Anonymous
Post 10/14/2019 22:29     Subject: Re:Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I’m not Jewish, but if I were it would make me uncomfortable. I think some people just don’t realize how much they stereotype and think they are behaving perfectly normally

I get this a lot:
“Where are you from?”
-I’m Indian
“Oh really, you don’t look Indian. You’re very pretty.”

I never know what I’m supposed to say to that or how I’m expected to react.




WTF, you get this "a lot"?
FWIW I think Indian women are generally very pretty.


Ok, that is insulting! And different than saying someone “looks Jewish.”


+1, the insulting compliment!

... I get this a lot when more conservative/traditional people learn that I am gay "I would've never guessed, you don't act like other gays!" It's meant as a compliment towards the individual, but with zero awareness of how shitty it sounds to the person on the receiving end, who just hears "I generally hold people like you in low regard, but you're ok as a one-off"


Anonymous
Post 10/10/2019 18:37     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
Anonymous wrote:Ok to say if you are Jewish; we say it all the time in my family. Totally not ok if you are not Jewish.

Aren't you being elitist?
Anonymous
Post 10/10/2019 17:59     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
In reality, Jews are fairly indistinguishable from Italians, Greeks, Spaniards, Berbers, and Arabs and other Mediterranean/North African types, who like Jews, were not considered white until relatively recently.
Anonymous
Post 10/10/2019 15:27     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I HATE THIS.

I have two Jewish kids -- boy and girl twins -- with bright red hair and freckles and it hurts me that they are always told "you don't look Jewish". I don't mind that they DO look Irish (which is an ethnicity) but Judaism is a religion -- you cannot "look" Jewish, just like you cannot look Christian.


YES YOU CAN.

Are you really Jewish and you don't know this? Ashkenazi Jews are a distinct genetic group with physical similarities. While of course there are Jews who aren't Ashkenazi and those who converted, there is ABSOLUTELY an ethnic component to MANY Jews, given that Ashkenazi Jews are 10-11 million of the 16 million Jews in the world.
[b]
Judaism is considered an ethno-religious group for this reason.


I know this, too, and I'm not even Jewish.


+1
Anonymous
Post 10/10/2019 15:25     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I HATE THIS.

I have two Jewish kids -- boy and girl twins -- with bright red hair and freckles and it hurts me that they are always told "you don't look Jewish". I don't mind that they DO look Irish (which is an ethnicity) but Judaism is a religion -- you cannot "look" Jewish, just like you cannot look Christian.


YES YOU CAN.

Are you really Jewish and you don't know this? Ashkenazi Jews are a distinct genetic group with physical similarities. While of course there are Jews who aren't Ashkenazi and those who converted, there is ABSOLUTELY an ethnic component to MANY Jews, given that Ashkenazi Jews are 10-11 million of the 16 million Jews in the world.
[b]
Judaism is considered an ethno-religious group for this reason.


I know this, too, and I'm not even Jewish.
Anonymous
Post 10/10/2019 15:06     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
Anonymous wrote:I HATE THIS.

I have two Jewish kids -- boy and girl twins -- with bright red hair and freckles and it hurts me that they are always told "you don't look Jewish". I don't mind that they DO look Irish (which is an ethnicity) but Judaism is a religion -- you cannot "look" Jewish, just like you cannot look Christian.


YES YOU CAN.

Are you really Jewish and you don't know this? Ashkenazi Jews are a distinct genetic group with physical similarities. While of course there are Jews who aren't Ashkenazi and those who converted, there is ABSOLUTELY an ethnic component to MANY Jews, given that Ashkenazi Jews are 10-11 million of the 16 million Jews in the world.

Judaism is considered an ethno-religious group for this reason.
Anonymous
Post 10/10/2019 15:05     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
My sister says a lot that DH looks Jewish. She is Jewish and she definitely means it in a mean way to say that he is short with a big nose and a Jew 'fro, and not in a nice way to say that he is cute with a distinguished nose and great head of curly hair.
Anonymous
Post 10/10/2019 15:04     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
I HATE THIS.

I have two Jewish kids -- boy and girl twins -- with bright red hair and freckles and it hurts me that they are always told "you don't look Jewish". I don't mind that they DO look Irish (which is an ethnicity) but Judaism is a religion -- you cannot "look" Jewish, just like you cannot look Christian.
Anonymous
Post 10/10/2019 13:31     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
Ok to say if you are Jewish; we say it all the time in my family. Totally not ok if you are not Jewish.
Anonymous
Post 10/08/2019 17:10     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
I know someone, not Jewish, but looks Jewish
She finds it strange that a lot of Jewish guys flirt with her, try to get her number
Anonymous
Post 10/08/2019 14:04     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I am not Jewish. I am black. I say that to say I can't speak for exactly how a Jewish person would feel about the statement. I can only speak for how I feel when someone says something similar to me.

I would ask the speaker "What do you mean by that?" and see what comes next. My guess is that it won't be something good.

When I've encountered similar statements, it is usually meant to be derogatory. If your Jewish friend has confided in you that he/she finds it insulting, you should be the brave and bold white person who is willing to take a position that will bring you discomfort for the good of all. The weight of addressing discriminatory/hurtful statements always falls on the person being singled out and they are left having to navigate addressing the disrespect, their hurt feelings and self esteem and then having to defend against a typical white person who will rudely push back if they are called out on their bigoted behavior. It will be all about that person's feelings on being called a bigot instead of the person they actually offended.

Please, stand up for your Jewish friend and call the other person out on their unacceptable comments. Right now, you can hide and ignore the rude comments because they don't affect you. By the way, if you've ever wondered what white privilege is and if you have it, this is one of those situations.


I’m not sure white privilege really comes into the equation here — Ashkenazi Jews are white.


