Anonymous
Post 04/13/2022 17:06     Subject: How did you not kill each other during the baby years?!
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I married a guy who takes initiative.


This. I married someone who is hardworking, supportive, independently take initiative, and is a good caretaker. I could have married men who were higher earning or in more prestigious careers, but I decided to prioritize other things. I know that this post is not helpful to the OP, so I will try to follow up with more constructive suggestions. It helps to agree to specific tasks and division of labor. Like you, will take care of baby from hours of 8 PM - 1 AM and he will take care from 1 AM to 8 AM or whatever works if you are nursing. Good luck.


I married someone like that too and we both slightly downshifted our careers before having kids (Biglaw to government) and yet I still 100% wanted to kill him at times during the first year. Especially with the first kid. Sleep deprivation is no joke. Neither of our kids were good sleepers for the first 6 months. And there's so much more stuff with a baby and it was really hard for us to adjust to not having personal time.

Agree that specific tasks and division of labor help a lot, and making them not optional. Also, division of labor as the PP describes, so you can each get more sleep. There's no point to both being awake at the same time past 9 pm and then also up with the baby.

And the biggest thing is don't let him get away with saying he needs uninterrupted sleep because he's working and you're home with the baby. Unless someone will die if he's sleep-deprived - ie he is a pilot, surgeon, cop - he can deal with sleep deprivation alongside you. I stayed home several months with each kid and DH did the same and we both agreed that working was far easier than staying home. At least you can go to the bathroom in peace at the office.
Anonymous
Post 04/13/2022 16:43     Subject: How did you not kill each other during the baby years?!
Anonymous wrote:Whining about the low expectations we have for men does nothing to help OP. Many men suck at taking care of infants. Should you just up and divorce a man when he fails to be a good father in that first year? I mean that is fair. But ultimately it is up to each person to decide what they can put up with, and for many women it is worthwhile to figure out strategies to improve the situation (like better communication, even if it shouldn't be needed), because many men do improve. Even if they totally suck initially.


I'm a mom and I sucked at taking care of an infant. I got as much support as I could (grandmas, nanny, eventually daycare, babysitters). But I'm eternally grateful that my DH stood by me and sucked it up through the "unskilled" part.
Anonymous
Post 04/13/2022 16:42     Subject: How did you not kill each other during the baby years?!
Whining about the low expectations we have for men does nothing to help OP. Many men suck at taking care of infants. Should you just up and divorce a man when he fails to be a good father in that first year? I mean that is fair. But ultimately it is up to each person to decide what they can put up with, and for many women it is worthwhile to figure out strategies to improve the situation (like better communication, even if it shouldn't be needed), because many men do improve. Even if they totally suck initially.
Anonymous
Post 04/13/2022 16:37     Subject: How did you not kill each other during the baby years?!
Anonymous wrote:All the people on this thread calling expecting one’s husband to do basic life admin and show truly basic levels of conscientiousness “mind reading” make me want to vomit. The expectations for men are so unbelievably low it’s mind boggling. It isn’t expecting “mind reading” to expect your husband to see you struggling and exhausting and take initiative without you telling them exactly how to do it. Holy crap.


Exactly, but this phenomenon is widespread based on DCUM posts and people that I know IRL. Like one PP said, men usually have no problem taking initiative to get things done at work. Men probably feel clueless about how to take care of a baby, so they kind of check out. We’re trying to change hundreds of years of societal stereotypes in just a few decades.
Anonymous
Post 04/13/2022 16:15     Subject: How did you not kill each other during the baby years?!
That age is difficult for everyone. The only thing that helps is better communication. Based on your post your DH does sound more unhelpful than most, OP, but it can be so hard to tell. Plenty of needs that were “obvious” to me when I was the BFing primary caregiver for our infant just were not to my DH. I came to accept that and to speak up more. And I didn’t come to that view to let him off the hook—I still think he should have done better about asking what I needed—but only to turn down the temperature on my own rage.
Anonymous
Post 04/13/2022 13:05     Subject: How did you not kill each other during the baby years?!
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Agree with much of what has been said here (except for trying to blame breastfeeding for the inequities -- I'm not going to waste space on that ridiculous suggestion). I have a nine month old and WOW, the first six months was just awful on my relationship with my husband. OP, I have been there! My husband is not a dud, but he was such a dud for the first several months postpartum. From my perspective, he did not take the initiative to do much, he had to be told exactly what to do (and would sometimes get irritated at being asked to help), the stress/lack of sleep made him selfish and turned him into a bit of a jerk, and he wasn't particularly interested in the baby the first few months. I say that this was from my perspective, and while my husband's perspective would inevitably be different, I do not think he would really disagree with this assessment. Of course, all of this was happening at a time when I needed his support more than ever. I did question whether our relationship could weather the storm, particularly because I was not interested in a long-term relationship with this level of inequity and friction. At the 5-6 month mark, however, I do feel like things started to slowly improve. At the 9 month mark, things feel much better, though not great (it is still a work in progress, but I do see good progress).

The thing that helped me the most during this period was hearing from other now-functional couples how common this relationship breakdown is, which is also very evident from this thread. There are a lot of reasons this happens, but I think a big one is lack of sleep. Sleep training the baby helped us quite a bit. Our baby also got easier and more fun around six months. The baby also developed a personality, which helped my husband better connect. And, over time, we just got a better handle on our new life. Tons of attempts (often failed) to patiently communicate also helped us. Assigning repetitive tasks to my husband was useful. It was also infuriating because that felt like yet another task I had to take on, manage, and monitor, but it was still ultimately helpful. The first several months are such a slog. For us, I think the only way out was through, but I do think we are coming out of the other side. OP, hopefully you will get there as well. In the meantime, just know many, many couples make it to the other side of this very challenging time.


I don’t think it is ridiculous at all. Breastfeeding falls solely on the woman and sends a strong signal to the man that the baby is the responsibility of the woman. Yes, the man can still do things but the hardest job of all is 100% on the woman. The baby is essentially tied to the woman for a period of time and it’s way more of a burden on the mom. It seems to set the tone for a lot of parenting going forward.


I'm the PP. To be clearer, what I find ridiculous are the posts that are suggesting that the inequities are the mother's fault because she is choosing to breastfeed and that the heavier load is, therefore, self-inflicted. I do not disagree that breastfeeding can create inequities, but it is absurd to suggest that it is the mother's fault for choosing to breastfeed and that she should simply stop breastfeeding to improve the inequity. OP's complaints are far broader than who is feeding/waking up with the baby overnight.


Seems pretty obvious to me. Unfortunately I do think in a lot of cases the heavier load is self-inflicted. Breastfeeding contributes to inequality and women would be much better off not breastfeeding. Notice how it’s advertised as FREE like a woman’s time is free??


I sort of agree, the problem is that there are health benefits for both baby and mother. Formula companies convinced/conned/bribed doctors and hospitals to promote formula, and they realized it wasn’t the best medical advice. So now they’ve swung the pendulum perhaps too far the other way to make sure they explain the health benefits of breastfeeding. That gets layered with the mommy guilt industrial complex.

I think a more reasonable solution would be a campaign that emphasizes how breastfeeding can make dads feel isolated and uninvolved, and what they can do to counteract that. I had an included visit with a lactation consultant in the hospital, the father was there, and there’s no reason she couldn’t have talked about it or handed him a pamphlet or something.
Anonymous
Post 04/12/2022 06:56     Subject: How did you not kill each other during the baby years?!
We stretched to afford hired help because we had no family nearby.