Anonymous wrote:As a new club FH parent, it would be great if you all named names so that I could figure out if DDs team has a problematic reputation . This discussion has been eye opening….
Anonymous wrote:As a new club FH parent, it would be great if you all named names so that I could figure out if DDs team has a problematic reputation . This discussion has been eye opening….
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Instagram makes it very clear which team it is based on this weekends tournament and it’s not KOA, NoVa extreme. It’s a “higher” caliber club. As long the coach makes it clear you aren’t going to play in advance, great. Let the player decide if they want to participate. If you don’t make it clear IN ADVANCE, don’t bring a roster of players that won’t touch the field and expect players to be happy and be apart of a team. This isn’t the first time this has occurred. It’s a repeating offense by this club. Here is a synopsis of what happens at these multi day travel tournaments. 5 to 6 games. Max roster size of 18 players. 5 plus players either play anywhere between 0 min to 7 min a game. During the game, the coach will make statements to sideline players that the players on the field are playing like crap but the coach still wont sub in the sideline players. What message are you sending to those players. You aren’t even good enough to play when the top players are playing poorly. When a player asks the coach what they can do to get playing time or to improve, you are told this is not the time to ask or if you are lucky you might get some generic statement or be told this team is above your pay grade. Player wants the coach’s approval and coach knows it but keeps playing the mind games. Ironically, this team hasn’t won’t any major tournaments for a few years. Coach keeps playing the same head game with no positive return. Like previous posters have said, you have to find the right fit for DD. However, this situation isn’t about fit or not. This is about playing mental games with adolescents. A form of bullying. Some people will say it’s a good life lesson because DMV kids are pampered etc. I disagree. When a coach makes those types of comments and takes those actions to players, it’s a form of bullying. Ironically, this club touts player mental health and well being and positive coaching. I hope people start to see through the charade.
I’m not sure if we’re talking about the same club but we had the same experience with DD’s former club where head coach was making snide comments about players who belonged to the club and those playing for other clubs to the assistant coaches and “favorite” players. DD witnessed it and thought it was acceptable because the head coach did it. I was so glad when DD left last year to go to Next Level. What a difference and breath of fresh air Welma is! I only wished we had moved sooner and not wasted our time at the old club.
Washington Wolves?
Rather not say. But as one of the previous posters said, just look at the trickle of girls who have left the club and you will know.
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This weekend was the regional club championships and teams from MD and DE compete. Based on the level of play, the top clubs in the local DMV commuting area are Freedom and Warhawks. Watching these teams play in all three levels, there is no comparison on the stellar coaching and athletic ability of the teams. These clubs seem to focus on the fundamentals, conditioning and field IQ. The ball is glued to their stick, they understand passing lanes, and their speed on and off the ball is very strong. Also, the coaches clearly coached constructively on the sidelines. Other teams in the commuting area don’t compare to these 2 clubs. The one thing I noticed was Washington Wolves carried a large roster with atleast 7 plus players warming the bench in each age bracket. I heard numerous parents frustrated about this. The other clubs seemed reasonable with 2-3 active subs and no bench players. If Freedom or Warhawks is too far, one clear up and coming team looks like Next Level’s younger u14 age group as their roster size was not large giving all players the ability to participate and develop and the coaching was clear during the game on how to adjust.
This was the RCCs for region 7 (I think that's the right one).
Region 8 also played in VA Beach. Husel placed pretty well this year in both U14 and U16, considering they play against some powerhouse VA Beach and Richmond Teams and are a pretty small club. Metro did really well, too. Hammers finished at the back of the pack, at least for U16. Mustangs and Nova Extreme didn't place well, either. (Those clubs have some strong suits, though, imo, beyond "wins v. losses.")
The top team (FOCUS) is a HUGE club with multiple club locations and they get to pick/choose the best players for their RCC Team. They won it all. The Nova teams just don't have that same ability, unfortunately.
As for recruitment, I won't say who we play for but they have not helped with recruiting at all. Though I get the sense (hear the gossip) that some of the players get help/promoted. It's extremely frustrating. We've considered other options but we are too far along at this point and think it would not be a positive reflection if we did.
