Anonymous wrote:In true U Chicago style, here are two professors' arguments on the financial situation- logic, and facts supporting two opposing points of view that are both very interesting. I do think agree there is a big issue with the three decades of very low undergraduate numbers, leading to a low base of donors vs the other Ivy Plus schools.

John Boyer (recently retired Dean of the College)
https://chicagomaroon.com/40782/viewpoints/letter/john-w-boyer-on-the-state-of-the-universitys-finances/

Clifford Ando (Classics Professor)
https://chicagomaroon.com/40809/viewpoints/letter/all-amazing-all-unequal/

Hi, I speak Academic. Let me translate:

Boyer says that Chicago is broke because they had too few undergrads for decades, that affects alumni donations. (He’s didn’t say WHY they had so few students) So they had to borrow money to do the necessary spending to make Chicago into the top very selective school it is today. It’s competing head to head with the Ivies so it’s worth it.

Ando says yeah, but. We spent a ton of money but it wasn’t on faculty, we still rely too much on unequal adjuncts. A lot of them didn’t get the chances white men got to be full faculty. It’s cutting corners and unfair. What’s the point of all this spending if teaching quality is affected and it goes against our values?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe they should stop spending so much money marketing to literally every HS senior just to increase their rejection rate and appear more selective.

Totally agree. It's insane.

My kids were inundated with UChicago promotions. It never stopped (and they never applied - they went instate VA - we could not have afforded U Chicago even with significant legacy connections).

Years after one had graduated from her instate Virginia college and while another DC was in their senior year at UVA, Chicago wasted yet more money on them sending them a "please submit your application" We laughed. Obviously, someone hit the wrong button but it does go to Chicago's push to market itself to rise on the rankings ("get as many applications as you can to reject as many as you can"). And yes both had received many emails to submit back when they were high school students. MANY. Including the US postal mailings of a cute kitten to "remind them" to submit. Sorry, I have two immediate relatives who went there and would not be pleased with the kitten.

This is what happens when you bring in "specialists" and "consultants" to help you run up the USNWR rankings.

The article shows the cause of the deficit. It's not mass mailings to prospective students.

It's mostly increases in staff and academic salaries, plus "supplies and services".

In true U Chicago style, here are two professors' arguments on the financial situation- logic, and facts supporting two opposing points of view that are both very interesting. I do think agree there is a big issue with the three decades of very low undergraduate numbers, leading to a low base of donors vs the other Ivy Plus schools.

John Boyer (recently retired Dean of the College)
https://chicagomaroon.com/40782/viewpoints/letter/john-w-boyer-on-the-state-of-the-universitys-finances/

Clifford Ando (Classics Professor)
https://chicagomaroon.com/40809/viewpoints/letter/all-amazing-all-unequal/

Anonymous wrote:Maybe they should stop spending so much money marketing to literally every HS senior just to increase their rejection rate and appear more selective.

My thoughts exactly!

Anonymous wrote:Maybe they should stop spending so much money marketing to literally every HS senior just to increase their rejection rate and appear more selective.

So true.

They hounded my DC with email and snail mail and wasted every penny. I’m sure he’s not the only one. Chicago is kind of overrated in our opinion and the school isn’t moving so…

Anonymous wrote:Maybe they should stop spending so much money marketing to literally every HS senior just to increase their rejection rate and appear more selective.

😂

UChicago is an embarrassment. Its like a desperate boy texting, calling, mailing, trying to get back a girl on a train that's left the station.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sending out spam to get undergraduate applications isn't driving a $200M+ deficit. That is a drop in the bucket.

How much could a mass mailing cost, Michael? Thirty million dollars?

I figure they spend 500k - 1m on the mailings

Right. Let’s do the math. We know there are around 20k kids with 1500+ SAT scores annually so let’s be super generous and say they do 2x that, 40k mailings per year.

There’s around 2mm graduating high school seniors per year so they are hitting the top 2% of all Juniors. Seems like a reasonable target. They get 38-40k apps per year. Adding in organic interest that’s ballpark what they need/want.

With a $1mm budget that’s $25.00 per mailing.

Uh, no. That is not possible. Postage is pennies for bulk nonprofit mailings. Full color flyers are maybe $1-$2 each when you are buying them 100,000 at a time.

$25 a pop is sending a U Chicago sweatshirt or backpack to 40,000 people.

These are PIECES OF PAPER.

With deficits like that they'll be out of business in 42 years. I hope that's enough time to figure it out?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sending out spam to get undergraduate applications isn't driving a $200M+ deficit. That is a drop in the bucket.

How much could a mass mailing cost, Michael? Thirty million dollars?

I figure they spend 500k - 1m on the mailings

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Neither of our kids who both scored in the 95%+ on the PSAT/SAT got any mailings from U Chicago. I think some zip codes get plastered and others don't.

My kid who got 1500 on their 1st SAT got weekly mailings from U of Chicago starting the beginning of junior year.

My kid who got 1460 on the SAT received only 1 mailing from U of Chicago. They retook the SAT 6 months later and scored above 1500. The U of Chicago mailings onslaught started after the score topped 1500.

Perhaps the school is only postcard bombing 1500+ SAT scores?

My kid started getting bombarded when he took his first AP exam and earned a 5. He's gotten a few mailings from Swarthmore, too, but only after earning 5s on his next two APs as well. Hasn't taken the SAT yet, but will be NMSF based on PSAT score.

Hard to know whether AP or PSAT was the reason. Maybe they don't advertise to sophomores?

Anonymous wrote:Sending out spam to get undergraduate applications isn't driving a $200M+ deficit. That is a drop in the bucket.

How much could a mass mailing cost, Michael? Thirty million dollars?

Sending out spam to get undergraduate applications isn't driving a $200M+ deficit. That is a drop in the bucket.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Neither of our kids who both scored in the 95%+ on the PSAT/SAT got any mailings from U Chicago. I think some zip codes get plastered and others don't.

My kid who got 1500 on their 1st SAT got weekly mailings from U of Chicago starting the beginning of junior year.

My kid who got 1460 on the SAT received only 1 mailing from U of Chicago. They retook the SAT 6 months later and scored above 1500. The U of Chicago mailings onslaught started after the score topped 1500.

Perhaps the school is only postcard bombing 1500+ SAT scores?

My kid started getting bombarded when he took his first AP exam and earned a 5. He's gotten a few mailings from Swarthmore, too, but only after earning 5s on his next two APs as well. Hasn't taken the SAT yet, but will be NMSF based on PSAT score.

How many kids get 1500+ each year?

It’s around 20-22 thousand.

Spamming mailers to every single one of them is very cost effective if every application yields $75 in fees and boosts selectivity.

Yes, this makes sense.