Anonymous wrote:I have a few friends come out- what they had in common:

Lack of concern for appearance/no makeup/hair grooming, never skirts or dresses
Awkwardness
Always wanting -or not wanting to hug- again, awkwardness.
Being jealous/feeling competitive with my HS crushes or boyfriends
Always trying to get IN the same stall when I’m changing-I mean, it happens, but hauling ass or pounding on the door angry/crying every time to get in?
When they did date- dated guys who were (to me at the time) obviously in the closet

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone here with a gay daughter who WASN'T a tomboy, and was in fact rather feminine and had crushes on boys as a kid?

We were completely surprised when our DD said she was gay (at age 16). She had always really liked boys, had crushes and even had a couple of boyfriends. Always girly, wore lots of make up and dressed nicely. She went from having lots of friends to isolating herself and then came out to us. She has been in two relationships with girls her age. She is now 18 and her style has changed into very plain- basic t-shirts and shorts, little to no make up, hair in a low ponytail. It's been hard to see the changes- not because she's gay, but because she doesn't seem happy. She sees a therapist and recently started taking medication for anxiety. We are hoping that going to a liberal college this fall will be a good experience for her.

Anonymous wrote:Would you say that looking back on your daughter's childhood or teen years, before she came out, that there were indicators that she was gay that you may not have picked up on at the time?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DD is a lesbian. I’ve always suspected it. Even as a toddler she never really had friends who were boys. She was a princess all the way. She’s always been into fashion and looking perfect, and she definitely marches to her own drummer. The only two friends she had in elementary school who were boys were both very effeminate (they were bronies when she was obsessed with MLP, and would play dress up in her princess costumes instead of insisting on being a superhero or masculine character).

She’s very artistic and goes to art school. She’s the most sensitive, empathetic, kindest person I’ve ever met. She’s very pretty, and boys always flock to her at first, but she gives off a major uninterested vibe so by the third week of school she’s managed to surround herself with girls as a sort of buffer to the boys. Before she was out, whenever boys would ask her out, she’d match them up with a friend instead. I think it was for her 10th birthday party, when planning the guest list I asked if she wanted to invite any boys. She looked at me genuinely perplexed and said, why would I want to invite any boys?

She came out as pan first. I never like to second guess how anyone identifies, but I always thought she was trying to be inclusive or keep her options open so she could fit in if she needed. The only crushes she ever had on boys were a mystery crush in 7th grade and a crush on Shawn Mendez when Stitches was big. Now she identifies as a lesbian. No one was surprised when she came out. It just made sense.

She’s not a tomboy, not butch, loves dresses, lace, has long hair, her makeup is always perfect, keeps her nails long and perfectly manicured, and never played a sport aside from cheerleading. She’s basically a lipstick lesbian, but she really dislikes that term.

Do you think being artsy has something to do with it? It seems to me that outside of the sporty, tomboyish lesbians, the next big"camp" tends to be the artsy ones. They tend to be more feminine (although with an "alternative" aesthetic), and often don't totally identify as being lesbian.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We knew my neighbor was gay at age 3. He was in love with dresses and pretty things. He would play dress up with my daughters for hours. He has always loved anything artistic: drawing, painting, ballet, fashion.
By age 8 or so he started using very effeminate and dramatic mannerisms.
He's now a teenager and out.

I love this kid like my own--our kids grew up together. It's been fascinating to who he has become. He's a very interesting and cool kid.

What is the connection with being artistic and gay? I know that not all gay men are effeminate, but there does seem to be such a huge connection between homosexuality and creativity. This connection seems to exist among females as well. My friend's daughter is in art school, and she says there's not a single straight girl there. Granted many are pan and have boyfriends, but none of them are simply straight. I really do wonder what the connection is.

Some link in the brain chemistry?

No, there's nothing genetic or "brain chemistry" about it, not more than African American's success in music and entertainment is due to genetics or brain chemistry. It's just being more open to different forms of expression because you're outside of the mainstream to begin with. And also there's likely some confirmation bias going on as well.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We knew my brother was gay long before he came out. No, he was never your stereotypical gay boy who loved glitter. He was athletic and for the most part "straight acting." But living with him for all those years the little clues added up. I knew he was gay by the time he was 12 but my mother made it very clear we were not to talk about it until he was ready to talk about it. Which didn't happen for another nine years.

May I ask what these were?

Body language mainly. In those moments when natural instincts takes over, however briefly before self control kicks in, you see the mannerism, expressions, gestures. And other little things. He used to sneak and read Nancy Drews when he thought no one was looking. Always had a better appreciation for fashion than you might have thought even if he dressed typically for a boy of his age and background and I could always rely on him to give excellent fashion advice if I asked. Loved architecture and cooking and an appreciation for interior design. He was careful to try not seem too interested but one could still see it. And although athletic he shied away from contact sport. He was a runner, swimmer and tennis player. Gravitated towards female friends rather than male friends. You could see that he had to forcibly make himself to make male friends and he wasn't naturally at ease around other boys. Which is ironic as these days most of his friends are other men (gay of course) but childhood is a different time.

Many of the characteristics on their own don't say much, but it's when you piece all of them together that the picture emerges. I'm fully convinced there is a gay brain. As my brother says, most of his friends are "straight acting" and you wouldn't spot them as a gay man if passing them or even working alongside them, but if you put them together alone in a room, they change and it becomes much more apparent. Many gay men are very careful to control how they present themselves in public to avoid being seen as stereotypically gay.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I knew my son was gay when he was a toddler. By the time he was in preschool it was pretty clear to everyone. He’s a happily married surgeon now with two straight (we think) kids of his own.

What? How do you know your son is gay when he’s under 3 years old?

My friend has a son who I could tell clear as day was gay when he was 4. He was extremely into girly stuff. He's 14 now, and yep he's gay.

Anonymous wrote:Anyone here with a gay daughter who WASN'T a tomboy, and was in fact rather feminine and had crushes on boys as a kid?