Anonymous
09/20/2014 18:23
Subject: Re:So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Incidentally, the fact that Deal is only 21% FARMs is probably no accident:
http://www.prrac.org/pdf/annotated_bibliography_on_school_poverty_concentration.pdf
The U.S. Department of Education has assessed the effect of poverty concentration on
both poor and non-poor students alike. See, e.g., Poverty, Achievement and Distribution.
In schools with less than 7% poverty, 27.6% of poor students and 11% of non-poor
students achieved below the national average. But when school poverty levels increase to
greater than 24%, then 56% of poor students and 36.9% of non-poor students fell below
the national average. Although the primary conclusion is that both groups suffered
dramatically, it is noteworthy that concentrated poverty had a greater relative impact on
non-poor students. Id. at 21.7
http://www.prrac.org/pdf/annotated_bibliography_on_school_poverty_concentration.pdf
Anonymous
09/20/2014 18:16
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:
NP, with no kids at Hardy, pointing out that the primary reason Deal has so much is that their enrollment is so high - almost 3x that of Hardy. More students means funds for all the extras you're seeking. Right now, Hardy enrollment is around 400, but capacity is 650. If all the IB families decided next year that they were going to Hardy, there still wouldn't be enough to bring all that Deal has.
Those families are more likely to get what they want by attending than standing off to the side griping. Parents who want more challenging coursework won't get it from the outside. BUT, because of Hardy's capacity and the low demand for public schooling in that part of town, OOB numbers are not likely to change much. It seems the real issue is that IB families don't like the racial make-up of the school.
Which is a really weird dilemma considering diversity in middle school grades at charters. Nobody seems to have a problem with the number of non-white students at Basis.
No, PP. The reason Deal does so well is that it is only 21% FARMs. Hardy, on the other hand, is 55% FARMs. If Deal became 55% FARMs tomorrow, its academic standing would plummet and IB families would start heading for the exits.
Anonymous
09/20/2014 18:08
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
...
Here's a thought: Since the Hardy building is huge, perhaps DCPS should run two schools in one building -- Hardy IB and Hardy OOB. Hardy IB will consist of only IB kids and kids from Hardy feeders, while Hardy OOB will be open to all of DC via lottery. The IB and OOB kids would not take classes together or participate in extracurriculars together. They share the building have almost no interaction.
I think this is a great idea. Except that we should also - obviously - let the white OOB families mix with the IB students. That way we are at least being clear and honest about the discriminatory goals of this "Two Hardy" plan.
You're right, PP. There is a certain discriminatory intent to the "Two Hardy" plan. However, it is not discrimination by race, but rather by class.
If all of DC's poor black population were replaced with poor whites, IB families would still want a Hardy that is predominantly IB. The vast majority of the (white) OOB students would be poor, and research has demonstrated middle-class kids who attend schools with high concentrations of poverty suffer for it:
There is a robust literature on the impact of school-based poverty concentration on
academic achievement. In the first major study on the topic since the 1966 Coleman
Report, Mary Kennedy in 1986 found that the relationship between school poverty
concentrations and student achievement averages is stronger than the relationship
between family poverty status and student achievement.1 Kennedy reported that nonpoor
students attending schools with high concentrations of poverty are more likely to
fall behind than are poor students who attend schools with low concentrations of
poverty.2 Numerous studies substantiate Kennedy’s findings;3 and at this point there is no
question that school poverty concentration has a detrimental impact on student
achievement.
http://www.prrac.org/pdf/annotated_bibliography_on_school_poverty_concentration.pdf
In other words, rich families can't undo the effects of sending their kids to schools where most of the kids are poor. That's why so many opt for private school.
Anonymous
09/20/2014 17:20
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Yawn.....
Nobody's forcing you to read.
I think that "Yawn" is a more polite version of "STFU." Clearly the PP doesn't want to hear or read other points of view that are other than Hardy-affirming.
No, I think the "yawn" is saying that after 42 pages, this is really tiring.
It may be the case that the number of pages of this thread exceeds the number of in-boundary students who have chosen Hardy!
But not the number of IB students who have not chosen to go.
Hardy, the neighborhood school of perhaps the wealthiest neighborhood in DC, is being eschewed by its IB families.
Turning Hardy into a true neighborhood school shouldn't be so hard in the face of such obvious pent-up demand. It shouldn't require a grassroots campaign by activist parents supported by the principal. DCPS should simply do whatever it takes to get the IB families to come back.
