Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has anyone given a good reason why the Board handed over the letter of complaint to the Coach this past summer (before he was arrested)? Anyone had to know that would chill further complaints. The justifications in the article, such as that the girls had not requested confidentiality, seemed pretty weak. I believe that many of the crew parents did not have all the facts, but that one fairly recent decision by the Board members seems pretty indefensible given that these concerns had been raised before.

It is truly amazing. He was calling the athletes he coached names to the board members regarding the letter and then they renewed his contract!

I have(had) multiple rowers who row out of TBC. Shipley being a creeper wasn't a secret even for the female athletes on other teams. What non-rowing parents may not know is that there are tons of teams down at TBC everyday during the fall and spring seasons. The kids generally know each other from neighborhoods, elementary school, other sports, friends of friends, etc. They see each other every day down on the water and most weekends at regattas. They all talk and gossip. It was well known on our team that Shipley was an asshole to the kids but got results so everyone put up with him. He was openly abusive to his athletes which made a lot the the females from other teams feel uncomfortable. Yes rowing is intense but he was definitely an outlier in his public treatment of his athletes. Our teams travel a lot too. Never would it just be a coach and the kids. Never. We would see Whitman at the travel locations and do just assumed parents had gone too-- like every other team! The whole program is completely toxic.

The good news this that the girls rowing out of TBC did really well this fall. So glad to see them loving the sport....and not being humiliated in public or worse!

there is so much misinformation being tossed around on this thread, and what is most upsetting to me to read are the parents of rowers in other HS programs who seem so quick to throw the whitman rowing parent community under a bus and allege the community as a whole cares more about winning than their own children’s or any child’s safety. I am the parent of 2 whitman rowers (boy/girl, but the team travels together), and I have never observed a regatta involving overnight travel where there have not been parent chaperones. I can’t speak to what happened in 2018, but for the past few years that has been true (and there are very few overnight regattas). Many teams practice year round as you know if you are the parent of rowers at another area high school - bcc, wj, wilson, etc. - and many teams have culture issues, including there were some on area teams this past fall but I don’t view it as appropriate to start calling out other teams nor would I pretend to know the inner workings. To be clear, Shipley is clearly a predator and with hindsight should have been removed and arrested long ago, I doubt anyone feels otherwise on that point.

No one has thrown the entire Whitman parent rowing community under the bus. Board which is parents yes but the whole group? Nope.

Sure I know of other teams who have had problems but none to the extent which the Post has reported on where parents in the community (your community) were speaking out only to be shut down by parents in the same community. The program -- board, coach and whomever at Whitman had connection to it are toxic. The Whitman parents we know who have kids rowing out of TBC were just as shocked as the rest of us but frankly, not shocked that other kids noticed the coaching issue which were happening in public.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Post story today was pretty damning

The story was largely told from the point of view of just-graduated and alum rowers and their families.

Perhaps colleges and scholarships were a driving force for them in rowing.

But that is not true of the parents or kids I know on the current team.

I want to know more about the current "team" - from the article it seemed like the girls were on their own. Who is going out in the launch with them now? Who is setting the practice routines? Who holds the insurance?

Former high school (and college scholarship) female rower here -- it is a sport filled with a$$hole male coaches who are manipulative and abusive, even if not sexually. The bnest ones I have had were married with families - I would be wary of any unmarried male coach over the age of 25 at this point. I am very proud of the rowers who wrote the letter and called him out for everything. The parents/board should be ashamed - it was like their own private little club.

And to those who said "find another team" - it's not that easy. You have to have boat house and water access and equipment and practice schedules that fit with travel and school schedules. If you really love the sport, it is often hard to find another team. That's the kicker that keeps so many athletes stuck in not great situations - it's not like rec soccer.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone know if Shipley was considered a good teacher. It seems unlikely he put much thought or effort into teaching if crew took up so much of his time year round. Before school and after school. He seemed to live and breathe crew

He was one of my DCs favorite teachers. DC got a 5 on the AP Euro exam so must have learned something.

Because 5’s are all that matter.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The board did not proactively contact the full alumni and offer counseling services. They were offered to the current team members and those who just graduated. The board had all of the email contact information for rowers for at least 3 years back and could have easily reached out to them and the parents, but chose not to do so.

Also when confronted with this information, the current board president indicated they could not comment on the allegations due to the ongoing investigation. However neither the MPD or US Attorney gave the team any instruction to avoid speaking to alumni and parents.

I get that many of the current board members were new and could claim ignorance of what happened in 2013 and 2018. The kids in 2018 knew the rumors about 2013 (way before they even started at Whitman). Kids talk, adults should listen.

Why did the athletes stay? As commented by others they loved the sport. There is no other sport where the outcome of the race is so dependent upon the people in the boat being in synch.

Many colleges don’t offer crew scholarships so while it may add to an applicant’s profile to have participated in HS, most students do not get any financial benefit on their college costs.