I'm an Ashkenazi Jew and let me tell you -- that's a whole other can of worms.

Before I explain, let me say up front that I KNOW THIS HAS BEEN USED BY NAZIS AND ANTI-SEMITES.

That disclaimer said: There are arguments to be made that Ashkenazi Jews are not, in fact, white if you define white as Caucasian or Anglo-Saxon.

Why? Well, we are Semites. We have a phenotype that is distinct from the of Anglo-Saxons.

Culturally and religiously, we have historically been--often violently--excluded from Anglo-Saxon European Christendom.

Now, I understand that many of us appear white--we often have light skin--but that doesn't mean we're really from the same ethnic, cultural, or religious group that anthropologists and sociologists normally consider part of being white.

Anonymous
Post 10/08/2019 13:48     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
Anonymous wrote:I am not Jewish. I am black. I say that to say I can't speak for exactly how a Jewish person would feel about the statement. I can only speak for how I feel when someone says something similar to me.

I would ask the speaker "What do you mean by that?" and see what comes next. My guess is that it won't be something good.

When I've encountered similar statements, it is usually meant to be derogatory. If your Jewish friend has confided in you that he/she finds it insulting, you should be the brave and bold white person who is willing to take a position that will bring you discomfort for the good of all. The weight of addressing discriminatory/hurtful statements always falls on the person being singled out and they are left having to navigate addressing the disrespect, their hurt feelings and self esteem and then having to defend against a typical white person who will rudely push back if they are called out on their bigoted behavior. It will be all about that person's feelings on being called a bigot instead of the person they actually offended.

Please, stand up for your Jewish friend and call the other person out on their unacceptable comments. Right now, you can hide and ignore the rude comments because they don't affect you. By the way, if you've ever wondered what white privilege is and if you have it, this is one of those situations.


I’m not sure white privilege really comes into the equation here — Ashkenazi Jews are white.
Anonymous
Post 10/08/2019 13:29     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We have a very outspoken friend in one of my friend groups. She has more than once said something like "he or she looks Jewish" if someone was asking for a description about someone I am not Jewish but another friend is and she confided in me that when x says this, she finds it kind of insulting because its the way she says it that implies its a very specific (and not so good) look. Is it worth saying something or is this in the politically correct bubble?


Yeah context matters as others have said. But she's not saying this about a guy wearing a yamulke and Talis on his way to shul. It's been used MULTIPLE TIMES, as a way to describe a random person.
Listen, I'm a proud Jew. But you CANNOT ignore the history behind this comment. When people say "looks Jewish," they are referencing a specific ashkenazi look, yes. HOWEVER please don't ignore that this was turned into a caricature and used in propoganda, not just by the Nazis but throughout history in a specifically derogatory manner, and in a manner that was used to perpetuate negative stereotypes, oppress/remove rights from Jews, and yes eventually mass slaughter them. So even if it's meant in a benign way, it is NOT ok and yes you should talk to her about it. It's unequivocally not ok, because even if she means no harm or thinks the person is pretty - this is what she's referencing - the caricature or stereotype.

If you want a little pop culture reference...look no further than Cabaret. It's one of the most shocking/off-putting moments in the show. When someone says "that's funny you don't look jewish," or "she looks Jewish" - THIS is what I hear.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEhHeILa3HE


Ashkenazi Jew here.

Yes, of course it's been used in propaganda and by the Nazis to help them identify Jews to kill.

That doesn't mean that:

1. No one can talk about what MANY Jews look like in a benign way.

2. There are no similarities in how many Jews look. I hate that response because it devalues our history as an ethno-religious group. So many of us are Ashkenazi or Sephardic and I don't like people devaluing our identity or history by saying "oh Jews are such a melting pot and they all look different!"

I'm proud to be part of a group that has strong historical, ethnic, and religious bonds.


you know what they say, two Jews, three opinions we're known to disagree. however, it may be prudent for people to maybe not throw this around as a frequent, casual descriptor, given that so many of us on this thread do find it offensive. Seems to be the way to go.

Yes, there can be a benign way to talk about it -but the example provided by OP sounds pretty ignorant and not ok by my standards.
Anonymous
Post 10/08/2019 13:26     Subject: Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
Anonymous wrote:Except the thing is MANY OF US DON'T look that different.

Not everything is this "oh it's just a huge melting pot" thing. Yes there's diversity in the Jewish population, but 10-11 million of the roughly 16 million Jews in the world are Ashkenazi. We have physical similarities. THAT'S NOT A BAD THING.

We have a strong history that binds us together. I'm not ashamed of looking Jewish. I'm not ashamed of looking at my family--and my people--and seeing physical similarities.

Us Ashkenazi Jews have such strong similarities that there is a genetic panel done during pregnancy called the Ashkenazi Jew panel.

We aren't Christians, who come from every country in the world. There are only 16 million of us, and we are clustered in a small number of countries.



Thank you!!! This is the sentiment that feels right to me. Jews ARE binded together. There is enormous pride in being Jewish. There are some physical similarities among Jews. It is never an insult to look Jewish. If someone hates Jews and makes a negative comment that is altogether a different story.
Anonymous
Post 10/08/2019 13:23     Subject: Re:Is the refernece "he/she looks very Jewish" benign or an insult?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I’m not Jewish, but if I were it would make me uncomfortable. I think some people just don’t realize how much they stereotype and think they are behaving perfectly normally

I get this a lot:
“Where are you from?”
-I’m Indian
“Oh really, you don’t look Indian. You’re very pretty.”

I never know what I’m supposed to say to that or how I’m expected to react.




WTF, you get this "a lot"?
FWIW I think Indian women are generally very pretty.


Ok, that is insulting! And different than saying someone “looks Jewish.”