Anonymous
01/15/2024 22:51
Subject: Re:Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This story could happen todayAnonymous wrote:Of course. My ILs raised 6 kids in a medium sized town in the upper Midwest- FIL was a public school teacher, MIL worked PT (secretarial jobs) once all the kids were in school. Had a large but modest home on a piece of land, and 2 cars, lived frugally otherwise. Put all 6 kids through college- 4 did undergrad at the local state university and 2 chose the local community college instead (all lived at home while attending). Kids worked PT once teens if they wanted a car or expensive clothes etc. FIL retired at 58 with a full pension, MIL worked until 68 by choice (enjoyed her work after being home for so many years). As for timeframe, their 6 kids were all born in the 70s.
No- not with current healthcare and college costs.
My daughter graduated college few years ago, went on full merits scholarship, engineering degree from top school. Was able to purchase the house for herself on her own salary without our help (starting salary was 6 digits), interest rate under 3%. Totally doable on one salary today.
So no student loans, no dependents, good salary and low interest rate (less than half of what it is today). Not quite “doable” by “todays” standards.
She did not vote for today's standards, the low rates and plenty of jobs was during Trump's presidency. Today kids will have a choice to vote in November if they want jobs and house.
Rates are high, yes, but jobs are much better under Biden if you actually pay attention to numbers rather than conjecture
Anonymous
01/15/2024 22:36
Subject: Re:Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This story could happen todayAnonymous wrote:Of course. My ILs raised 6 kids in a medium sized town in the upper Midwest- FIL was a public school teacher, MIL worked PT (secretarial jobs) once all the kids were in school. Had a large but modest home on a piece of land, and 2 cars, lived frugally otherwise. Put all 6 kids through college- 4 did undergrad at the local state university and 2 chose the local community college instead (all lived at home while attending). Kids worked PT once teens if they wanted a car or expensive clothes etc. FIL retired at 58 with a full pension, MIL worked until 68 by choice (enjoyed her work after being home for so many years). As for timeframe, their 6 kids were all born in the 70s.
No- not with current healthcare and college costs.
My daughter graduated college few years ago, went on full merits scholarship, engineering degree from top school. Was able to purchase the house for herself on her own salary without our help (starting salary was 6 digits), interest rate under 3%. Totally doable on one salary today.
So no student loans, no dependents, good salary and low interest rate (less than half of what it is today). Not quite “doable” by “todays” standards.
She did not vote for today's standards, the low rates and plenty of jobs was during Trump's presidency. Today kids will have a choice to vote in November if they want jobs and house.
Why make s**t up. The unemployment rate is as low as it has ever been and the stock market is at record highs. Interest rates were rock bottom through 2022. Your weak reference to politics is stupid.
You also are referring to a professional…not the average American…and your daughter is single, with no family and childcare costs.
Anonymous
01/15/2024 21:34
Subject: Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
Father worked as an escrow officer. Mother was a legal secretary. We lived in a 3bd, 2ba home and took a couple of vacations a year - usually a driving trip and Disneyland. Ate out once a week. Hardly deprived.
Anonymous
01/15/2024 20:11
Subject: Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
I was raised by a single parent in the 90s and we had a very nice but modest life. This definitely wasn’t something that was impossible beyond the 70s.
Anonymous
01/15/2024 20:10
Subject: Re:Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
Anonymous wrote:This story could happen todayAnonymous wrote:Of course. My ILs raised 6 kids in a medium sized town in the upper Midwest- FIL was a public school teacher, MIL worked PT (secretarial jobs) once all the kids were in school. Had a large but modest home on a piece of land, and 2 cars, lived frugally otherwise. Put all 6 kids through college- 4 did undergrad at the local state university and 2 chose the local community college instead (all lived at home while attending). Kids worked PT once teens if they wanted a car or expensive clothes etc. FIL retired at 58 with a full pension, MIL worked until 68 by choice (enjoyed her work after being home for so many years). As for timeframe, their 6 kids were all born in the 70s.
Public school teachers often have two jobs.
Anonymous
01/15/2024 19:52
Subject: Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:1950s, 60s, and even into the early 70s, as long as you were white and were male or married to one.
+1 seriously.
-minority female
The 50s and 60s was the era when black Americans started buying houses on a substantial level. Just a FYI. Not saying things were ideal but there was definitely, unquestionably, major improvements in the economic status of black Americans throughout the 50s and 60s and the black middle class started becoming a real presence rather than a tiny irrelevant minority as it had been previously.
Anonymous
01/15/2024 19:48
Subject: Re:Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This story could happen todayAnonymous wrote:Of course. My ILs raised 6 kids in a medium sized town in the upper Midwest- FIL was a public school teacher, MIL worked PT (secretarial jobs) once all the kids were in school. Had a large but modest home on a piece of land, and 2 cars, lived frugally otherwise. Put all 6 kids through college- 4 did undergrad at the local state university and 2 chose the local community college instead (all lived at home while attending). Kids worked PT once teens if they wanted a car or expensive clothes etc. FIL retired at 58 with a full pension, MIL worked until 68 by choice (enjoyed her work after being home for so many years). As for timeframe, their 6 kids were all born in the 70s.
No- not with current healthcare and college costs.
My daughter graduated college few years ago, went on full merits scholarship, engineering degree from top school. Was able to purchase the house for herself on her own salary without our help (starting salary was 6 digits), interest rate under 3%. Totally doable on one salary today.
