Why cannot you guys understand that it is ok to practice in sports and entertainment but not ok in academics?

This gives wrong message to the kids that Your admissions and May be even success depends on race, your skin color and your FARMS status.
Hard work is not given importance, where in fact it should be the persistence, motivation and hardwork that should be counted more but looks like this is not the case anymore.

Anonymous wrote:

A huge part of the point of all of this nonsense is for relatively workaday kids to leapfrog the bright underprivileged kids.

Translation: A huge part of the point of this is for hardworking kids to leapfrog the bright, white, UMC kids who aren't putting in any extra work on academics.

Really, you're speaking like it's a bad thing for kids to work hard and then perform better than the kids who are naturally brighter but didn't work as hard. How dare those kids work hard and perform better than they ought to perform based on inherent ability!

Anonymous wrote:Wow. Tiger Moms are roaring EARLY. 2nd grade? What a joke.

White racists never mocked on their little racists playing soccer at 2nd grade.

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Anonymous wrote:Here we go once again, let us all pretend that this is fair, and our kids are naturally brilliant.

+100 I bet there are kids out there that are naturally smarter in math than the kids who have been prepping/taking this math stuff for 6+ years

I don't think it would matter that much for TJ, though. Kids who are bright and well prepared might score well on lesser contests like CML or MOEMS. There's a limit to how well a kid who isn't naturally brilliant at math would do in something like Mathcounts or AMC 10. The people selecting for TJ know the difference between elite results at more elite contests, and high results in fairly generic, low-ceiling contests. CML is not helping anyone get into TJ. If you were to include CML results on a TJ application, they would roll their eyes and then look for Mathcounts or AMC results.

I also don't think there are any truly naturally brilliant in math kids who haven't been identified and aren't already competing in high level contests. Kids who are that far ahead in math and that brilliant are certainly taking AMCs before and during middle school. Many of them are also posting on AoPS, doing Alcumus problems, and generally teaching themselves math.

First, you seem like you know what you are talking about rare on here

Do you really think lower income, ELL, and yes stereotypically black and hispanic parents/kids know about all of this?

For me the whole TJ thing could probably be solved if you identify say 25-50 kids in the prior category that are brilliant in math but simply aren't identified/nurtured because they have no idea the things up above exist.

People are shockingly ignorant to how few opportunities and advantages exist for the bright underprivileged.

A huge part of the point of all of this nonsense is for relatively workaday kids to leapfrog the bright underprivileged kids.

Anonymous wrote:Never too early to start TJ prep.

The new course offerings at Curie also include potty training.

My DC is also in 2nd grade at Haycock Elementary and is Level II for both math and LA. I didn’t get any information about CML. Do you know the date CML will be given to 2nd graders? Thanks!

Anonymous wrote:Or online is always an option? Our kids do better with online curriculum in addition to their daily school schedule. We’ve also enrolled them in Beestar’s National Math Competition for the States. Works well for us!

I think online curriculum definitely has its benefits, and with the fast-paced world the kids are in now, it might not be that bad of an option. We've also enrolled in the math competition with Beestar - the kids really enjoyed it!

If you want a contest with minimal cheating, try mathleague.org. They run online contests every month.

Anonymous wrote:Or online is always an option? Our kids do better with online curriculum in addition to their daily school schedule. We’ve also enrolled them in Beestar’s National Math Competition for the States. Works well for us!

I’m with the online option too. The kids definitely have enjoyed learning from Beetar’s curriculum and have felt a lot more confident in themselves over the years. They’ve also been looking forward to Beestar’s National Math Competition which is completely online. The kids do a great job, I can figure out which levels to enroll them in, and they genuinely want to try in these competitions which is amazing. A lot of times it isn’t the fact of winning or losing and how many points are obtained but the attitude to want to try and enjoy something as intimidating as a competition. Beestar definitely does a great job in helping kids feel more comfortable and desire to try something new.

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I am PP above and I have never ever ever practiced math with my child. He is the 6 year old converting fractions to percentages and he just pictures math problems in his head and has been doing so for a couple of years. We are far from wealthy or privileged and this is the first time I am hearing about these math programs available to elementary school children. While the teachers comment on his aptitude, nothing has been done, to the point that DC is becoming lazy and disinterested in school. If I don’t advocate for him, I doubt anything will ever be done.

I'm the PP with the kid displaying math giftedness as a preschooler, and you're illustrating my point. You noticed at an early age that your son is much more advanced than he ought to be. You've also recognized that you're the one who will need to advocate for your son. Over the next year, I'm sure you'll do some research and find programs and contests to meet the needs of kids who are highly gifted in math, just like everyone else in the same position does. I wasn't born knowing about all of the math programs and contests. I sought them out when it became obvious to me that my kid was outside of the realm of normal and couldn't be well served even in AAP.

I would bet you most lower income and by extension URM parents would have no idea what to do

That's the issue. We as a society need to a better job of identifying all of these kids earlier. These are the kids that should be in AAP and by extension TJ

NOT the kids that are pushed into camps and training who while smart are not top 1-5% smart.

While this is true, do you realize that even with extra funding, there is no bandwidth at Title 1 schools? In my kid's class, over 60% were not yet reading by 2nd grade. CML in 2nd grade? Are you kidding me?