You may not get money in scholarships but it gives you entry into competitive colleges. Many Whitman parents can afford to pay full price. I get why the girls did not quit the team. HS girls are at a complicated age and they are driven to do things with their group even if it causes stress and unhappiness. Not easy to walk away especially if you are good and enjoy the sport. No blame on them. It is the adults who should have known better. The board was clearly toxic and the other crew parents were probably intimidated by the board and didn’t want to be on the outs with the coach. It is depressing. Not an easy situation to navigate by any means but sad that hardly any adult was willing to stick their neck out and call Shipley out. Sad that the former Whitman principal also turned a blind eye. He must have worked with Shipley for years

The girls don’t quit because of gaslighting. They are told to suck it up, they will “get more attention” if they work harder, that all coaches are hard, blah, blah, blah.

It’s total BS, but that is what the parents tell them.

As a parent, you find them another team. You don't leave them on a team like that. And, you can get into good colleges without crew. You don't leave your child in a situation like that when they tell you something is not right.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Post story today was pretty damning

The story was largely told from the point of view of just-graduated and alum rowers and their families.

Perhaps colleges and scholarships were a driving force for them in rowing.

But that is not true of the parents or kids I know on the current team.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^one other point: the Whitman crew parent's defense of "we just couldn't imagine it" is like what Joe Paterno said in defending his continued support of Jerry Sandusky well after he knew about the allegations. That is, he just couldn't conceive as possible. And again: if you are a parent with oversight of children, *it is your job* to educate yourself and to force yourself to consider these kinds of scenarios. Mandated reporters don't get to say they just couldn't believe something could happen, so they ignored the signs. Ignorance is a poor defense.

I am the Whitman crew parent, and I think you are over-spinning what I said.
But I take your point.

Know that one is trying to get off the hook here.

Meantime, the board has offered free counseling services to current and former rowers (and maybe their families--I'm not positive about that).
The counseling is being paid for with donations.
Maybe you have suggestions for what else the team could do.

You said "normal people couldn't conceive this" or something to that effect, right? I mean, what? I'll grant you that some of us, myself included, have a higher level of professional and/or personal experience with abusive behavior than others. I've had to look things right in the eye that other people run from, and that does change a person's idea of what's possible. But that *no one* on the board could conceive of this? In the age of clergy sex abuse, Penn State, Me Too, on and on and on? If true, that's a sad commentary on the parents who volunteered for these roles.

As for what else the team could do, I agree with a PP that the board needs to be immediately dissolved. When you re-form it, include people who are explicitly NOT crew stakeholders, and who are there SOLELY to look out for the kids. It's clear previous board members were too involved, to put it mildly, to be objective about the best interests of the kids.

Also, hire women coaches. They're not perfect, but they're far less likely to be sexual predators than men.

How realistic is this? Who wants to spend time on a kids sports board when their kids aren't involved. I was a Whitman parent and can't imagine volunteering for the Crew board, or any other sport/activity, when my kids were doing other activities that I was involved in.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone know if Shipley was considered a good teacher. It seems unlikely he put much thought or effort into teaching if crew took up so much of his time year round. Before school and after school. He seemed to live and breathe crew

He was one of my DCs favorite teachers. DC got a 5 on the AP Euro exam so must have learned something.

Anonymous wrote:Anyone know if Shipley was considered a good teacher. It seems unlikely he put much thought or effort into teaching if crew took up so much of his time year round. Before school and after school. He seemed to live and breathe crew

Anonymous wrote:Anyone know if Shipley was considered a good teacher. It seems unlikely he put much thought or effort into teaching if crew took up so much of his time year round. Before school and after school. He seemed to live and breathe crew

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m still stuck on letting a grown man take all these girls to Airbnb’s for out of town trips with no other adults/parents present. No one working with children should be given this kind of access. There were signs that he was inappropriate and the signs were completely ignored because parents wanted the status and success and scholarship money more than safety for their children. Period.

The problem with this thinking is that it allows you -- us -- to imagine that we are all sooo different from those Whitman parents, that different parents -- better parents -- would have noticed the signs and put a stop to things long ago.

Forget the part where that's a pretty uncharitable caricature of the Whitman community -- but it doesn't keep anyone safer. The fact is -- and this is backed up by research, feel free to google -- that we're all susceptible to manipulation. Predators show up in all kinds of communities. We are all vulnerable, to different degrees. All of our communities are full of individuals and families that are goal-driven, hardworking, that are achieve this or that. Our kindness makes us vulnerable. Our tendency to believe the best of people makes us vulnerable.

There's a litany of human psychological traits that make us easy prey for the most nefarious among us.

So yes to safeguards, yes to learning lessons. But the blame/shame thing here is, at best, not very constructive. And at worst, it's cruel.

Stop wagging your fingers and open your ears. Every community has voices that are marginalized and not listened to. Find the voices at your school. trust me they are there.

NP. Neither I nor any of the parents I know would be comfortable with our girls staying at an air BNB with a male coach and no female parent chaperones. For whatever reason, this was an extremely poor and reckless choice.