That may be your point of view so let me explain something. Hardy is not meant to be a "true" neighborhood school. I don't even want to go there, whatever true is supposed to mean. Hardy is a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood. One city!
I appreciate your being so forthright, PP.
As I see it, there are two camps -- those who want to preserve the status quo and those who want to see Hardy become the next Deal.
In the status quo camp are people such are you who want to preserve access to "a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood." The status quo camp wants Hardy to remain, in essence, a DCPS run charter school with neighborhood preference. Of course, this vision of Hardy implies high OOB numbers, i.e., 70% or higher.
In the Hardy is the next Deal camp are all the IB families who appreciate that Hardy renaissance will require the OOB numbers to drop to something close to the 30% it is at Deal.
These two camps have fundamentally incompatible visions for the future of Hardy, so only one camp can prevail.
Here's a thought: Since the Hardy building is huge, perhaps DCPS should run two schools in one building -- Hardy IB and Hardy OOB. Hardy IB will consist of only IB kids and kids from Hardy feeders, while Hardy OOB will be open to all of DC via lottery. The IB and OOB kids would not take classes together or participate in extracurriculars together. They share the building have almost no interaction.
I think this is a great idea. Except that we should also - obviously - let the white OOB families mix with the IB students. That way we are at least being clear and honest about the discriminatory goals of this "Two Hardy" plan.
Anonymous
09/20/2014 17:01
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Yawn.....
Nobody's forcing you to read.
I think that "Yawn" is a more polite version of "STFU." Clearly the PP doesn't want to hear or read other points of view that are other than Hardy-affirming.
No, I think the "yawn" is saying that after 42 pages, this is really tiring.
It may be the case that the number of pages of this thread exceeds the number of in-boundary students who have chosen Hardy!
But not the number of IB students who have not chosen to go.
Hardy, the neighborhood school of perhaps the wealthiest neighborhood in DC, is being eschewed by its IB families.
Turning Hardy into a true neighborhood school shouldn't be so hard in the face of such obvious pent-up demand. It shouldn't require a grassroots campaign by activist parents supported by the principal. DCPS should simply do whatever it takes to get the IB families to come back.
That may be your point of view so let me explain something. Hardy is not meant to be a "true" neighborhood school. I don't even want to go there, whatever true is supposed to mean. Hardy is a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood. One city!
I appreciate your being so forthright, PP.
As I see it, there are two camps -- those who want to preserve the status quo and those who want to see Hardy become the next Deal.
In the status quo camp are people such are you who want to preserve access to "a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood." The status quo camp wants Hardy to remain, in essence, a DCPS run charter school with neighborhood preference. Of course, this vision of Hardy implies high OOB numbers, i.e., 70% or higher.
In the Hardy is the next Deal camp are all the IB families who appreciate that Hardy renaissance will require the OOB numbers to drop to something close to the 30% it is at Deal.
These two camps have fundamentally incompatible visions for the future of Hardy, so only one camp can prevail.
Here's a thought: Since the Hardy building is huge, perhaps DCPS should run two schools in one building -- Hardy IB and Hardy OOB. Hardy IB will consist of only IB kids and kids from Hardy feeders, while Hardy OOB will be open to all of DC via lottery. The IB and OOB kids would not take classes together or participate in extracurriculars together. They share the building have almost no interaction.
NP, with no kids at Hardy, pointing out that the primary reason Deal has so much is that their enrollment is so high - almost 3x that of Hardy. More students means funds for all the extras you're seeking. Right now, Hardy enrollment is around 400, but capacity is 650. If all the IB families decided next year that they were going to Hardy, there still wouldn't be enough to bring all that Deal has.
Those families are more likely to get what they want by attending than standing off to the side griping. Parents who want more challenging coursework won't get it from the outside. BUT, because of Hardy's capacity and the low demand for public schooling in that part of town, OOB numbers are not likely to change much. It seems the real issue is that IB families don't like the racial make-up of the school.
Which is a really weird dilemma considering diversity in middle school grades at charters. Nobody seems to have a problem with the number of non-white students at Basis.
Anonymous
09/20/2014 16:41
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Yawn.....
Nobody's forcing you to read.
I think that "Yawn" is a more polite version of "STFU." Clearly the PP doesn't want to hear or read other points of view that are other than Hardy-affirming.
No, I think the "yawn" is saying that after 42 pages, this is really tiring.
It may be the case that the number of pages of this thread exceeds the number of in-boundary students who have chosen Hardy!
But not the number of IB students who have not chosen to go.