It’s never too late to change clubs. I know of plenty of girls who changed clubs in their Junior or Senior year and went on the play in college, at least 1 played at a D1 college.
If you hear the gossip, it’s true. One of the clubs you mentioned lost a ton of girls recently and I don’t think any of those who left regret it. They went to a couple of different clubs and wish they made the jump sooner.
When you are inside the club it’s really hard to see all the issues (or maybe believe them). Once you are outside, it’s much more clear.
Oh trust me, I absolutely believe it. But . . . it's complicated.
I would encourage you to leave. There was just a question asked on the Field Hockey Discussion forum on Facebook about switching clubs after a player commits (specifically because of mental health) and all the respondents said to switch. A couple were from college coaches and they agreed with switching.
DD beyond frustrated with current team. Current DMV team doesn’t give playing time to non committed D1 players so it’s mentally taxing being on a team that you are just paying to sit on the bench or according to the coach it’s all a learning opportunity to be on the sidelines watching (I can get that when it’s a local tournament but when requiring the player to travel especially when there is significant travel expenses to the tournaments and not play is cruel. Coach brings a roster of 18-20 and only plays 13 players: 11 starters and two subs for 10-15 min; rest are bench warmers/bill payers). DD mental health is in the toilet. The club talks about players mental health as a focus but it’s all hype. DD needs to leave the club but is too afraid to because of all the time and relationships DD has built but seeing how the coach just breaks DD down mentally is too much now. I know I should have pulled the trigger earlier in pulling DD out but I was also enamored by the hype of D1 or top D3 playing. Beware of these types of clubs that show love on Instagram for their players and the coaches are very superficial friendly and talk about mental health and well being and growing the game. I should have noticed the trickle of players switching from the club from u14 and u16 and even some u19 but I didn’t. There are always warning signs. Look out for them.
Update - DD decided to leave the team and prioritize her mental health after thinking everything through (DD had been thinking about this for the past few weeks). DD informed the coach this morning that she is leaving the team and why. Proud of DD. It was a challenging decision but her mood is so much lighter. DD decided she will do local field hockey clinics instead because she loves the sport. To the poster that encouraged putting individual mental health over the team longevity, thank you. Playing a team sport does not need to be toxic.
What an awful situation for your daughter. I'm glad she left.
What club was this?
The one club in the DMV that has only one team per U level.
There are multiple teams in the DMV with one team for outdoor and 2 teams for indoor.
Can you name them?
Husel
Washington Wolves
Metro
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Instagram makes it very clear which team it is based on this weekends tournament and it’s not KOA, NoVa extreme. It’s a “higher” caliber club. As long the coach makes it clear you aren’t going to play in advance, great. Let the player decide if they want to participate. If you don’t make it clear IN ADVANCE, don’t bring a roster of players that won’t touch the field and expect players to be happy and be apart of a team. This isn’t the first time this has occurred. It’s a repeating offense by this club. Here is a synopsis of what happens at these multi day travel tournaments. 5 to 6 games. Max roster size of 18 players. 5 plus players either play anywhere between 0 min to 7 min a game. During the game, the coach will make statements to sideline players that the players on the field are playing like crap but the coach still wont sub in the sideline players. What message are you sending to those players. You aren’t even good enough to play when the top players are playing poorly. When a player asks the coach what they can do to get playing time or to improve, you are told this is not the time to ask or if you are lucky you might get some generic statement or be told this team is above your pay grade. Player wants the coach’s approval and coach knows it but keeps playing the mind games. Ironically, this team hasn’t won’t any major tournaments for a few years. Coach keeps playing the same head game with no positive return. Like previous posters have said, you have to find the right fit for DD. However, this situation isn’t about fit or not. This is about playing mental games with adolescents. A form of bullying. Some people will say it’s a good life lesson because DMV kids are pampered etc. I disagree. When a coach makes those types of comments and takes those actions to players, it’s a form of bullying. Ironically, this club touts player mental health and well being and positive coaching. I hope people start to see through the charade.
