Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:UVA the highest test scores in the state. Obviously

50% of the entering class didn't submit SAT scores.

Pretty consistent across the board for the competitive publics (45% at Tech and W&M)

What's surprising to me is that only 30% of the entering class at Washington & Lee submitted SAT scores (and the percentiles were identical to UVA).

Do parents still think test optional is a fad?

Another 26% submit ACT scores so about 50% submit scores. That said, they were encouraging test optional on the tour. My daughter goes there now and got in test optional.

Unless you get a good score, in which case they matter more than ever.

And ... *checks notes* ... you might submit both to drive the point home.

Anonymous wrote:The GPAs are based on the time of the application right? So kids doing ED would have a slightly lower GPA with their end of Junior year grades. How much can a weighted GPA rise during the first semester of the Senior year?

For AP/IB kids at 25% GPA now (post junior year GPA), assume 50% GPA range at the time of graduation.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:GPAs are meaningless because so many districts do it differently.

Scores are still important for the best schools. Remember to combine the number of kids who submitted SAT with the kids who submitted ACT. When you do that, UVA has 65% reporting and WM has 62% reporting. Also, consider who is most likely NOT to report. If your kid isn’t one of them, their competition is probably reporting a score.

You can’t combine. You have no idea how much overlap there is — kids take both, report both. So your premise is completely wrong.

There are usually only a small percentage who take and report both--you would only do that if you scored equally high in both.

Considering that we're talking about a self-selecting group, presumably those worried about "discrimination," it stands to reason the percentage is a lot higher than you think in the current environment.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:UVA the highest test scores in the state. Obviously

50% of the entering class didn't submit SAT scores.

Pretty consistent across the board for the competitive publics (45% at Tech and W&M)

What's surprising to me is that only 30% of the entering class at Washington & Lee submitted SAT scores (and the percentiles were identical to UVA).

Do parents still think test optional is a fad?

Another 26% submit ACT scores so about 50% submit scores. That said, they were encouraging test optional on the tour. My daughter goes there now and got in test optional.

Full pay? ED? Generally speaking, that’s who shows up for tours, so that’s a great venue to deliver a targeted message. I assume full-pay ED kids at W&L lean test optional, while kids competing for the full ride scholarships are more likely to submit.

Wrong quote on that response about tests mattering more than ever, meant to reply to "The real takeaway is that scores matter a whole lot less than they did even five years ago."

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:UVA the highest test scores in the state. Obviously

50% of the entering class didn't submit SAT scores.

Pretty consistent across the board for the competitive publics (45% at Tech and W&M)

What's surprising to me is that only 30% of the entering class at Washington & Lee submitted SAT scores (and the percentiles were identical to UVA).

Do parents still think test optional is a fad?

Another 26% submit ACT scores so about 50% submit scores. That said, they were encouraging test optional on the tour. My daughter goes there now and got in test optional.

Unless you get a good score, in which case they matter more than ever.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:GPAs are meaningless because so many districts do it differently.

Scores are still important for the best schools. Remember to combine the number of kids who submitted SAT with the kids who submitted ACT. When you do that, UVA has 65% reporting and WM has 62% reporting. Also, consider who is most likely NOT to report. If your kid isn’t one of them, their competition is probably reporting a score.

You can’t combine. You have no idea how much overlap there is — kids take both, report both. So your premise is completely wrong.

There are usually only a small percentage who take and report both--you would only do that if you scored equally high in both.

MIT (which is test mandatory) shows 110% reporting, if you sum ACT and SAT reporters. So some overlap but nowhere near total.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:GPAs are meaningless because so many districts do it differently.

Scores are still important for the best schools. Remember to combine the number of kids who submitted SAT with the kids who submitted ACT. When you do that, UVA has 65% reporting and WM has 62% reporting. Also, consider who is most likely NOT to report. If your kid isn’t one of them, their competition is probably reporting a score.

You can’t combine. You have no idea how much overlap there is — kids take both, report both. So your premise is completely wrong.

There are usually only a small percentage who take and report both--you would only do that if you scored equally high in both.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The vast majority of freshmen at colleges and universities in Virginia did not submit scores. But over half of the freshmen at UVA, W&M, and VT did. Those are the three highest-ranking universities in Virginia, and the only three in the top 100. Washington & Lee, which is the highest-ranking LAC in Virginia, is also over 50%, and so is Hampton, which is the highest-ranking HBCU.

