Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the “menopause is a hormone deficiency” poster, I think you are the one struggling to understand. This is very similar to saying wrinkles are a collagen deficiency. No, they are a result of the normal aging process.

Loss of estrogen over time has plenty of undesirable effects but it also has some benefits like decreasing your risk of certain cancers and stroke, and adding fat around your middle that can mitigate the risk of hip fractures. You can give people supplemental hormones but don’t pretend they are without risk, because your body was not designed to have pre-menopausal levels of reproductive hormones indefinitely.

Citation?

Ok I didn’t realize I was dealing with a bona fide nutcase. Have a great day.

Translation: you are talking out your butt, got caught, and lash out with the tired old "crazy" accusation. Lame.

This is not the snappy comeback you think it is. As a pp said, you don’t need a reference these days to validly point out that gravity exists. But here are a couple anyway, from the Mayo Climic and the World Health Organization, saying menopause is natural aging and not a disease, although you can treat its symptoms:

https://www.mayoclinichealthsystem.org/hometown-health/speaking-of-health/menopause-ensuring-a-tranquil-transition#:~:text=Menopause%20is%20a%20normal%20life,based%20on%20a%20woman's%20symptoms.

https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/menopause#:~:text=Most%20women%20experience%20menopause%20between,changes%20in%20the%20menstrual%20cycle.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the “menopause is a hormone deficiency” poster, I think you are the one struggling to understand. This is very similar to saying wrinkles are a collagen deficiency. No, they are a result of the normal aging process.

Loss of estrogen over time has plenty of undesirable effects but it also has some benefits like decreasing your risk of certain cancers and stroke, and adding fat around your middle that can mitigate the risk of hip fractures. You can give people supplemental hormones but don’t pretend they are without risk, because your body was not designed to have pre-menopausal levels of reproductive hormones indefinitely.

Citation?

Ok I didn’t realize I was dealing with a bona fide nutcase. Have a great day.

Ah, you made it up, got caught and got nothing better than name calling. Got it.

DP. That doesn't need a cite...

Sure it does. You can't say the "body was not designed to have pre-menopausal levels of reproductive hormones indefinitely" without something to back that statement up. Just because you think it's true, doesn't mean that it is.

From Menopause.org: https://www.breastcancer.org/research-news/nams-updates-hrt-position-statement
women older than 65 years old will be relieved to know that they don't have to stop using hormone therapy for their bothersome hot flashes just because of their age. The data simply do not support it, but individualized evaluation and discussion is recommended.

From Medical News Today (a reliable source) https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/can-you-take-hrt-for-the-rest-of-your-life
In 2017, the North American Menopause Society updated its guidance, which was to take the lowest dose of HRT for the shortest duration necessary to address menopause symptoms. After reviewing the literature, they concluded that this advice may be “inadequate or even harmful for some women.”

Here are some other citations indicating that there is no prescribed number of years one can be on HRT:

https://www.menopause.org/docs/default-source/for-women/menonote-deciding-about-ht-2017.pdf
https://www.nhs.uk/medicines/hormone-replacement-therapy-hrt/when-to-take-hormone-replacement-therapy-hrt/#:~:text=There's%20no%20fixed%20limit%20on,be%20longer%20in%20some%20cases.

Valid citations are peer reviewed published randomized controlled trials in high quality journals, not online forums.

If you don’t grasp why that statement doesn’t require a cite no one can help you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Outside Vitamin D, there is not a lot of data supporting supplements. They are not regulated. You have no idea what you are actually getting. Eat a well-balanced diet with lots of fruits and vegetables.

lol you have no idea what you are talking about. Like, pharma is “well regulated?” get out of here.

Are you crazy? Yes, pharma is extremely tightly regulated. They can’t even do a clinical trial in the USA without scientific give regulatory review and approval let alone market anything.

NP. Clearly you didn’t read Empire of Pain. It’s been pay to play for awhile, in many cases.

Re supplements: For 3 years I had hpv that wouldn’t clear, even after having leep. I started taking lysine for a year, and then magically the cells were cleared. So, we can say that supplements don’t work, or we can try them and re-test or see if symptoms improve. Or, we can say my experience was purely a placebo.

I agree with so many of you who are frustrated with care in perimenopause.

Okay well your case of one who took a supplement for a year during which time an infection that tends to clear naturally cleared is definitely sound evidence that supplements work for HPV in a randomized controlled trial.

SMH.

But, see that’s exactly what so many doctors think (and say out loud). I didn’t say in my post that it was clear in all cases. Nor, am I trying to make a larger point about lysine wrt HPV. I’m responding to the pp who said there’s no data that supplements work outside of Vitamin D. People take supplements that often work for them, no clinical trial needed.