I’m not sure if we’re talking about the same club but we had the same experience with DD’s former club where head coach was making snide comments about players who belonged to the club and those playing for other clubs to the assistant coaches and “favorite” players. DD witnessed it and thought it was acceptable because the head coach did it. I was so glad when DD left last year to go to Next Level. What a difference and breath of fresh air Welma is! I only wished we had moved sooner and not wasted our time at the old club.
Washington Wolves?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Instagram makes it very clear which team it is based on this weekends tournament and it’s not KOA, NoVa extreme. It’s a “higher” caliber club. As long the coach makes it clear you aren’t going to play in advance, great. Let the player decide if they want to participate. If you don’t make it clear IN ADVANCE, don’t bring a roster of players that won’t touch the field and expect players to be happy and be apart of a team. This isn’t the first time this has occurred. It’s a repeating offense by this club. Here is a synopsis of what happens at these multi day travel tournaments. 5 to 6 games. Max roster size of 18 players. 5 plus players either play anywhere between 0 min to 7 min a game. During the game, the coach will make statements to sideline players that the players on the field are playing like crap but the coach still wont sub in the sideline players. What message are you sending to those players. You aren’t even good enough to play when the top players are playing poorly. When a player asks the coach what they can do to get playing time or to improve, you are told this is not the time to ask or if you are lucky you might get some generic statement or be told this team is above your pay grade. Player wants the coach’s approval and coach knows it but keeps playing the mind games. Ironically, this team hasn’t won’t any major tournaments for a few years. Coach keeps playing the same head game with no positive return. Like previous posters have said, you have to find the right fit for DD. However, this situation isn’t about fit or not. This is about playing mental games with adolescents. A form of bullying. Some people will say it’s a good life lesson because DMV kids are pampered etc. I disagree. When a coach makes those types of comments and takes those actions to players, it’s a form of bullying. Ironically, this club touts player mental health and well being and positive coaching. I hope people start to see through the charade.
I’m not sure if we’re talking about the same club but we had the same experience with DD’s former club where head coach was making snide comments about players who belonged to the club and those playing for other clubs to the assistant coaches and “favorite” players. DD witnessed it and thought it was acceptable because the head coach did it. I was so glad when DD left last year to go to Next Level. What a difference and breath of fresh air Welma is! I only wished we had moved sooner and not wasted our time at the old club.
Anonymous wrote:Instagram makes it very clear which team it is based on this weekends tournament and it’s not KOA, NoVa extreme. It’s a “higher” caliber club. As long the coach makes it clear you aren’t going to play in advance, great. Let the player decide if they want to participate. If you don’t make it clear IN ADVANCE, don’t bring a roster of players that won’t touch the field and expect players to be happy and be apart of a team. This isn’t the first time this has occurred. It’s a repeating offense by this club. Here is a synopsis of what happens at these multi day travel tournaments. 5 to 6 games. Max roster size of 18 players. 5 plus players either play anywhere between 0 min to 7 min a game. During the game, the coach will make statements to sideline players that the players on the field are playing like crap but the coach still wont sub in the sideline players. What message are you sending to those players. You aren’t even good enough to play when the top players are playing poorly. When a player asks the coach what they can do to get playing time or to improve, you are told this is not the time to ask or if you are lucky you might get some generic statement or be told this team is above your pay grade. Player wants the coach’s approval and coach knows it but keeps playing the mind games. Ironically, this team hasn’t won’t any major tournaments for a few years. Coach keeps playing the same head game with no positive return. Like previous posters have said, you have to find the right fit for DD. However, this situation isn’t about fit or not. This is about playing mental games with adolescents. A form of bullying. Some people will say it’s a good life lesson because DMV kids are pampered etc. I disagree. When a coach makes those types of comments and takes those actions to players, it’s a form of bullying. Ironically, this club touts player mental health and well being and positive coaching. I hope people start to see through the charade.
