Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t get paying each week to be closer to God. Funny.

People pay for the community -- like dues to a club.

This, and the post quoted, are so uninformed. Let's leave aside the flashy Joel Osteen types -- they're charlatans, but the people who go there are as greedy as the preachers. They're told they'll get rich if they give, so they look at it as a down payment.

But if you regularly go to a church, giving is a form of worship. I'm grateful for everything the LORD gives me, and I give some back to Him. A church has to pay for the building, lights, heat/AC, all that. It has to pay salaries to pastors, most of whom live more simply and don't aspire to a lot of worldly goods. And they pay for programs the church uses for outreach to the public. They do charity, they share among their members (benevolence funds, etc.). I just don't understand the condescending antipathy toward giving to your church.

The PP says, "I don't get paying each week to be closer to God." Well, I don't get being so ungrateful to God for what you have that you can't recognize that the LORD might want to see how you use it. I actually feel closer to the LORD when I give -- because I feel gratitude and because it helps me to rely on Him for what I need and not hoard it for myself.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t get paying each week to be closer to God. Funny.

People pay for the community -- like dues to a club.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t get paying each week to be closer to God. Funny.

People pay for the community -- like dues to a club.

This, and the post quoted, are so uninformed. Let's leave aside the flashy Joel Osteen types -- they're charlatans, but the people who go there are as greedy as the preachers. They're told they'll get rich if they give, so they look at it as a down payment.

But if you regularly go to a church, giving is a form of worship. I'm grateful for everything the LORD gives me, and I give some back to Him. A church has to pay for the building, lights, heat/AC, all that. It has to pay salaries to pastors, most of whom live more simply and don't aspire to a lot of worldly goods. And they pay for programs the church uses for outreach to the public. They do charity, they share among their members (benevolence funds, etc.). I just don't understand the condescending antipathy toward giving to your church.

The PP says, "I don't get paying each week to be closer to God." Well, I don't get being so ungrateful to God for what you have that you can't recognize that the LORD might want to see how you use it. I actually feel closer to the LORD when I give -- because I feel gratitude and because it helps me to rely on Him for what I need and not hoard it for myself.

Don’t bother, these are people who believe that churches do more harm than good, of course they will think giving to them is a waste of money.

What is your point?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t get paying each week to be closer to God. Funny.

People pay for the community -- like dues to a club.

This, and the post quoted, are so uninformed. Let's leave aside the flashy Joel Osteen types -- they're charlatans, but the people who go there are as greedy as the preachers. They're told they'll get rich if they give, so they look at it as a down payment.

But if you regularly go to a church, giving is a form of worship. I'm grateful for everything the LORD gives me, and I give some back to Him. A church has to pay for the building, lights, heat/AC, all that. It has to pay salaries to pastors, most of whom live more simply and don't aspire to a lot of worldly goods. And they pay for programs the church uses for outreach to the public. They do charity, they share among their members (benevolence funds, etc.). I just don't understand the condescending antipathy toward giving to your church.

The PP says, "I don't get paying each week to be closer to God." Well, I don't get being so ungrateful to God for what you have that you can't recognize that the LORD might want to see how you use it. I actually feel closer to the LORD when I give -- because I feel gratitude and because it helps me to rely on Him for what I need and not hoard it for myself.

Don’t bother, these are people who believe that churches do more harm than good, of course they will think giving to them is a waste of money.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t get paying each week to be closer to God. Funny.

People pay for the community -- like dues to a club.

This, and the post quoted, are so uninformed. Let's leave aside the flashy Joel Osteen types -- they're charlatans, but the people who go there are as greedy as the preachers. They're told they'll get rich if they give, so they look at it as a down payment.

But if you regularly go to a church, giving is a form of worship. I'm grateful for everything the LORD gives me, and I give some back to Him. A church has to pay for the building, lights, heat/AC, all that. It has to pay salaries to pastors, most of whom live more simply and don't aspire to a lot of worldly goods. And they pay for programs the church uses for outreach to the public. They do charity, they share among their members (benevolence funds, etc.). I just don't understand the condescending antipathy toward giving to your church.

The PP says, "I don't get paying each week to be closer to God." Well, I don't get being so ungrateful to God for what you have that you can't recognize that the LORD might want to see how you use it. I actually feel closer to the LORD when I give -- because I feel gratitude and because it helps me to rely on Him for what I need and not hoard it for myself.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t get paying each week to be closer to God. Funny.