But, sure continue your rampant dismissal of everyone here. Just ask yourself what’s your gain from doing it?

There’s no evidence that Vitamin D works either unfortunately.

As for your comment, your anecdote is not data. That’s why it has no bearing on what doctors tell patients, and is not widely applicable.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Outside Vitamin D, there is not a lot of data supporting supplements. They are not regulated. You have no idea what you are actually getting. Eat a well-balanced diet with lots of fruits and vegetables.

lol you have no idea what you are talking about. Like, pharma is “well regulated?” get out of here.

Are you crazy? Yes, pharma is extremely tightly regulated. They can’t even do a clinical trial in the USA without scientific give regulatory review and approval let alone market anything.

NP. Clearly you didn’t read Empire of Pain. It’s been pay to play for awhile, in many cases.

Re supplements: For 3 years I had hpv that wouldn’t clear, even after having leep. I started taking lysine for a year, and then magically the cells were cleared. So, we can say that supplements don’t work, or we can try them and re-test or see if symptoms improve. Or, we can say my experience was purely a placebo.

I agree with so many of you who are frustrated with care in perimenopause.

Okay well your case of one who took a supplement for a year during which time an infection that tends to clear naturally cleared is definitely sound evidence that supplements work for HPV in a randomized controlled trial.

SMH.

But, see that’s exactly what so many doctors think (and say out loud). I didn’t say in my post that it was clear in all cases. Nor, am I trying to make a larger point about lysine wrt HPV. I’m responding to the pp who said there’s no data that supplements work outside of Vitamin D. People take supplements that often work for them, no clinical trial needed.

But, sure continue your rampant dismissal of everyone here. Just ask yourself what’s your gain from doing it?

There is not much data about supplements. That is a fact. What would you like doctors to do? Recommend something without data? They might harm a patient? Supplements are distributed and metabolized and can be harmful, based on a patient’s medical condition. I am the PP who mentioned concerns with magnesium and calcium. I am not dismissive of people. However, I think that everyone needs to be careful about what they put in their body, as there can be side effects and interactions with other things they are taking. And again- you cannot be certain about what you’re getting. It doesn’t matter how well know the brand or how much your doctor supports them.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the “menopause is a hormone deficiency” poster, I think you are the one struggling to understand. This is very similar to saying wrinkles are a collagen deficiency. No, they are a result of the normal aging process.

Loss of estrogen over time has plenty of undesirable effects but it also has some benefits like decreasing your risk of certain cancers and stroke, and adding fat around your middle that can mitigate the risk of hip fractures. You can give people supplemental hormones but don’t pretend they are without risk, because your body was not designed to have pre-menopausal levels of reproductive hormones indefinitely.

Citation?

Ok I didn’t realize I was dealing with a bona fide nutcase. Have a great day.

Translation: you are talking out your butt, got caught, and lash out with the tired old "crazy" accusation. Lame.

+1 Yep!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the “menopause is a hormone deficiency” poster, I think you are the one struggling to understand. This is very similar to saying wrinkles are a collagen deficiency. No, they are a result of the normal aging process.

Loss of estrogen over time has plenty of undesirable effects but it also has some benefits like decreasing your risk of certain cancers and stroke, and adding fat around your middle that can mitigate the risk of hip fractures. You can give people supplemental hormones but don’t pretend they are without risk, because your body was not designed to have pre-menopausal levels of reproductive hormones indefinitely.

Citation?

Ok I didn’t realize I was dealing with a bona fide nutcase. Have a great day.

Translation: you are talking out your butt, got caught, and lash out with the tired old "crazy" accusation. Lame.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I recommend doing some research before finding a provider - there are a lot of charlatans in this area. For example, there’s no need to test hormone levels, let alone do regular testing of them. HRT does not actually replace hormones, but is used to treat symptoms. Your hormone levels are not that useful because that doesn’t account for how well your hormone receptors are functioning. Also, most physicians will give you bad advice about vitamins, telling you that you don’t need them because your levels are “normal” but the fact is that menopausal women function better with higher levels of D and iron, for example. But if you go to a naturopath, they will often try to sell you high priced supplements, which can be sketchy.

Ah, ok, you got your MD from where?

As a woman with PCOS I absolutely need my hormones tested regularly. Take your BS and go somewhere else.

Not every woman has PCOS. Think PP was speaking more generally about women going through menopause.

I never understand why posters such as yourself, who have a specific condition, come out guns blazing in a post like this. You could have simply said, in a nice way, that an exception to the PPs recommendation would be woman with PCOS. Instead, you have to go nasty. People like you ruin threads where people are nicely trying to exchange information. It is possible to educate without being a jerk about it.

Jeez.