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This weekend was the regional club championships and teams from MD and DE compete. Based on the level of play, the top clubs in the local DMV commuting area are Freedom and Warhawks. Watching these teams play in all three levels, there is no comparison on the stellar coaching and athletic ability of the teams. These clubs seem to focus on the fundamentals, conditioning and field IQ. The ball is glued to their stick, they understand passing lanes, and their speed on and off the ball is very strong. Also, the coaches clearly coached constructively on the sidelines. Other teams in the commuting area don’t compare to these 2 clubs. The one thing I noticed was Washington Wolves carried a large roster with atleast 7 plus players warming the bench in each age bracket. I heard numerous parents frustrated about this. The other clubs seemed reasonable with 2-3 active subs and no bench players. If Freedom or Warhawks is too far, one clear up and coming team looks like Next Level’s younger u14 age group as their roster size was not large giving all players the ability to participate and develop and the coaching was clear during the game on how to adjust.
This was the RCCs for region 7 (I think that's the right one).
Region 8 also played in VA Beach. Husel placed pretty well this year in both U14 and U16, considering they play against some powerhouse VA Beach and Richmond Teams and are a pretty small club. Metro did really well, too. Hammers finished at the back of the pack, at least for U16. Mustangs and Nova Extreme didn't place well, either. (Those clubs have some strong suits, though, imo, beyond "wins v. losses.")
The top team (FOCUS) is a HUGE club with multiple club locations and they get to pick/choose the best players for their RCC Team. They won it all. The Nova teams just don't have that same ability, unfortunately.
As for recruitment, I won't say who we play for but they have not helped with recruiting at all. Though I get the sense (hear the gossip) that some of the players get help/promoted. It's extremely frustrating. We've considered other options but we are too far along at this point and think it would not be a positive reflection if we did.
It’s never too late to change clubs. I know of plenty of girls who changed clubs in their Junior or Senior year and went on the play in college, at least 1 played at a D1 college.
If you hear the gossip, it’s true. One of the clubs you mentioned lost a ton of girls recently and I don’t think any of those who left regret it. They went to a couple of different clubs and wish they made the jump sooner.
When you are inside the club it’s really hard to see all the issues (or maybe believe them). Once you are outside, it’s much more clear.
Oh trust me, I absolutely believe it. But . . . it's complicated.
I would encourage you to leave. There was just a question asked on the Field Hockey Discussion forum on Facebook about switching clubs after a player commits (specifically because of mental health) and all the respondents said to switch. A couple were from college coaches and they agreed with switching.
DD beyond frustrated with current team. Current DMV team doesn’t give playing time to non committed D1 players so it’s mentally taxing being on a team that you are just paying to sit on the bench or according to the coach it’s all a learning opportunity to be on the sidelines watching (I can get that when it’s a local tournament but when requiring the player to travel especially when there is significant travel expenses to the tournaments and not play is cruel. Coach brings a roster of 18-20 and only plays 13 players: 11 starters and two subs for 10-15 min; rest are bench warmers/bill payers). DD mental health is in the toilet. The club talks about players mental health as a focus but it’s all hype. DD needs to leave the club but is too afraid to because of all the time and relationships DD has built but seeing how the coach just breaks DD down mentally is too much now. I know I should have pulled the trigger earlier in pulling DD out but I was also enamored by the hype of D1 or top D3 playing. Beware of these types of clubs that show love on Instagram for their players and the coaches are very superficial friendly and talk about mental health and well being and growing the game. I should have noticed the trickle of players switching from the club from u14 and u16 and even some u19 but I didn’t. There are always warning signs. Look out for them.
Update - DD decided to leave the team and prioritize her mental health after thinking everything through (DD had been thinking about this for the past few weeks). DD informed the coach this morning that she is leaving the team and why. Proud of DD. It was a challenging decision but her mood is so much lighter. DD decided she will do local field hockey clinics instead because she loves the sport. To the poster that encouraged putting individual mental health over the team longevity, thank you. Playing a team sport does not need to be toxic.
What an awful situation for your daughter. I'm glad she left.
What club was this?
The one club in the DMV that has only one team per U level.
There are multiple teams in the DMV with one team for outdoor and 2 teams for indoor.
Can you name them?