So no student loans, no dependents, good salary and low interest rate (less than half of what it is today). Not quite “doable” by “todays” standards.
She did not vote for today's standards, the low rates and plenty of jobs was during Trump's presidency. Today kids will have a choice to vote in November if they want jobs and house.
Anonymous
01/15/2024 19:47
Subject: Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
Anonymous wrote:1950s, 60s, and even into the early 70s, as long as you were white and were male or married to one.
+1 seriously.
-minority female
Anonymous
01/15/2024 19:46
Subject: Re:Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This story could happen todayAnonymous wrote:Of course. My ILs raised 6 kids in a medium sized town in the upper Midwest- FIL was a public school teacher, MIL worked PT (secretarial jobs) once all the kids were in school. Had a large but modest home on a piece of land, and 2 cars, lived frugally otherwise. Put all 6 kids through college- 4 did undergrad at the local state university and 2 chose the local community college instead (all lived at home while attending). Kids worked PT once teens if they wanted a car or expensive clothes etc. FIL retired at 58 with a full pension, MIL worked until 68 by choice (enjoyed her work after being home for so many years). As for timeframe, their 6 kids were all born in the 70s.
No- not with current healthcare and college costs.
My daughter graduated college few years ago, went on full merits scholarship, engineering degree from top school. Was able to purchase the house for herself on her own salary without our help (starting salary was 6 digits), interest rate under 3%. Totally doable on one salary today.
So no student loans, no dependents, good salary and low interest rate (less than half of what it is today). Not quite “doable” by “todays” standards.
Anonymous
01/15/2024 19:29
Subject: Re:Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This story could happen todayAnonymous wrote:Of course. My ILs raised 6 kids in a medium sized town in the upper Midwest- FIL was a public school teacher, MIL worked PT (secretarial jobs) once all the kids were in school. Had a large but modest home on a piece of land, and 2 cars, lived frugally otherwise. Put all 6 kids through college- 4 did undergrad at the local state university and 2 chose the local community college instead (all lived at home while attending). Kids worked PT once teens if they wanted a car or expensive clothes etc. FIL retired at 58 with a full pension, MIL worked until 68 by choice (enjoyed her work after being home for so many years). As for timeframe, their 6 kids were all born in the 70s.
No- not with current healthcare and college costs.
My daughter graduated college few years ago, went on full merits scholarship, engineering degree from top school. Was able to purchase the house for herself on her own salary without our help (starting salary was 6 digits), interest rate under 3%. Totally doable on one salary today.
Anonymous
01/15/2024 18:28
Subject: Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
Anonymous wrote:You can have that right now with a working class job. I have relatives in Kentucky working at a major chain hotel who own their own home, and their kids went to college on scholarships. I have other relatives who own their own home in Damascus Md, working as fast food managers. Their son went to med school on loans. They moved there on purpose with a plan. They focused on launching their kids. Now the next generation are all professional high earners.
Anyone who is sound of mind and able bodied could attain the American dream. My opinion is that the major barrier for most people is that they haven't learned the value of delayed gratification and strategic planning.
You don’t realize you are actually proving the opposite.
In the 1950s, you didn’t need a scholarship to attend college. Even the most expensive still didn’t cost that much, and many top universities were free or nearly free.
Your examples above indicate that you need to take out lots of loans, hope for scholarships and live like a pauper (both parents BTW) just to provide what was easily provided by one income 50+ years ago.
That’s not really the definition of a “dream”.
Anonymous
01/15/2024 15:53
Subject: Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
1950s, 60s, and even into the early 70s, as long as you were white and were male or married to one.
Anonymous
01/15/2024 15:42
Subject: Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
When I was a boy, I'd go to the movies with a nickel and have enough left over to buy a loaf of bread and a gallon of milk on my way home!
And in those days, nickels had pictures of bumblebees on 'em. "Gimme five bees for a quarter," you'd say. Now where were we? Oh, yeah. The important thing was that I had an onion on my belt, which was the style at the time. They didn't have any white onions, because of the war.
And in those days, nickels had pictures of bumblebees on 'em. "Gimme five bees for a quarter," you'd say. Now where were we? Oh, yeah. The important thing was that I had an onion on my belt, which was the style at the time. They didn't have any white onions, because of the war.
Anonymous
01/15/2024 15:40
Subject: Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
Anonymous wrote:Homer Simpson.
Owns a house and two cars. Has three kids and a stay-at-home wife. On a blue-collar salary.
He is unionized though.
That was always part of the joke, as was Al Bundy being a salesman at a shoe store with a stay at home wife and decent split level.
Anonymous
01/15/2024 15:37
Subject: Was there ever a time when your average nine to fiver could afford the American Dream?
Anonymous wrote:You can have that right now with a working class job. I have relatives in Kentucky working at a major chain hotel who own their own home, and their kids went to college on scholarships. I have other relatives who own their own home in Damascus Md, working as fast food managers. Their son went to med school on loans. They moved there on purpose with a plan. They focused on launching their kids. Now the next generation are all professional high earners.
Massive grad school loans and scholarships aren’t attainable for many. And when I was growing up my very middle class parents were able to put my brother and me through college without these. Now, the average middle class family can never achieve that and their kids and up with enormous debt for school loans, even at state schools.
Anyone who is sound of mind and able bodied could attain the American dream. My opinion is that the major barrier for most people is that they haven't learned the value of delayed gratification and strategic planning.