Woman don’t always have to express themselves nicely. How sexist of you.

Nope. It says "posters", not women. Not confined to menopause threads. This kind of BS happens on all kinds of health-related threads. People should express themselves nicely unless you have good cause, regardless of sex. The PP got all huffy for no reason.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the “menopause is a hormone deficiency” poster, I think you are the one struggling to understand. This is very similar to saying wrinkles are a collagen deficiency. No, they are a result of the normal aging process.

Loss of estrogen over time has plenty of undesirable effects but it also has some benefits like decreasing your risk of certain cancers and stroke, and adding fat around your middle that can mitigate the risk of hip fractures. You can give people supplemental hormones but don’t pretend they are without risk, because your body was not designed to have pre-menopausal levels of reproductive hormones indefinitely.

Citation?

Ok I didn’t realize I was dealing with a bona fide nutcase. Have a great day.

Ah, you made it up, got caught and got nothing better than name calling. Got it.

DP. That doesn't need a cite...

Sure it does. You can't say the "body was not designed to have pre-menopausal levels of reproductive hormones indefinitely" without something to back that statement up. Just because you think it's true, doesn't mean that it is.

From Menopause.org: https://www.breastcancer.org/research-news/nams-updates-hrt-position-statement
women older than 65 years old will be relieved to know that they don't have to stop using hormone therapy for their bothersome hot flashes just because of their age. The data simply do not support it, but individualized evaluation and discussion is recommended.

From Medical News Today (a reliable source) https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/can-you-take-hrt-for-the-rest-of-your-life
In 2017, the North American Menopause Society updated its guidance, which was to take the lowest dose of HRT for the shortest duration necessary to address menopause symptoms. After reviewing the literature, they concluded that this advice may be “inadequate or even harmful for some women.”

Here are some other citations indicating that there is no prescribed number of years one can be on HRT:

https://www.menopause.org/docs/default-source/for-women/menonote-deciding-about-ht-2017.pdf
https://www.nhs.uk/medicines/hormone-replacement-therapy-hrt/when-to-take-hormone-replacement-therapy-hrt/#:~:text=There's%20no%20fixed%20limit%20on,be%20longer%20in%20some%20cases.

No, I don't need to cite Newton that down is down. Nor do I need to cite Hecate the Crone that menopause is menopause.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the “menopause is a hormone deficiency” poster, I think you are the one struggling to understand. This is very similar to saying wrinkles are a collagen deficiency. No, they are a result of the normal aging process.

Loss of estrogen over time has plenty of undesirable effects but it also has some benefits like decreasing your risk of certain cancers and stroke, and adding fat around your middle that can mitigate the risk of hip fractures. You can give people supplemental hormones but don’t pretend they are without risk, because your body was not designed to have pre-menopausal levels of reproductive hormones indefinitely.

Citation?

Ok I didn’t realize I was dealing with a bona fide nutcase. Have a great day.

Ah, you made it up, got caught and got nothing better than name calling. Got it.

DP. That doesn't need a cite...

Sure it does. You can't say the "body was not designed to have pre-menopausal levels of reproductive hormones indefinitely" without something to back that statement up. Just because you think it's true, doesn't mean that it is.

From Menopause.org: https://www.breastcancer.org/research-news/nams-updates-hrt-position-statement
women older than 65 years old will be relieved to know that they don't have to stop using hormone therapy for their bothersome hot flashes just because of their age. The data simply do not support it, but individualized evaluation and discussion is recommended.

From Medical News Today (a reliable source) https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/can-you-take-hrt-for-the-rest-of-your-life
In 2017, the North American Menopause Society updated its guidance, which was to take the lowest dose of HRT for the shortest duration necessary to address menopause symptoms. After reviewing the literature, they concluded that this advice may be “inadequate or even harmful for some women.”

Here are some other citations indicating that there is no prescribed number of years one can be on HRT:

https://www.menopause.org/docs/default-source/for-women/menonote-deciding-about-ht-2017.pdf
https://www.nhs.uk/medicines/hormone-replacement-therapy-hrt/when-to-take-hormone-replacement-therapy-hrt/#:~:text=There's%20no%20fixed%20limit%20on,be%20longer%20in%20some%20cases.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the “menopause is a hormone deficiency” poster, I think you are the one struggling to understand. This is very similar to saying wrinkles are a collagen deficiency. No, they are a result of the normal aging process.

Loss of estrogen over time has plenty of undesirable effects but it also has some benefits like decreasing your risk of certain cancers and stroke, and adding fat around your middle that can mitigate the risk of hip fractures. You can give people supplemental hormones but don’t pretend they are without risk, because your body was not designed to have pre-menopausal levels of reproductive hormones indefinitely.