Husel
Washington Wolves
Metro
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This weekend was the regional club championships and teams from MD and DE compete. Based on the level of play, the top clubs in the local DMV commuting area are Freedom and Warhawks. Watching these teams play in all three levels, there is no comparison on the stellar coaching and athletic ability of the teams. These clubs seem to focus on the fundamentals, conditioning and field IQ. The ball is glued to their stick, they understand passing lanes, and their speed on and off the ball is very strong. Also, the coaches clearly coached constructively on the sidelines. Other teams in the commuting area don’t compare to these 2 clubs. The one thing I noticed was Washington Wolves carried a large roster with atleast 7 plus players warming the bench in each age bracket. I heard numerous parents frustrated about this. The other clubs seemed reasonable with 2-3 active subs and no bench players. If Freedom or Warhawks is too far, one clear up and coming team looks like Next Level’s younger u14 age group as their roster size was not large giving all players the ability to participate and develop and the coaching was clear during the game on how to adjust.
This was the RCCs for region 7 (I think that's the right one).
Region 8 also played in VA Beach. Husel placed pretty well this year in both U14 and U16, considering they play against some powerhouse VA Beach and Richmond Teams and are a pretty small club. Metro did really well, too. Hammers finished at the back of the pack, at least for U16. Mustangs and Nova Extreme didn't place well, either. (Those clubs have some strong suits, though, imo, beyond "wins v. losses.")
The top team (FOCUS) is a HUGE club with multiple club locations and they get to pick/choose the best players for their RCC Team. They won it all. The Nova teams just don't have that same ability, unfortunately.
As for recruitment, I won't say who we play for but they have not helped with recruiting at all. Though I get the sense (hear the gossip) that some of the players get help/promoted. It's extremely frustrating. We've considered other options but we are too far along at this point and think it would not be a positive reflection if we did.
It’s never too late to change clubs. I know of plenty of girls who changed clubs in their Junior or Senior year and went on the play in college, at least 1 played at a D1 college.
If you hear the gossip, it’s true. One of the clubs you mentioned lost a ton of girls recently and I don’t think any of those who left regret it. They went to a couple of different clubs and wish they made the jump sooner.
When you are inside the club it’s really hard to see all the issues (or maybe believe them). Once you are outside, it’s much more clear.
Oh trust me, I absolutely believe it. But . . . it's complicated.
I would encourage you to leave. There was just a question asked on the Field Hockey Discussion forum on Facebook about switching clubs after a player commits (specifically because of mental health) and all the respondents said to switch. A couple were from college coaches and they agreed with switching.
DD beyond frustrated with current team. Current DMV team doesn’t give playing time to non committed D1 players so it’s mentally taxing being on a team that you are just paying to sit on the bench or according to the coach it’s all a learning opportunity to be on the sidelines watching (I can get that when it’s a local tournament but when requiring the player to travel especially when there is significant travel expenses to the tournaments and not play is cruel. Coach brings a roster of 18-20 and only plays 13 players: 11 starters and two subs for 10-15 min; rest are bench warmers/bill payers). DD mental health is in the toilet. The club talks about players mental health as a focus but it’s all hype. DD needs to leave the club but is too afraid to because of all the time and relationships DD has built but seeing how the coach just breaks DD down mentally is too much now. I know I should have pulled the trigger earlier in pulling DD out but I was also enamored by the hype of D1 or top D3 playing. Beware of these types of clubs that show love on Instagram for their players and the coaches are very superficial friendly and talk about mental health and well being and growing the game. I should have noticed the trickle of players switching from the club from u14 and u16 and even some u19 but I didn’t. There are always warning signs. Look out for them.
Update - DD decided to leave the team and prioritize her mental health after thinking everything through (DD had been thinking about this for the past few weeks). DD informed the coach this morning that she is leaving the team and why. Proud of DD. It was a challenging decision but her mood is so much lighter. DD decided she will do local field hockey clinics instead because she loves the sport. To the poster that encouraged putting individual mental health over the team longevity, thank you. Playing a team sport does not need to be toxic.
What an awful situation for your daughter. I'm glad she left.
What club was this?
The one club in the DMV that has only one team per U level.
There are multiple teams in the DMV with one team for outdoor and 2 teams for indoor.