Hardy, the neighborhood school of perhaps the wealthiest neighborhood in DC, is being eschewed by its IB families.
Turning Hardy into a true neighborhood school shouldn't be so hard in the face of such obvious pent-up demand. It shouldn't require a grassroots campaign by activist parents supported by the principal. DCPS should simply do whatever it takes to get the IB families to come back.
That may be your point of view so let me explain something. Hardy is not meant to be a "true" neighborhood school. I don't even want to go there, whatever true is supposed to mean. Hardy is a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood. One city!
I appreciate your being so forthright, PP.
As I see it, there are two camps -- those who want to preserve the status quo and those who want to see Hardy become the next Deal.
In the status quo camp are people such are you who want to preserve access to "a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood." The status quo camp wants Hardy to remain, in essence, a DCPS run charter school with neighborhood preference. Of course, this vision of Hardy implies high OOB numbers, i.e., 70% or higher.
In the Hardy is the next Deal camp are all the IB families who appreciate that Hardy renaissance will require the OOB numbers to drop to something close to the 30% it is at Deal.
These two camps have fundamentally incompatible visions for the future of Hardy, so only one camp can prevail.
Here's a thought: Since the Hardy building is huge, perhaps DCPS should run two schools in one building -- Hardy IB and Hardy OOB. Hardy IB will consist of only IB kids and kids from Hardy feeders, while Hardy OOB will be open to all of DC via lottery. The IB and OOB kids would not take classes together or participate in extracurriculars together. They share the building have almost no interaction.
This is silly. There is also a third camp - and believe me, they constitute the vast, vast majority of Hardy OOB families. I am in this camp. We don't care about any of this long-term debate about OOB/IB. Our children are at the school for three years. We want them to have a great learning experience, and the rest doesn't matter. We don't have the time and the inclination to engage in the debate about what Hardy will look like in five, or even three years because our children will have moved on.
We ask that you not stereotype our children as poorly educated, misbehaving thugs. We ask that they have the same opportunity and access to strong academic program as IB students. Beyond that, we welcome all families who seek to make Hardy even better - whether they are IB or OOB - to Hardy.
No, PP. You're in the first camp. You want to preserve the status quo -- at least while your children benefit from it.
PP here. Not sure why you would say that. In fact, I'm utterly mystified as to why you would say that.
With the exception of a policy that closes off Hardy to all OOB students even if there is room for them, or that excludes them from activities available to IB students, there is not single proposal about Hardy that I could not support or accept.
Uniforms? I like them, but if the Principal wants to get rid of them, that's fine with me. No big deal.
More honors classes? More differentiation? Bring it on!
The Principal explicitly seeking input and guidance and recruiting IB familes? I'm for it.
I could go on, but I hope you get my point. Generally, what's good for IB Hardy families is good for all Hardy families - so I welcome these policies. Just make sure that you are not excluding my child just because my address is east of 16th St.
Anonymous
09/20/2014 16:14
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Yeah, and a ton of cars from Maryland pick up kids at the end of the day at Hardy. I mean, a lot. So, I'm not sure "one city" describes describes the "OOB" population. We need a new slogan to embrace the regional nature this "neighborhood" school.
Rose Lees Hardy for All...of the greater DC metro area!
For real. If Pride could get rid of all the residency cheaters, it would immediately reduce the OOB enrollment by a significant amount. But I don't know HOW significant, probably in the dozens, based on all of the MD plates parked around 35th street for pickup throughout the afternoon.
Anonymous
09/20/2014 16:04
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Yawn.....
Nobody's forcing you to read.
I think that "Yawn" is a more polite version of "STFU." Clearly the PP doesn't want to hear or read other points of view that are other than Hardy-affirming.
No, I think the "yawn" is saying that after 42 pages, this is really tiring.
It may be the case that the number of pages of this thread exceeds the number of in-boundary students who have chosen Hardy!
But not the number of IB students who have not chosen to go.
Hardy, the neighborhood school of perhaps the wealthiest neighborhood in DC, is being eschewed by its IB families.
Turning Hardy into a true neighborhood school shouldn't be so hard in the face of such obvious pent-up demand. It shouldn't require a grassroots campaign by activist parents supported by the principal. DCPS should simply do whatever it takes to get the IB families to come back.
That may be your point of view so let me explain something. Hardy is not meant to be a "true" neighborhood school. I don't even want to go there, whatever true is supposed to mean. Hardy is a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood. One city!
I appreciate your being so forthright, PP.