People pay for the community -- like dues to a club.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m with the poster who believes there was a fundamental element of dishonesty here. He did not just sing Christian songs to make a living. You don’t have to be a believer to sing catchy songs with words you don’t believe. But these types of artists go on Christian radio and go to churches and talk about faith and spirituality and what they do is considered a form of ministry. But he never had a spiritual practice- he didn’t want to go to church or read the Bible or pray. That’s absolutely fine. Then why did he choose this career and all that it entails? Was he active in promoting himself in churches... and lying about his relationship with God? He grew up in the church, he knew what he was signing up for. Why didn’t he get any mentorship or guidance about his spiritual life? I don’t understand any of this and I don’t know why he didn’t back out of his career FIRST when he realized he was having these issues. But I can’t judge his doubting his faith, that is something everyone goes through at one point, and we are all allowed to come to our own conclusions. I just wonder what he was going out and tell people during this entire period as someone who actually had a ministry.

How do you know that he "never had a spiritual practice"? Let's say that he got into this work because he had both musical talent and faith. Do you think he should have quit his job with his first doubts? If so, then perhaps people should cut off their church membership if they have doubts and not start back up until the doubts fade.

There would be a lot of bouncing in and out of church if that were the case.

Please read his post and come back when you know what’s going on.

I’m a dp who did read his entire relevant post, and I agree with the pp before you. He didn’t say that he never had a spiritual practice; quite the opposite.

Anonymous wrote:I don’t get paying each week to be closer to God. Funny.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People don't seem to realize that as recently as the year 2000, 86% of Americans self-identified as belonging to a judeo-christian faith (most recently it is 72%). MOST non-believers were born and raised in a religious household and spent a significant portion of their life indoctrinated into their parents' religion. It shouldn't be surprising that many non-believers result from a conversion as an adult. That's how it basically has to work.

Interesting choice of words. Would you say that kids raised atheist were similarly indoctrinated?

Do you believe in Leprechauns?

Were your kids "indoctrinated" in not believing in Leprechauns?

Do you think not collecting stamps is a hobby?

Do you see the difference?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People don't seem to realize that as recently as the year 2000, 86% of Americans self-identified as belonging to a judeo-christian faith (most recently it is 72%). MOST non-believers were born and raised in a religious household and spent a significant portion of their life indoctrinated into their parents' religion. It shouldn't be surprising that many non-believers result from a conversion as an adult. That's how it basically has to work.

Interesting choice of words. Would you say that kids raised atheist were similarly indoctrinated?

Anonymous wrote:Why are people so triggered by this? I was raised evangelical and so was my husband. We got married young and waited until marriage. We were both having doubts but we were too afraid to tell each other. One day he just looked at me and said I don’t believe it because of this, this and this and I was so relieved because I felt the same way. We stopped going to church and we don’t miss it. I could care less if people debate whether we ever were Christians. Once you stop believing, you don’t really care about the Christian mindset. Also, it is very easy to “perform” Christianity when you are raised with it and to say all the right things and pray the right prayers. Our parents would have a literal heart attack if we did what this man did so we go through the motions and never mention church. We are having a baby and would 100% raise her atheist but we would get such blow back from our parents so we haven’t decided yet what to do. I commend his bravery.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People don't seem to realize that as recently as the year 2000, 86% of Americans self-identified as belonging to a judeo-christian faith (most recently it is 72%). MOST non-believers were born and raised in a religious household and spent a significant portion of their life indoctrinated into their parents' religion. It shouldn't be surprising that many non-believers result from a conversion as an adult. That's how it basically has to work.

Interesting choice of words. Would you say that kids raised atheist were similarly indoctrinated?

Anonymous wrote:People don't seem to realize that as recently as the year 2000, 86% of Americans self-identified as belonging to a judeo-christian faith (most recently it is 72%). MOST non-believers were born and raised in a religious household and spent a significant portion of their life indoctrinated into their parents' religion. It shouldn't be surprising that many non-believers result from a conversion as an adult. That's how it basically has to work.

Anonymous wrote:Why are people so triggered by this? I was raised evangelical and so was my husband. We got married young and waited until marriage. We were both having doubts but we were too afraid to tell each other. One day he just looked at me and said I don’t believe it because of this, this and this and I was so relieved because I felt the same way. We stopped going to church and we don’t miss it. I could care less if people debate whether we ever were Christians. Once you stop believing, you don’t really care about the Christian mindset. Also, it is very easy to “perform” Christianity when you are raised with it and to say all the right things and pray the right prayers. Our parents would have a literal heart attack if we did what this man did so we go through the motions and never mention church. We are having a baby and would 100% raise her atheist but we would get such blow back from our parents so we haven’t decided yet what to do. I commend his bravery.