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Anonymous wrote:I wish I could post this in the thread about Rob Reiner’s documentary on Christian Nationalism but it got locked. This is language in a real court ruling in America.

The Catholic Church strongly opposes IVF.

The Catholic Church? I lost all respect for the CC during the HIV/AIDS epidemic when they opposed condom use (because they oppose contraception except for the rhythm method) and promoted "chastity." Never mind, how they protected pedophile priests...

The twin cruelties of denying birth control and their child raping road show is why I despise the Catholic Church, add to that their worsening the HIV/AIDS crisis and their political action and they’re even worse.

I guess denying IVF is why they need to have more White babies for the pipeline or whatever the Handmaiden said.

The Church’s teaching on the immorality of IVF is based upon God ordained natural law. Chastity outside of marriage between a man and a woman has always been part of the Catechism. The Catholic Church is furthermore growing fastest in Subsaharan Africa so it has nothing to do with white babies (the Church is shrinking fastest in Western Europe and North America. The next Pope may very well be a black African.
Oh, and there’s a very special place in Hell for child raping priests.

Folks that do not believe in IVF should not get IVF treatment. Other people were given an amazing IVF treatment by their God to allow them to have a family and it does nto concern you in any way.

I have one vote just like you do. My vote is determined by my conscience formed by the doctrine of the Catholic Church.

I am catholic and I have a children conceived by IVF. God told me to do it and was right.

NP
You chose to go against the teachings of the church. You have the right to make that choice, but that choice makes you NOT a practicing Catholic.

I turn down the greatest gift god has given me and THAT makes me a Catholic. I don't think so.

If you believe god has given you that gift, that is your option. Others believe in science.

I believe in science. My argument is that for every religious person telling me that IVF is forbidden by this or that church there is a flip argument that IVF is encouraged by this or that church.

In my opinion reproductive decisions are private and personal. No one has to treat infertility with IVF but no one should be denied that treatment if they believe that it is the right decision for their situation.

The facts of the original case are beyond bizarre and seem like some bad movie. A “patient” at a fertility clinic “eloped” and broke into the room that stored frozen embryos, broke into the storage and grabbed several frozen embryos (in their containers) with their bare hands. Since that was basically a serious freezer, the eloper’s hands were severely burned immediately from the freezing metal and so the eloper dropped all of the embryos he/she was carrying and them broke onto the floor. When the breach was discovered the frozen embryos essentially had died.

So this was a joint lawsuit from 3 of the affected families who lost embryos for “unlawful death”.

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Anonymous wrote:I wish I could post this in the thread about Rob Reiner’s documentary on Christian Nationalism but it got locked. This is language in a real court ruling in America.

The Catholic Church strongly opposes IVF.

The Catholic Church? I lost all respect for the CC during the HIV/AIDS epidemic when they opposed condom use (because they oppose contraception except for the rhythm method) and promoted "chastity." Never mind, how they protected pedophile priests...

The twin cruelties of denying birth control and their child raping road show is why I despise the Catholic Church, add to that their worsening the HIV/AIDS crisis and their political action and they’re even worse.

I guess denying IVF is why they need to have more White babies for the pipeline or whatever the Handmaiden said.

The Church’s teaching on the immorality of IVF is based upon God ordained natural law. Chastity outside of marriage between a man and a woman has always been part of the Catechism. The Catholic Church is furthermore growing fastest in Subsaharan Africa so it has nothing to do with white babies (the Church is shrinking fastest in Western Europe and North America. The next Pope may very well be a black African.
Oh, and there’s a very special place in Hell for child raping priests.

Folks that do not believe in IVF should not get IVF treatment. Other people were given an amazing IVF treatment by their God to allow them to have a family and it does nto concern you in any way.

I have one vote just like you do. My vote is determined by my conscience formed by the doctrine of the Catholic Church.

I am catholic and I have a children conceived by IVF. God told me to do it and was right.

NP
You chose to go against the teachings of the church. You have the right to make that choice, but that choice makes you NOT a practicing Catholic.

I turn down the greatest gift god has given me and THAT makes me a Catholic. I don't think so.

If you believe god has given you that gift, that is your option. Others believe in science.