As I see it, there are two camps -- those who want to preserve the status quo and those who want to see Hardy become the next Deal.
In the status quo camp are people such are you who want to preserve access to "a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood." The status quo camp wants Hardy to remain, in essence, a DCPS run charter school with neighborhood preference. Of course, this vision of Hardy implies high OOB numbers, i.e., 70% or higher.
In the Hardy is the next Deal camp are all the IB families who appreciate that Hardy renaissance will require the OOB numbers to drop to something close to the 30% it is at Deal.
These two camps have fundamentally incompatible visions for the future of Hardy, so only one camp can prevail.
Here's a thought: Since the Hardy building is huge, perhaps DCPS should run two schools in one building -- Hardy IB and Hardy OOB. Hardy IB will consist of only IB kids and kids from Hardy feeders, while Hardy OOB will be open to all of DC via lottery. The IB and OOB kids would not take classes together or participate in extracurriculars together. They share the building have almost no interaction.
This is silly. There is also a third camp - and believe me, they constitute the vast, vast majority of Hardy OOB families. I am in this camp. We don't care about any of this long-term debate about OOB/IB. Our children are at the school for three years. We want them to have a great learning experience, and the rest doesn't matter. We don't have the time and the inclination to engage in the debate about what Hardy will look like in five, or even three years because our children will have moved on.
We ask that you not stereotype our children as poorly educated, misbehaving thugs. We ask that they have the same opportunity and access to strong academic program as IB students. Beyond that, we welcome all families who seek to make Hardy even better - whether they are IB or OOB - to Hardy.
No, PP. You're in the first camp. You want to preserve the status quo -- at least while your children benefit from it.
Anonymous
09/20/2014 16:02
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:Yeah, and a ton of cars from Maryland pick up kids at the end of the day at Hardy. I mean, a lot. So, I'm not sure "one city" describes describes the "OOB" population. We need a new slogan to embrace the regional nature this "neighborhood" school.
Rose Lees Hardy for All...of the greater DC metro area!
Anonymous
09/20/2014 15:54
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Yeah, and a ton of cars from Maryland pick up kids at the end of the day at Hardy. I mean, a lot. So, I'm not sure "one city" describes describes the "OOB" population. We need a new slogan to embrace the regional nature this "neighborhood" school.
Anonymous
09/20/2014 14:44
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Yawn.....
Nobody's forcing you to read.
I think that "Yawn" is a more polite version of "STFU." Clearly the PP doesn't want to hear or read other points of view that are other than Hardy-affirming.
No, I think the "yawn" is saying that after 42 pages, this is really tiring.
It may be the case that the number of pages of this thread exceeds the number of in-boundary students who have chosen Hardy!
But not the number of IB students who have not chosen to go.
Hardy, the neighborhood school of perhaps the wealthiest neighborhood in DC, is being eschewed by its IB families.
Turning Hardy into a true neighborhood school shouldn't be so hard in the face of such obvious pent-up demand. It shouldn't require a grassroots campaign by activist parents supported by the principal. DCPS should simply do whatever it takes to get the IB families to come back.
Please ignore this poster, who does not represent the vast majority of current Hardy families.
That may be your point of view so let me explain something. Hardy is not meant to be a "true" neighborhood school. I don't even want to go there, whatever true is supposed to mean. Hardy is a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood. One city!
Anonymous
09/20/2014 14:43
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Yawn.....
Nobody's forcing you to read.
I think that "Yawn" is a more polite version of "STFU." Clearly the PP doesn't want to hear or read other points of view that are other than Hardy-affirming.
No, I think the "yawn" is saying that after 42 pages, this is really tiring.
It may be the case that the number of pages of this thread exceeds the number of in-boundary students who have chosen Hardy!
But not the number of IB students who have not chosen to go.
Hardy, the neighborhood school of perhaps the wealthiest neighborhood in DC, is being eschewed by its IB families.
Turning Hardy into a true neighborhood school shouldn't be so hard in the face of such obvious pent-up demand. It shouldn't require a grassroots campaign by activist parents supported by the principal. DCPS should simply do whatever it takes to get the IB families to come back.
This insipid pablum is all that is necessary to turn Hardy around! I don't know why nobody thought of this simple idea before!
Anonymous
09/20/2014 14:42
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Yawn.....
Nobody's forcing you to read.
I think that "Yawn" is a more polite version of "STFU." Clearly the PP doesn't want to hear or read other points of view that are other than Hardy-affirming.