The current US News formula uses 50% as a cut point: a school’s test scores are only used in the formula if over 50% of freshmen reported scores. Otherwise the formula increases the weight given to graduation rates. What we’re seeing is, the schools with the market power to get to 50% are behaving as if they believe it is beneficial for them to do so. The fewer students submit scores to those schools, the more beneficial it becomes for any given student to be among the group submitting.

The data does not say this.

It is about half for UVA. It is 45% for W&M and Tech. Those are SAT scores. But you can’t simply add ACT to those proportions — you have no idea how many anxious students submitted both scores.

The real takeaway is that scores matter a whole lot less than they did even five years ago.

DP here. I agree that you can’t say for sure, but in all likelihood most students submitted the score that they thought looked better and didn’t submit both. That’s what my kid did.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:UVA the highest test scores in the state. Obviously

50% of the entering class didn't submit SAT scores.

Pretty consistent across the board for the competitive publics (45% at Tech and W&M)

What's surprising to me is that only 30% of the entering class at Washington & Lee submitted SAT scores (and the percentiles were identical to UVA).

Do parents still think test optional is a fad?

Another 26% submit ACT scores so about 50% submit scores. That said, they were encouraging test optional on the tour. My daughter goes there now and got in test optional.

Anonymous wrote:The vast majority of freshmen at colleges and universities in Virginia did not submit scores. But over half of the freshmen at UVA, W&M, and VT did. Those are the three highest-ranking universities in Virginia, and the only three in the top 100. Washington & Lee, which is the highest-ranking LAC in Virginia, is also over 50%, and so is Hampton, which is the highest-ranking HBCU.

The current US News formula uses 50% as a cut point: a school’s test scores are only used in the formula if over 50% of freshmen reported scores. Otherwise the formula increases the weight given to graduation rates. What we’re seeing is, the schools with the market power to get to 50% are behaving as if they believe it is beneficial for them to do so. The fewer students submit scores to those schools, the more beneficial it becomes for any given student to be among the group submitting.

The data does not say this.

It is about half for UVA. It is 45% for W&M and Tech. Those are SAT scores. But you can’t simply add ACT to those proportions — you have no idea how many anxious students submitted both scores.

The real takeaway is that scores matter a whole lot less than they did even five years ago.

Anonymous wrote:GPAs are meaningless because so many districts do it differently.

Scores are still important for the best schools. Remember to combine the number of kids who submitted SAT with the kids who submitted ACT. When you do that, UVA has 65% reporting and WM has 62% reporting. Also, consider who is most likely NOT to report. If your kid isn’t one of them, their competition is probably reporting a score.

You can’t combine. You have no idea how much overlap there is — kids take both, report both. So your premise is completely wrong.

The vast majority of freshmen at colleges and universities in Virginia did not submit scores. But over half of the freshmen at UVA, W&M, and VT did. Those are the three highest-ranking universities in Virginia, and the only three in the top 100. Washington & Lee, which is the highest-ranking LAC in Virginia, is also over 50%, and so is Hampton, which is the highest-ranking HBCU.

The current US News formula uses 50% as a cut point: a school’s test scores are only used in the formula if over 50% of freshmen reported scores. Otherwise the formula increases the weight given to graduation rates. What we’re seeing is, the schools with the market power to get to 50% are behaving as if they believe it is beneficial for them to do so. The fewer students submit scores to those schools, the more beneficial it becomes for any given student to be among the group submitting.

Anonymous wrote:GPAs are meaningless because so many districts do it differently.

Scores are still important for the best schools. Remember to combine the number of kids who submitted SAT with the kids who submitted ACT. When you do that, UVA has 65% reporting and WM has 62% reporting. Also, consider who is most likely NOT to report. If your kid isn’t one of them, their competition is probably reporting a score.

Neither of those things are true. Admissions counselors know which schools turn out college-ready students so GPAs matter a lot. And that’s a shit ton of not reporting, which suggests schools aren’t nearly as interested in test scores as you seem to desperately want them to be.

Anonymous wrote:The two most shocking things to me from the data provided in this thread is
1) number of kids across the board not reporting tests. My perception was that it reflected poorly and school probably assumed test was low if not reported but that is clearly not the case from the data shown.
2) on the VT specific data that engineering admissions well over 50% and even higher than other majors like business. Not saying it isn’t a stellar program, but if you had ask me to guess admission to VT Engineering I would have guessed 20% not 55%. Just surprised.

DP: at UVA TO is not only for URM and 1st gen students despite the narrative that many people on this board love to perpetuate.