Anonymous wrote:I'm really tired of evangelicals and conservative Catholics imposing their religions on everyone else.

I'm Christian and I'm tired of it, can't imagine how tired non Christians are.

Believe me, very very tired. Exhausted actually.

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Anonymous wrote:I wish I could post this in the thread about Rob Reiner’s documentary on Christian Nationalism but it got locked. This is language in a real court ruling in America.

The Catholic Church strongly opposes IVF.

The Catholic Church? I lost all respect for the CC during the HIV/AIDS epidemic when they opposed condom use (because they oppose contraception except for the rhythm method) and promoted "chastity." Never mind, how they protected pedophile priests...

The twin cruelties of denying birth control and their child raping road show is why I despise the Catholic Church, add to that their worsening the HIV/AIDS crisis and their political action and they’re even worse.

I guess denying IVF is why they need to have more White babies for the pipeline or whatever the Handmaiden said.

The Church’s teaching on the immorality of IVF is based upon God ordained natural law. Chastity outside of marriage between a man and a woman has always been part of the Catechism. The Catholic Church is furthermore growing fastest in Subsaharan Africa so it has nothing to do with white babies (the Church is shrinking fastest in Western Europe and North America. The next Pope may very well be a black African.
Oh, and there’s a very special place in Hell for child raping priests.

Folks that do not believe in IVF should not get IVF treatment. Other people were given an amazing IVF treatment by their God to allow them to have a family and it does nto concern you in any way.

I have one vote just like you do. My vote is determined by my conscience formed by the doctrine of the Catholic Church.

I am catholic and I have a children conceived by IVF. God told me to do it and was right.

We are all sinners but God cannot ordain that which is sin.

You are not to sit in judgement either. That is between PP and her God. You don't get to decide for everyone what God, if a god even exists - which many dispute, would make the law of Alabama. God is not a legislator nor a Justice. The law of this land is meant to be a compromise of all of our people, and we don't all agree. You cannot make something a crime when others believe it to be a God given right. Ironic, no?

That’s actually not true. I can judge those actions which violate Church teaching as right or wrong. It’s why we have Doctrine. Do I condemn those people who have committed the wrong-no.
As a Catholic though I am obligated to support the teachings of the Church which are universal.

What you consider to be "universal" someone else might consider to be suffocating. When the royal "you" impose your morals and ethics on to others, it is problematic.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate to say I told you so, but thus begins the end of IVF....

https://publicportal-api.alappeals.gov/courts/68f021c4-6a44-4735-9a76-5360b2e8af13/cms/case/343d203a-b13d-463a-8176-c46e3ae4f695/docketentrydocuments/e3d95592-3cbe-4384-afa6-063d4595aa1d

It really does not make any sense to prize zygotes in-utero and not outside of the uterus.

If it can't breathe, it isn't a person!

Careful...

Anonymous wrote:I'm really tired of evangelicals and conservative Catholics imposing their religions on everyone else.

I'm Christian and I'm tired of it, can't imagine how tired non Christians are.

+ a million to this. So sick of it.
-also a Christian, with a child conceived via IVF/FET.

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Anonymous wrote:I wish I could post this in the thread about Rob Reiner’s documentary on Christian Nationalism but it got locked. This is language in a real court ruling in America.

The Catholic Church strongly opposes IVF.

The Catholic Church? I lost all respect for the CC during the HIV/AIDS epidemic when they opposed condom use (because they oppose contraception except for the rhythm method) and promoted "chastity." Never mind, how they protected pedophile priests...

The twin cruelties of denying birth control and their child raping road show is why I despise the Catholic Church, add to that their worsening the HIV/AIDS crisis and their political action and they’re even worse.

I guess denying IVF is why they need to have more White babies for the pipeline or whatever the Handmaiden said.

The Church’s teaching on the immorality of IVF is based upon God ordained natural law. Chastity outside of marriage between a man and a woman has always been part of the Catechism. The Catholic Church is furthermore growing fastest in Subsaharan Africa so it has nothing to do with white babies (the Church is shrinking fastest in Western Europe and North America. The next Pope may very well be a black African.
Oh, and there’s a very special place in Hell for child raping priests.

Folks that do not believe in IVF should not get IVF treatment. Other people were given an amazing IVF treatment by their God to allow them to have a family and it does nto concern you in any way.