Yeah I know about things like this which again makes it even more important to identify the kids in these environments and get them out to a place where they can actually grow and thrive. Again this should be the purpose of AAP not a program for UMC whites and asians with moderately smart kids to get more special treatment

Once you have the proper application of AAP there will be more kids at TJ who are actually top 1-2% vs kids who are still smart but have benefited from being in AAP and studying for years beyond traditional math class at school.

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I am PP above and I have never ever ever practiced math with my child. He is the 6 year old converting fractions to percentages and he just pictures math problems in his head and has been doing so for a couple of years. We are far from wealthy or privileged and this is the first time I am hearing about these math programs available to elementary school children. While the teachers comment on his aptitude, nothing has been done, to the point that DC is becoming lazy and disinterested in school. If I don’t advocate for him, I doubt anything will ever be done.

I'm the PP with the kid displaying math giftedness as a preschooler, and you're illustrating my point. You noticed at an early age that your son is much more advanced than he ought to be. You've also recognized that you're the one who will need to advocate for your son. Over the next year, I'm sure you'll do some research and find programs and contests to meet the needs of kids who are highly gifted in math, just like everyone else in the same position does. I wasn't born knowing about all of the math programs and contests. I sought them out when it became obvious to me that my kid was outside of the realm of normal and couldn't be well served even in AAP.

I would bet you most lower income and by extension URM parents would have no idea what to do

That's the issue. We as a society need to a better job of identifying all of these kids earlier. These are the kids that should be in AAP and by extension TJ

NOT the kids that are pushed into camps and training who while smart are not top 1-5% smart.

While this is true, do you realize that even with extra funding, there is no bandwidth at Title 1 schools? In my kid's class, over 60% were not yet reading by 2nd grade. CML in 2nd grade? Are you kidding me?

Anonymous wrote:

You’d be surprised I think. We had a kid do all that, and we did not think to sign up for math contests until 7th grade. Never joined a math club or anything like that.

Now we clearly knew we had a gifted child (reading before 2) but not all parents think to push math. Many schools do not differentiate until 7th grade. Our kid just happened to be at one of those schools.

And we are UMC and highly educated. So it’s very easy to imagine underserved kids not getting a chance until high school.

My experience with coaching math teams is that naturally brilliant kids who have done nothing in elementary school and decide to join the Math Counts team in 7th pretty quickly out-perform the kids who have been prepping since forever but aren't as bright. Almost every middle school has a math counts team, and they will try to recruit kids in 7th grade Algebra/8th grade geometry for their teams, so the kids would know about the opportunity.

To give you a good analogy, I didn't think to have my kid start taking private music lessons or even playing an instrument at all until 4th grade. Other parents started their kids in preschool. Many of those kids practice an hour or more every day and are playing around a grade 6 after 6-ish years of lessons. My kid practices 30 minutes per day and is playing at grade 5 after 15 months of lessons. In another 6 months, he will have surpassed the kids who have been playing for much longer.

It might take a little time to catch up, but eventually talent > prepping.

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I also don't think there are any truly naturally brilliant in math kids who haven't been identified and aren't already competing in high level contests. Kids who are that far ahead in math and that brilliant are certainly taking AMCs before and during middle school. Many of them are also posting on AoPS, doing Alcumus problems, and generally teaching themselves math.

I could not disagree more with the above. You’ve only got kids with means and loads of tutoring competing in the high level contests in middle school. These are kids who have been either lucky enough to be in a school that recognizes and supports raw math talent, or, and more likely to be the case, these are the kids who have parents pushing them ahead in math and are aware of these math comps.

Also, the kids who had to over prepare to do well in math counts and AMC 8 and 10 are not the ones doing the best on later competitions where you can see true math talent.

I think we're defining "naturally brilliant" differently. Just like there are kids speaking in full, coherent paragraphs at 15 months and reading by 2-3 years, there are kids who intuitively grasp and can handle multi-digit multiplication, division with remainders, fractions (including all operations), and can solve quite a lot of word problems before starting K. There is a threshold of giftedness where you, the kid's teachers, and even random strangers are just going to notice.

You’d be surprised I think. We had a kid do all that, and we did not think to sign up for math contests until 7th grade. Never joined a math club or anything like that.

Now we clearly knew we had a gifted child (reading before 2) but not all parents think to push math. Many schools do not differentiate until 7th grade. Our kid just happened to be at one of those schools.

And we are UMC and highly educated. So it’s very easy to imagine underserved kids not getting a chance until high school.

Anonymous wrote:

I would bet you most lower income and by extension URM parents would have no idea what to do

That's the issue. We as a society need to a better job of identifying all of these kids earlier. These are the kids that should be in AAP and by extension TJ

NOT the kids that are pushed into camps and training who while smart are not top 1-5% smart.

Yep. I'm. huge fan of strengthening head start and Young Scholars programs. The people running those programs should then be specifically looking for kids who seem to learn things unusually quickly so the school can take steps to help gifted URMs and low income kids. Depending on the school, this might already be happening. Many AARTs will refer kids themselves if the kid belongs in AAP, but the parents are unlikely to understand how to refer.