

What if I asked? Are they allowed to tell me?

Also- we are talking about parent volunteer team managers right? Not like paid employees of the club?

With a question like that you don't have a kid in travel. Don't worry about it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While entire teams are not pre-made, the majority of them are. Perhaps 70-80% of the roster. This spring I knew two of the three coaches in my kid's age group. Both coaches told me exactly which kids were getting offers to which teams and exactly which kids were not getting offers.

So, while there is perhaps 1-4 potential open spots it's not uncommon for teams to be "pre-made". Now, the issue comes when clubs don't always place the best players with the top teams because they want all their teams to perform well so they spread out the bubble players. This is unfair to those players because proper development requires players to be around players of even skill (usually). Otherwise, it's a wasted season.

We found the one whose kid is passed on year to year ^^^

Lol. You have such an “in” that they tell you all the other kids’ business

Late response, but no. The reason I know these things is because I'm a team manager and I speak with the coaches within my kid's age regularly.

Geez I guess I should be a team manager too. Although I didn’t think any of the team managers we’ve had so far had that level of inside info.

They knew. They just didn't tell you.

What if I asked? Are they allowed to tell me?

Also- we are talking about parent volunteer team managers right? Not like paid employees of the club?

Yes, team managers are parent volunteers. There's usually a team manager, treasurer, and sometimes a tournament director for each team helping coordinate the season.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While entire teams are not pre-made, the majority of them are. Perhaps 70-80% of the roster. This spring I knew two of the three coaches in my kid's age group. Both coaches told me exactly which kids were getting offers to which teams and exactly which kids were not getting offers.

So, while there is perhaps 1-4 potential open spots it's not uncommon for teams to be "pre-made". Now, the issue comes when clubs don't always place the best players with the top teams because they want all their teams to perform well so they spread out the bubble players. This is unfair to those players because proper development requires players to be around players of even skill (usually). Otherwise, it's a wasted season.

We found the one whose kid is passed on year to year ^^^

Lol. You have such an “in” that they tell you all the other kids’ business

Late response, but no. The reason I know these things is because I'm a team manager and I speak with the coaches within my kid's age regularly.

Geez I guess I should be a team manager too. Although I didn’t think any of the team managers we’ve had so far had that level of inside info.

They knew. They just didn't tell you.

What if I asked? Are they allowed to tell me?

Also- we are talking about parent volunteer team managers right? Not like paid employees of the club?

These are adults. They can say whatever they please. However, most team managers are smart enough not to say anything. Otherwise, the coaches will find out. Last year with three weeks left before the spring season started my coach told me two girls from the upper team were being moved down. I'm the team manager. I had to tell the treasurer because we were playing an early spring tournament and fees had to be paid. One practice I walked up to the upper team team manager and asked her when the roster changes were going to happen. She looked at me at first with a blank stare acting like she knew nothing. Then I told her the coaches told me and I needed to make sure the fees were taken from the players being moved down. Once she knew that I knew she was an open book.

So, yes team managers keep secrets.