I have one vote just like you do. My vote is determined by my conscience formed by the doctrine of the Catholic Church.

I am catholic and I have a children conceived by IVF. God told me to do it and was right.

You did so, hopefully, knowing where the Church stands on IVF, right?

The Church was totally cool with child molestation for a couple centuries until the Boston Globe spilled the beans. The Church still tries to weasel out of compensation for victims.

Are you really telling me that the Church's views on IVF matter? Come back to reality.

If you told me they were still shielding child raping priests and moving them on to fresh victims, I’d believe you. They have never reconciled their sins, though they’re pretty obsessed with the contents of women’s uteruses - no birth control, no IVF, no sex, no abortion, the fetus must be prioritized over the living woman. Like that’s the sole definition of protecting life.

Anonymous wrote:Where does this ruling go next? I’m assuming there will be an appeal or does it end here because it’s state?

The clinic would be idiotic to appeal it, because they are unlikely to win. The Supreme Court would also be excited to take a case like this because it would give them an opportunity to create a precedent restricting IVF and abortion nationwide.

Anonymous wrote:I hate to say I told you so, but thus begins the end of IVF....

https://publicportal-api.alappeals.gov/courts/68f021c4-6a44-4735-9a76-5360b2e8af13/cms/case/343d203a-b13d-463a-8176-c46e3ae4f695/docketentrydocuments/e3d95592-3cbe-4384-afa6-063d4595aa1d

It really does not make any sense to prize zygotes in-utero and not outside of the uterus.

If it can't breathe, it isn't a person!

I'm really tired of evangelicals and conservative Catholics imposing their religions on everyone else.

I'm Christian and I'm tired of it, can't imagine how tired non Christians are.

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Anonymous wrote:I wish I could post this in the thread about Rob Reiner’s documentary on Christian Nationalism but it got locked. This is language in a real court ruling in America.

The Catholic Church strongly opposes IVF.

The Catholic Church? I lost all respect for the CC during the HIV/AIDS epidemic when they opposed condom use (because they oppose contraception except for the rhythm method) and promoted "chastity." Never mind, how they protected pedophile priests...

The twin cruelties of denying birth control and their child raping road show is why I despise the Catholic Church, add to that their worsening the HIV/AIDS crisis and their political action and they’re even worse.

I guess denying IVF is why they need to have more White babies for the pipeline or whatever the Handmaiden said.

The Church’s teaching on the immorality of IVF is based upon God ordained natural law. Chastity outside of marriage between a man and a woman has always been part of the Catechism. The Catholic Church is furthermore growing fastest in Subsaharan Africa so it has nothing to do with white babies (the Church is shrinking fastest in Western Europe and North America. The next Pope may very well be a black African.
Oh, and there’s a very special place in Hell for child raping priests.

Folks that do not believe in IVF should not get IVF treatment. Other people were given an amazing IVF treatment by their God to allow them to have a family and it does nto concern you in any way.

I have one vote just like you do. My vote is determined by my conscience formed by the doctrine of the Catholic Church.

I am catholic and I have a children conceived by IVF. God told me to do it and was right.

We are all sinners but God cannot ordain that which is sin.

You are not to sit in judgement either. That is between PP and her God. You don't get to decide for everyone what God, if a god even exists - which many dispute, would make the law of Alabama. God is not a legislator nor a Justice. The law of this land is meant to be a compromise of all of our people, and we don't all agree. You cannot make something a crime when others believe it to be a God given right. Ironic, no?

That’s actually not true. I can judge those actions which violate Church teaching as right or wrong. It’s why we have Doctrine. Do I condemn those people who have committed the wrong-no.
As a Catholic though I am obligated to support the teachings of the Church which are universal.

Who says you can - or should judge? I grew up catholic and am not recalling that teaching in the bible, church, or religion class. How Jesus-y of you . . .

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish I could post this in the thread about Rob Reiner’s documentary on Christian Nationalism but it got locked. This is language in a real court ruling in America.

The Catholic Church strongly opposes IVF.

The Catholic Church? I lost all respect for the CC during the HIV/AIDS epidemic when they opposed condom use (because they oppose contraception except for the rhythm method) and promoted "chastity." Never mind, how they protected pedophile priests...

