Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys know there is a middle ground between passively watching a child hit an adult with a shoe and screaming at them and threatening/following through on violence, right?

PP absolutely but when you see that, your own rambunctious little one doesn’t seem so bad in comparison. So you let stuff go that you should not. My kid never did anything that extreme but I still fell into the “developmentally normal” trap instead of immediately correcting wild behavior. So while I may at first judge playground mom with 4 kids who corrects her kids for playing with swings the wrong way...she’s probably right or closer to it than me.
Developmentally normal still belongs on a short leash. Parents are only hearing “it’s normal.” We are not communicating how to shape and mold behavior.

OP back - so - maybe there IS a parenting shift taking place - it is not just me ranting here. Has the pendulum now swung so that people judge the mom for correcting the kid? To put it differently, if I see my kid acting poorly in gymnastics, and I go in and tell him to listen to the instructor or we are leaving, are people judging me for that?

Yes. Don't do that. That's the instructors job and it distracts your kid and all the other kids too, when you do that.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys know there is a middle ground between passively watching a child hit an adult with a shoe and screaming at them and threatening/following through on violence, right?

PP absolutely but when you see that, your own rambunctious little one doesn’t seem so bad in comparison. So you let stuff go that you should not. My kid never did anything that extreme but I still fell into the “developmentally normal” trap instead of immediately correcting wild behavior. So while I may at first judge playground mom with 4 kids who corrects her kids for playing with swings the wrong way...she’s probably right or closer to it than me.
Developmentally normal still belongs on a short leash. Parents are only hearing “it’s normal.” We are not communicating how to shape and mold behavior.

OP back - so - maybe there IS a parenting shift taking place - it is not just me ranting here. Has the pendulum now swung so that people judge the mom for correcting the kid? To put it differently, if I see my kid acting poorly in gymnastics, and I go in and tell him to listen to the instructor or we are leaving, are people judging me for that?

When I raise my voice to reprimand my DD in public, or scowl/show an angry face when I correct her, I definitely have noticed that people look at me judgmentally. I try to save a raised voice as a last resort but sometimes it's the only thing that gets DD's attention.

My almost 6 year old can definitely be bratty at times. It seems to be a ploy for attention if we're in a group setting and I'm talking to other parents. Unfortunately she is happy to receive negative attention, so scolding her doesn't deter similar conduct. I wouldn't laugh or just ignore it, but I am not sure why the OP and some of the PPS seem to assume parents have the power to completely prevent such behavior (vs. simply lamenting the lack of an appropriate response). My parents spanked me with a belt for the slightest infraction, yet I still misbehaved sometimes.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys know there is a middle ground between passively watching a child hit an adult with a shoe and screaming at them and threatening/following through on violence, right?

PP absolutely but when you see that, your own rambunctious little one doesn’t seem so bad in comparison. So you let stuff go that you should not. My kid never did anything that extreme but I still fell into the “developmentally normal” trap instead of immediately correcting wild behavior. So while I may at first judge playground mom with 4 kids who corrects her kids for playing with swings the wrong way...she’s probably right or closer to it than me.
Developmentally normal still belongs on a short leash. Parents are only hearing “it’s normal.” We are not communicating how to shape and mold behavior.

OP back - so - maybe there IS a parenting shift taking place - it is not just me ranting here. Has the pendulum now swung so that people judge the mom for correcting the kid? To put it differently, if I see my kid acting poorly in gymnastics, and I go in and tell him to listen to the instructor or we are leaving, are people judging me for that?

My kids were good. Now they’re a good 11 and 13.

Anonymous wrote:You guys know there is a middle ground between passively watching a child hit an adult with a shoe and screaming at them and threatening/following through on violence, right?

PP absolutely but when you see that, your own rambunctious little one doesn’t seem so bad in comparison. So you let stuff go that you should not. My kid never did anything that extreme but I still fell into the “developmentally normal” trap instead of immediately correcting wild behavior. So while I may at first judge playground mom with 4 kids who corrects her kids for playing with swings the wrong way...she’s probably right or closer to it than me.
Developmentally normal still belongs on a short leash. Parents are only hearing “it’s normal.” We are not communicating how to shape and mold behavior.

A few years back we were at my IL house for Thanksgiving. Two of our boys got in an argument that started turning physical (they were 5 and 8) we tried talking to them and it didn't work so we each picked up a boy and took them up to the room we were staying in. It took 45 mins for them to calm down and then sit before we could go back down and behave respectfully. This was hours before dinner and we did not hinder anyone else's plans by being MIA. When we got downstairs my MIL gave me a hard time because we made the boys "miss all of the fun". Then the patriarch of the family (older than MIL and usually very quiet) spoke up and said he was so proud of us for actually "parenting our boys". He then pointed out that MIL had used a wooden spoon on every single one of her kids. Since that is no longer allowed your son and DIL did what was needed to teach their boys a lesson.

It was so nice to have him stand up for us.

You guys know there is a middle ground between passively watching a child hit an adult with a shoe and screaming at them and threatening/following through on violence, right?

You (the parent) have to be willing to miss the event yourself. That's why people don't do anything about it. They don't want to be inconvenienced or interrupt their own good time.

With both my kids, when they were in the height of these kind of phases, we would drive separately to events or parties And if our kid was atrocious, we would leave. The kid will freak out and yes it will be mildly embarrassing for a minute and yes, you will have to leave wherever you are where you are quite likely enjoying some much needed adult conversation and go home with the shitty, screaming child. Which sucks.

But the kid will remember. And the next time you threaten, they will cut out whatever bullshit they are doing.

While I think it’s true that people have always complained about other people’s children, modern parenting culture is problematic. I’m all for not hitting children or screaming at them. But we haven’t taught parents what to do instead. Strong willed children require very active parenting to deal with. All we say to parents of those kids is not to hit them. We’re not giving them effective tools to shape the behavior of the non compliant child.

My kids are widely spaced and I definitely fell short in setting effective limits with my first. He has some mild special needs that make things harder, but I’m a lot better at shaping his behavior now. And I’m doing a much better job with my toddler this time around.

But yeah in a culture where both parents have to work to survive and there’s no parenting advice beyond avoiding corporal punishment? It’s not surprising that more kids are acting out.

Anonymous wrote:How lucky are we, to have the only good parents left on earth posting in this very thread?!

lol this.

Anonymous wrote:I hear you OP! Children of today are terrible. Not like our generation! Socrates has been saying this forever:

“The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room.”

Times are bad. Children don’t listen to their parents and everyone is writing a book.
Cicero
100BC

I feel sorry for the kids. On some level the kids feel the disapproval of other adults and strangers and that’s not their fault - it’s the parents fault.

And description like “active” or “spirited” are simply used as the excuse - as if those of us who have well-behaved, polite kids have dull slugs for kids.

How lucky are we, to have the only good parents left on earth posting in this very thread?!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op again. I don’t even think it’s generational. I’m 43 with a 5 year old and have peers the same age with same kids. One of their kids was walking around hitting people with his shoe while the dad (who is otherwise a lovely person) just laughed. Another person I know close in age to me was the one allowing her 7 year old to flip out about getting a game.

Believe me, your perfect angel does bratty stuff too

Of course he does- misbehaving is a hallmark of childhood. But I correct and call him out on it. My observation isn’t about “kids these days”. It’s the phenomenon that the parents seem to do nothing to reign them in. So for example if my child was hitting someone with a shoe i would say stop it now or we are leaving the party.

This is where I think there is a level of discipline that is failing. If my child was hitting someone with a shoe, I wouldn't say stop it now or we are leaving. We would leave. It should never get to the point where your child is already hitting people with shoes.