Also, it's clear the board with the exception of the dissenting parent, choose anticipated success of well-being.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was also shocked that the board took the letter the girls had written and handed it over to the coach. This is a HUGE no no when it comes to abuse allegations. Insane how easily some of them threw these girls under the bus and tried to blame them.

The Washington Post article states specifically that the board members involved apologized for this. According to the article, the board members involved mistakenly believed the letter was meant to be an on-the-record statement and not confidential.

That is far from "[throwing] these girls under the bus and [trying] to blame them."

To the contrary, Shipley was immediately suspended, according to the Post.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The board did not proactively contact the full alumni and offer counseling services. They were offered to the current team members and those who just graduated. The board had all of the email contact information for rowers for at least 3 years back and could have easily reached out to them and the parents, but chose not to do so.

Also when confronted with this information, the current board president indicated they could not comment on the allegations due to the ongoing investigation. However neither the MPD or US Attorney gave the team any instruction to avoid speaking to alumni and parents.

I get that many of the current board members were new and could claim ignorance of what happened in 2013 and 2018. The kids in 2018 knew the rumors about 2013 (way before they even started at Whitman). Kids talk, adults should listen.

Why did the athletes stay? As commented by others they loved the sport. There is no other sport where the outcome of the race is so dependent upon the people in the boat being in synch.

Many colleges don’t offer crew scholarships so while it may add to an applicant’s profile to have participated in HS, most students do not get any financial benefit on their college costs.

You may not get money in scholarships but it gives you entry into competitive colleges. Many Whitman parents can afford to pay full price. I get why the girls did not quit the team. HS girls are at a complicated age and they are driven to do things with their group even if it causes stress and unhappiness. Not easy to walk away especially if you are good and enjoy the sport. No blame on them. It is the adults who should have known better. The board was clearly toxic and the other crew parents were probably intimidated by the board and didn’t want to be on the outs with the coach. It is depressing. Not an easy situation to navigate by any means but sad that hardly any adult was willing to stick their neck out and call Shipley out. Sad that the former Whitman principal also turned a blind eye. He must have worked with Shipley for years

The girls don’t quit because of gaslighting. They are told to suck it up, they will “get more attention” if they work harder, that all coaches are hard, blah, blah, blah.

It’s total BS, but that is what the parents tell them.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The board did not proactively contact the full alumni and offer counseling services. They were offered to the current team members and those who just graduated. The board had all of the email contact information for rowers for at least 3 years back and could have easily reached out to them and the parents, but chose not to do so.

Also when confronted with this information, the current board president indicated they could not comment on the allegations due to the ongoing investigation. However neither the MPD or US Attorney gave the team any instruction to avoid speaking to alumni and parents.

I get that many of the current board members were new and could claim ignorance of what happened in 2013 and 2018. The kids in 2018 knew the rumors about 2013 (way before they even started at Whitman). Kids talk, adults should listen.

Why did the athletes stay? As commented by others they loved the sport. There is no other sport where the outcome of the race is so dependent upon the people in the boat being in synch.

Many colleges don’t offer crew scholarships so while it may add to an applicant’s profile to have participated in HS, most students do not get any financial benefit on their college costs.

You may not get money in scholarships but it gives you entry into competitive colleges. Many Whitman parents can afford to pay full price. I get why the girls did not quit the team. HS girls are at a complicated age and they are driven to do things with their group even if it causes stress and unhappiness. Not easy to walk away especially if you are good and enjoy the sport. No blame on them. It is the adults who should have known better. The board was clearly toxic and the other crew parents were probably intimidated by the board and didn’t want to be on the outs with the coach. It is depressing. Not an easy situation to navigate by any means but sad that hardly any adult was willing to stick their neck out and call Shipley out. Sad that the former Whitman principal also turned a blind eye. He must have worked with Shipley for years

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^one other point: the Whitman crew parent's defense of "we just couldn't imagine it" is like what Joe Paterno said in defending his continued support of Jerry Sandusky well after he knew about the allegations. That is, he just couldn't conceive as possible. And again: if you are a parent with oversight of children, *it is your job* to educate yourself and to force yourself to consider these kinds of scenarios. Mandated reporters don't get to say they just couldn't believe something could happen, so they ignored the signs. Ignorance is a poor defense.

I am the Whitman crew parent, and I think you are over-spinning what I said.
But I take your point.

Know that one is trying to get off the hook here.

Meantime, the board has offered free counseling services to current and former rowers (and maybe their families--I'm not positive about that).
The counseling is being paid for with donations.
Maybe you have suggestions for what else the team could do.

The board that provided protection for an abuser... do I have a suggestion? Yes! I have a suggestion, fire every.single.person.on.the.board.

Hire and investigator to find out what they knew and when.

Report the HR person who "cleared" the coach and find out what type of relationship they had with the board/coach.

Pay for a full investigation and hold everybody legally responsible for this shit show. Civilly and criminally

I wouldn't waste the money to hire an investigator was lets be real, no one is going to hold anyone accountable but the board and everyone involved or who had knowledge should be fired.