The twin cruelties of denying birth control and their child raping road show is why I despise the Catholic Church, add to that their worsening the HIV/AIDS crisis and their political action and they’re even worse.

I guess denying IVF is why they need to have more White babies for the pipeline or whatever the Handmaiden said.

The Church’s teaching on the immorality of IVF is based upon God ordained natural law. Chastity outside of marriage between a man and a woman has always been part of the Catechism. The Catholic Church is furthermore growing fastest in Subsaharan Africa so it has nothing to do with white babies (the Church is shrinking fastest in Western Europe and North America. The next Pope may very well be a black African.
Oh, and there’s a very special place in Hell for child raping priests.

Folks that do not believe in IVF should not get IVF treatment. Other people were given an amazing IVF treatment by their God to allow them to have a family and it does nto concern you in any way.

I have one vote just like you do. My vote is determined by my conscience formed by the doctrine of the Catholic Church.

I am catholic and I have a children conceived by IVF. God told me to do it and was right.

We are all sinners but God cannot ordain that which is sin.

You are not to sit in judgement either. That is between PP and her God. You don't get to decide for everyone what God, if a god even exists - which many dispute, would make the law of Alabama. God is not a legislator nor a Justice. The law of this land is meant to be a compromise of all of our people, and we don't all agree. You cannot make something a crime when others believe it to be a God given right. Ironic, no?

That’s actually not true. I can judge those actions which violate Church teaching as right or wrong. It’s why we have Doctrine. Do I condemn those people who have committed the wrong-no.
As a Catholic though I am obligated to support the teachings of the Church which are universal.

You are allowed to base your vote on what you choose. Imposing Catholic doctrine on all the citizens of this country is a very minority position and it will lose. It has lost in many recent special elections and it will lose in November.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish I could post this in the thread about Rob Reiner’s documentary on Christian Nationalism but it got locked. This is language in a real court ruling in America.

The Catholic Church strongly opposes IVF.

The Catholic Church? I lost all respect for the CC during the HIV/AIDS epidemic when they opposed condom use (because they oppose contraception except for the rhythm method) and promoted "chastity." Never mind, how they protected pedophile priests...

The twin cruelties of denying birth control and their child raping road show is why I despise the Catholic Church, add to that their worsening the HIV/AIDS crisis and their political action and they’re even worse.

I guess denying IVF is why they need to have more White babies for the pipeline or whatever the Handmaiden said.

The Church’s teaching on the immorality of IVF is based upon God ordained natural law. Chastity outside of marriage between a man and a woman has always been part of the Catechism. The Catholic Church is furthermore growing fastest in Subsaharan Africa so it has nothing to do with white babies (the Church is shrinking fastest in Western Europe and North America. The next Pope may very well be a black African.
Oh, and there’s a very special place in Hell for child raping priests.

Folks that do not believe in IVF should not get IVF treatment. Other people were given an amazing IVF treatment by their God to allow them to have a family and it does nto concern you in any way.

I have one vote just like you do. My vote is determined by my conscience formed by the doctrine of the Catholic Church.

I am catholic and I have a children conceived by IVF. God told me to do it and was right.

We are all sinners but God cannot ordain that which is sin.

You are not to sit in judgement either. That is between PP and her God. You don't get to decide for everyone what God, if a god even exists - which many dispute, would make the law of Alabama. God is not a legislator nor a Justice. The law of this land is meant to be a compromise of all of our people, and we don't all agree. You cannot make something a crime when others believe it to be a God given right. Ironic, no?

That’s actually not true. I can judge those actions which violate Church teaching as right or wrong. It’s why we have Doctrine. Do I condemn those people who have committed the wrong-no.
As a Catholic though I am obligated to support the teachings of the Church which are universal.

Anonymous wrote:It seems so perverse to have a tax incentive to rack up frozen embryos in storage.

Will they have to change their tax laws? Can you require birth for some things and not for others?

“ You can take an exemption for a dependent who was born or who died during the tax year if he or she met the qualifications for a dependent while alive. This means that a baby who lived only a few minutes can be claimed as a dependent.”

https://www.revenue.alabama.gov/individual-corporate/alabama-dependents/