Citation?

Ok I didn’t realize I was dealing with a bona fide nutcase. Have a great day.

Ah, you made it up, got caught and got nothing better than name calling. Got it.

DP. That doesn't need a cite...

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the “menopause is a hormone deficiency” poster, I think you are the one struggling to understand. This is very similar to saying wrinkles are a collagen deficiency. No, they are a result of the normal aging process.

Loss of estrogen over time has plenty of undesirable effects but it also has some benefits like decreasing your risk of certain cancers and stroke, and adding fat around your middle that can mitigate the risk of hip fractures. You can give people supplemental hormones but don’t pretend they are without risk, because your body was not designed to have pre-menopausal levels of reproductive hormones indefinitely.

Citation?

Ok I didn’t realize I was dealing with a bona fide nutcase. Have a great day.

Ah, you made it up, got caught and got nothing better than name calling. Got it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Outside Vitamin D, there is not a lot of data supporting supplements. They are not regulated. You have no idea what you are actually getting. Eat a well-balanced diet with lots of fruits and vegetables.

lol you have no idea what you are talking about. Like, pharma is “well regulated?” get out of here.

Are you crazy? Yes, pharma is extremely tightly regulated. They can’t even do a clinical trial in the USA without scientific give regulatory review and approval let alone market anything.

NP. Clearly you didn’t read Empire of Pain. It’s been pay to play for awhile, in many cases.

Re supplements: For 3 years I had hpv that wouldn’t clear, even after having leep. I started taking lysine for a year, and then magically the cells were cleared. So, we can say that supplements don’t work, or we can try them and re-test or see if symptoms improve. Or, we can say my experience was purely a placebo.

I agree with so many of you who are frustrated with care in perimenopause.

Okay well your case of one who took a supplement for a year during which time an infection that tends to clear naturally cleared is definitely sound evidence that supplements work for HPV in a randomized controlled trial.

SMH.

But, see that’s exactly what so many doctors think (and say out loud). I didn’t say in my post that it was clear in all cases. Nor, am I trying to make a larger point about lysine wrt HPV. I’m responding to the pp who said there’s no data that supplements work outside of Vitamin D. People take supplements that often work for them, no clinical trial needed.

But, sure continue your rampant dismissal of everyone here. Just ask yourself what’s your gain from doing it?

Guys I don’t get the arguments. Estrogen does a lot of wonderful things for our body. It makes sex pleasurable and is great for our bones, heart, and brain. When it starts to decline, though it’s natural, it is perfectly viable to supplement this natural loss of estrogen with hormone therapy.

The formation of cataracts is also natural and most people if you hit 80 will require surgery to correct it. It’s natural as can be but I bet all of us will get the surgery once it hits us vs. losing our eyesight.

As another poster said, many women in their 50s are still raising children, wanting to keep our marriages healthy which means physical intimacy, dealing with aging parents, maybe working or volunteering in the community. We aren’t dropping dead. The studies are showing hormone therapy can protect our bones brains and heart and our urinary and sexual health. It’s worth considering or at least not spreading misinformation.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Outside Vitamin D, there is not a lot of data supporting supplements. They are not regulated. You have no idea what you are actually getting. Eat a well-balanced diet with lots of fruits and vegetables.

lol you have no idea what you are talking about. Like, pharma is “well regulated?” get out of here.

Are you crazy? Yes, pharma is extremely tightly regulated. They can’t even do a clinical trial in the USA without scientific give regulatory review and approval let alone market anything.

NP. Clearly you didn’t read Empire of Pain. It’s been pay to play for awhile, in many cases.

Re supplements: For 3 years I had hpv that wouldn’t clear, even after having leep. I started taking lysine for a year, and then magically the cells were cleared. So, we can say that supplements don’t work, or we can try them and re-test or see if symptoms improve. Or, we can say my experience was purely a placebo.

I agree with so many of you who are frustrated with care in perimenopause.

Okay well your case of one who took a supplement for a year during which time an infection that tends to clear naturally cleared is definitely sound evidence that supplements work for HPV in a randomized controlled trial.

SMH.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the “menopause is a hormone deficiency” poster, I think you are the one struggling to understand. This is very similar to saying wrinkles are a collagen deficiency. No, they are a result of the normal aging process.

Loss of estrogen over time has plenty of undesirable effects but it also has some benefits like decreasing your risk of certain cancers and stroke, and adding fat around your middle that can mitigate the risk of hip fractures. You can give people supplemental hormones but don’t pretend they are without risk, because your body was not designed to have pre-menopausal levels of reproductive hormones indefinitely.

Citation?

Ok I didn’t realize I was dealing with a bona fide nutcase. Have a great day.