Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Terrible parenting. You will pay.

how will those of us who sleep trained pay?

I don’t think the poster was serious. But there are studies that say CIO sleep training before a year damages the structure of a child’s brain increasing aggression and learning disabilities. If true, the child will pay not the parents.

Pubmed citations, please.

You can google it, PP. There are hundreds and various groups dedicated to stopping CIO sleep training.

No, there are not “hundreds” of high-quality studies showing brain damage, increased aggression, and learning disabilities in kids who did CIO. Try again.

There are various groups dedicated to stopping plenty of things. That doesn’t mean there’s quality evidence supporting their efforts.

Just google it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean the baby is sobbing because they are exhausted and can’t sleep. That has made me want to sob too! Have some compassion and let your baby fall asleep and get a good nights rest.

Are you under the impression that parents who don't CIO are taking their babies out to bars or making them watch Kubrick movies instead of "letting them sleep"?

Soothing your child when they cry does not stop them from falling asleep. It facilitates their sleep. It disrupts the adults' sleep, but you can greatly mitigate this by sleeping near your baby and adapting your own sleeping routines to accommodate your newborn until they STTN. Like going to bed early, avoiding alcohol and caffeine, and managing your stress well. You just do this for 6 months or so, it's not a huge sacrifice! And then you, too, can give your child the "gift of sleep" without having to listen to them scream and sob until they pass out.

The baby is not sobbing due to exhaustion. The baby is crying to summon a parent for comfort/reassurance/etc.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean the baby is sobbing because they are exhausted and can’t sleep. That has made me want to sob too! Have some compassion and let your baby fall asleep and get a good nights rest.

Are you under the impression that parents who don't CIO are taking their babies out to bars or making them watch Kubrick movies instead of "letting them sleep"?

Soothing your child when they cry does not stop them from falling asleep. It facilitates their sleep. It disrupts the adults' sleep, but you can greatly mitigate this by sleeping near your baby and adapting your own sleeping routines to accommodate your newborn until they STTN. Like going to bed early, avoiding alcohol and caffeine, and managing your stress well. You just do this for 6 months or so, it's not a huge sacrifice! And then you, too, can give your child the "gift of sleep" without having to listen to them scream and sob until they pass out.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have known plenty of sleep deprived babies and toddlers. It impacts everything, just like in adults. They’re moody, quick to get upset, have difficulty training. People that let their kids go for their first most formative years in that state are misguided and doing their kids a disservice. I pity those kids, same as you probably pity mine.

Why do you assume all non-CIO kids are sleep deprived? My kids slept great and were no sleep deprived at all - they just needed to be held and fed frequently. My kids sleep twelve hours a night now at 2 and 4 and never once cried for more than a minute where they were unattended to.

Sleep training is for parents not the baby.

+1 It's for parents who want to have it all. At their kids' expense....

Anonymous wrote:I mean the baby is sobbing because they are exhausted and can’t sleep. That has made me want to sob too! Have some compassion and let your baby fall asleep and get a good nights rest.

Anonymous wrote:I think it’s crueler to have an exhausted baby because you’re too scared to fix a problem. “Oh, I just couldn’t make him sad!” is a terrible way to parent.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you think CIO (done correctly, especially) and giving your child (and you) the gift of sleep is the cruelest thing you can do to a child, you’ve led a very charmed life and need to get some perspective.

There is no “gift of sleep” any more thanks there is a “gift of suckling” or “gift of appetite”.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Terrible parenting. You will pay.

how will those of us who sleep trained pay?

I don’t think the poster was serious. But there are studies that say CIO sleep training before a year damages the structure of a child’s brain increasing aggression and learning disabilities. If true, the child will pay not the parents.

Pubmed citations, please.

You can google it, PP. There are hundreds and various groups dedicated to stopping CIO sleep training.

No, there are not “hundreds” of high-quality studies showing brain damage, increased aggression, and learning disabilities in kids who did CIO. Try again.

There are various groups dedicated to stopping plenty of things. That doesn’t mean there’s quality evidence supporting their efforts.

Just google it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had a kid who cried constantly. Rocking him or holding him didn't help. At 6 weeks I just put him down and let him scream.

One night of that, and he slept through the night from then on. His whole disposition was happier, as was ours.

Kids are different. But sleep is good for everyone.

You let you baby in pain and abandoned. He gave up because there was no hope of anyone coming to help him.

Blah blah blah. He is an adult now and laughing at your comment.

Anonymous wrote:It’s so funny that proponents of CIO think babies not subjected to this are sleep deprived and their parents are up all night. Not at all. Babies don’t need to be trained to sleep.
I coslept with mine for years. Once they were past needing diaper changes at night (a few weeks?), all I had to do was roll over, nurse, go back to sleep. Didn’t even need to fully wake up, & there was literally no crying. My kids are older now & sleep just fine. No “training” required.
There’s a reason it feels so wrong to ignore a young baby’s cries.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have known plenty of sleep deprived babies and toddlers. It impacts everything, just like in adults. They’re moody, quick to get upset, have difficulty training. People that let their kids go for their first most formative years in that state are misguided and doing their kids a disservice. I pity those kids, same as you probably pity mine.

Why do you assume all non-CIO kids are sleep deprived? My kids slept great and were no sleep deprived at all - they just needed to be held and fed frequently. My kids sleep twelve hours a night now at 2 and 4 and never once cried for more than a minute where they were unattended to.

Sleep training is for parents not the baby.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let’s get real. The only reason to CIO is to support parents’ sanity, livelihood, marital relationship, etc. It doesn’t help children sleep more or better—that’s delusion parents use to justify their choice. Happens to be the same reasoning people used when spanking kids “for their own good”. They too believed it was important for establishing boundaries, learning to self-regulate, etc.

Any infant who is on a good schedule, gets enough sunlight early and has a caregiver willing to work with the child’s clock rather than their own (yes that usually means rocking and soothing them to sleep for several months) will get enough sleep. Any outliers are ill—the last kids who should be left to cry

+1

CIO was developed as a "method" in order to facilitate the way we raise kids in the US -- dual income families, minimal family or community support. Babies are expected to get on adult schedules as quickly as possible because there is such limited accommodation for children.

In countries with sufficient parental leave and more support for young families, CIO is not a thing because it's not necessary. Even when both parents work, there is often extended family or communal support that enables the parents to work. Or families work alternate schedules. The idea that a couple will get their child STTN by month 2 or 3 so that the parents can get uninterrupted sleep without the assistance of extended family and then return to pre-baby schedules at work, is a uniquely American phenomenon.

Go ask people in other societies about Ferber or CIO or any of this. They don't know what you are talking about. Babies don't need to be "trained" to sleep. It's just in the country we train them to function as much like adults as possible to accommodate a culture that does not accommodate children or families but expects them to accommodate everyone else.

Ha! My German family recommended CIO to me before I ever considered it myself.