Can you name them?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This weekend was the regional club championships and teams from MD and DE compete. Based on the level of play, the top clubs in the local DMV commuting area are Freedom and Warhawks. Watching these teams play in all three levels, there is no comparison on the stellar coaching and athletic ability of the teams. These clubs seem to focus on the fundamentals, conditioning and field IQ. The ball is glued to their stick, they understand passing lanes, and their speed on and off the ball is very strong. Also, the coaches clearly coached constructively on the sidelines. Other teams in the commuting area don’t compare to these 2 clubs. The one thing I noticed was Washington Wolves carried a large roster with atleast 7 plus players warming the bench in each age bracket. I heard numerous parents frustrated about this. The other clubs seemed reasonable with 2-3 active subs and no bench players. If Freedom or Warhawks is too far, one clear up and coming team looks like Next Level’s younger u14 age group as their roster size was not large giving all players the ability to participate and develop and the coaching was clear during the game on how to adjust.
This was the RCCs for region 7 (I think that's the right one).
Region 8 also played in VA Beach. Husel placed pretty well this year in both U14 and U16, considering they play against some powerhouse VA Beach and Richmond Teams and are a pretty small club. Metro did really well, too. Hammers finished at the back of the pack, at least for U16. Mustangs and Nova Extreme didn't place well, either. (Those clubs have some strong suits, though, imo, beyond "wins v. losses.")
The top team (FOCUS) is a HUGE club with multiple club locations and they get to pick/choose the best players for their RCC Team. They won it all. The Nova teams just don't have that same ability, unfortunately.
As for recruitment, I won't say who we play for but they have not helped with recruiting at all. Though I get the sense (hear the gossip) that some of the players get help/promoted. It's extremely frustrating. We've considered other options but we are too far along at this point and think it would not be a positive reflection if we did.
It’s never too late to change clubs. I know of plenty of girls who changed clubs in their Junior or Senior year and went on the play in college, at least 1 played at a D1 college.
If you hear the gossip, it’s true. One of the clubs you mentioned lost a ton of girls recently and I don’t think any of those who left regret it. They went to a couple of different clubs and wish they made the jump sooner.
When you are inside the club it’s really hard to see all the issues (or maybe believe them). Once you are outside, it’s much more clear.
Oh trust me, I absolutely believe it. But . . . it's complicated.
I would encourage you to leave. There was just a question asked on the Field Hockey Discussion forum on Facebook about switching clubs after a player commits (specifically because of mental health) and all the respondents said to switch. A couple were from college coaches and they agreed with switching.
DD beyond frustrated with current team. Current DMV team doesn’t give playing time to non committed D1 players so it’s mentally taxing being on a team that you are just paying to sit on the bench or according to the coach it’s all a learning opportunity to be on the sidelines watching (I can get that when it’s a local tournament but when requiring the player to travel especially when there is significant travel expenses to the tournaments and not play is cruel. Coach brings a roster of 18-20 and only plays 13 players: 11 starters and two subs for 10-15 min; rest are bench warmers/bill payers). DD mental health is in the toilet. The club talks about players mental health as a focus but it’s all hype. DD needs to leave the club but is too afraid to because of all the time and relationships DD has built but seeing how the coach just breaks DD down mentally is too much now. I know I should have pulled the trigger earlier in pulling DD out but I was also enamored by the hype of D1 or top D3 playing. Beware of these types of clubs that show love on Instagram for their players and the coaches are very superficial friendly and talk about mental health and well being and growing the game. I should have noticed the trickle of players switching from the club from u14 and u16 and even some u19 but I didn’t. There are always warning signs. Look out for them.
Update - DD decided to leave the team and prioritize her mental health after thinking everything through (DD had been thinking about this for the past few weeks). DD informed the coach this morning that she is leaving the team and why. Proud of DD. It was a challenging decision but her mood is so much lighter. DD decided she will do local field hockey clinics instead because she loves the sport. To the poster that encouraged putting individual mental health over the team longevity, thank you. Playing a team sport does not need to be toxic.
What an awful situation for your daughter. I'm glad she left.
What club was this?
The one club in the DMV that has only one team per U level.
There are multiple teams in the DMV with one team for outdoor and 2 teams for indoor.