No, I think the "yawn" is saying that after 42 pages, this is really tiring.
It may be the case that the number of pages of this thread exceeds the number of in-boundary students who have chosen Hardy!
But not the number of IB students who have not chosen to go.
Hardy, the neighborhood school of perhaps the wealthiest neighborhood in DC, is being eschewed by its IB families.
Turning Hardy into a true neighborhood school shouldn't be so hard in the face of such obvious pent-up demand. It shouldn't require a grassroots campaign by activist parents supported by the principal. DCPS should simply do whatever it takes to get the IB families to come back.
That may be your point of view so let me explain something. Hardy is not meant to be a "true" neighborhood school. I don't even want to go there, whatever true is supposed to mean. Hardy is a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood. One city!
I appreciate your being so forthright, PP.
As I see it, there are two camps -- those who want to preserve the status quo and those who want to see Hardy become the next Deal.
In the status quo camp are people such are you who want to preserve access to "a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood." The status quo camp wants Hardy to remain, in essence, a DCPS run charter school with neighborhood preference. Of course, this vision of Hardy implies high OOB numbers, i.e., 70% or higher.
In the Hardy is the next Deal camp are all the IB families who appreciate that Hardy renaissance will require the OOB numbers to drop to something close to the 30% it is at Deal.
These two camps have fundamentally incompatible visions for the future of Hardy, so only one camp can prevail.
Here's a thought: Since the Hardy building is huge, perhaps DCPS should run two schools in one building -- Hardy IB and Hardy OOB. Hardy IB will consist of only IB kids and kids from Hardy feeders, while Hardy OOB will be open to all of DC via lottery. The IB and OOB kids would not take classes together or participate in extracurriculars together. They share the building have almost no interaction.
This is silly. There is also a third camp - and believe me, they constitute the vast, vast majority of Hardy OOB families. I am in this camp. We don't care about any of this long-term debate about OOB/IB. Our children are at the school for three years. We want them to have a great learning experience, and the rest doesn't matter. We don't have the time and the inclination to engage in the debate about what Hardy will look like in five, or even three years because our children will have moved on.
We ask that you not stereotype our children as poorly educated, misbehaving thugs. We ask that they have the same opportunity and access to strong academic program as IB students. Beyond that, we welcome all families who seek to make Hardy even better - whether they are IB or OOB - to Hardy.
Anonymous
09/20/2014 14:22
Subject: Re:So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
They would share the building but have almost no interaction.
Anonymous
09/20/2014 14:20
Subject: So how many IB are going to really be at Hardy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Yawn.....
Nobody's forcing you to read.
I think that "Yawn" is a more polite version of "STFU." Clearly the PP doesn't want to hear or read other points of view that are other than Hardy-affirming.
No, I think the "yawn" is saying that after 42 pages, this is really tiring.
It may be the case that the number of pages of this thread exceeds the number of in-boundary students who have chosen Hardy!
But not the number of IB students who have not chosen to go.
Hardy, the neighborhood school of perhaps the wealthiest neighborhood in DC, is being eschewed by its IB families.
Turning Hardy into a true neighborhood school shouldn't be so hard in the face of such obvious pent-up demand. It shouldn't require a grassroots campaign by activist parents supported by the principal. DCPS should simply do whatever it takes to get the IB families to come back.
That may be your point of view so let me explain something. Hardy is not meant to be a "true" neighborhood school. I don't even want to go there, whatever true is supposed to mean. Hardy is a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood. One city!
I appreciate your being so forthright, PP.
As I see it, there are two camps -- those who want to preserve the status quo and those who want to see Hardy become the next Deal.
In the status quo camp are people such are you who want to preserve access to "a splendid and shining resource for all of DC not just one neighborhood." The status quo camp wants Hardy to remain, in essence, a DCPS run charter school with neighborhood preference. Of course, this vision of Hardy implies high OOB numbers, i.e., 70% or higher.
In the Hardy is the next Deal camp are all the IB families who appreciate that Hardy renaissance will require the OOB numbers to drop to something close to the 30% it is at Deal.
These two camps have fundamentally incompatible visions for the future of Hardy, so only one camp can prevail.
Here's a thought: Since the Hardy building is huge, perhaps DCPS should run two schools in one building -- Hardy IB and Hardy OOB. Hardy IB will consist of only IB kids and kids from Hardy feeders, while Hardy OOB will be open to all of DC via lottery. The IB and OOB kids would not take classes together or participate in extracurriculars together. They share the building have almost no interaction.