Anonymous
07/22/2019 17:48
Subject: A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Part of it has been systematic disenfranchisement of African Americans. This recent Propublica/New Yorker article covers one example--black families passed down land to descendants, and the land is sometimes later taken from them by courts, developers, etc. I'm black (although 1st-gen American) and I had no idea stuff like this had occurred recently and is still ongoing.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019/07/22/kicked-off-the-land?utm_brand=tny&utm_source=facebook&utm_social-type=owned&mbid=social_facebook&utm_medium=social&fbclid=IwAR1O7GdqtpMZK7fjhGnTFgzNfrm3ShGBmRmydq0pG7c11bKpcTi0zsnNtDc
This is an interesting piece. But you should know seizing land and valuables happens in small towns too. Texas has a huge problem with this, and it’s not just against Blacks. I only skimmed the piece but it’s seems it’s a lack of education of how laws are in flux that results in land losing.
I’m Hispanic (2nd generation), I’m the pp poster with my family idea. I think Op that the ones that do this have drugs and nothing to lose. Most people are good if they aren’t on drugs. If they had a good family unit even poor, there would be something to turn to. Money does buy opportunities. But love care and togetherness is not bought with money. If they could turn to church, they could turn around. I don’t think they are past rehab. But it can’t be the government fixing this. Yes there’s millions of issues they can fix. But you can’t fix instrisic value with a law. Foster children have the same issue.
Yes, in fact love, care, and togetherness ARE bought with money, in part. I am the PP white mom with the challenging son. My money and privilege: got him an IEP; got him top-of-the line therapy; got a house zoned for a good school where they implement the IEP; got me a job with great health insurance for him; got me a house close to my work so I can spend more time at home with him; and probably most importantly -- not being in poverty greatly reduces my stress level, so I can be a good parent.
Ok this is ridiculous OP. So unless you get paid well you can’t love and care for your kids? Cook or clean at home? I’m Hispanic and my parents came here as immigrants and through their love and care a I succeeded. My mom worked as cafeteria lady, we were dirt poor. Their money did not afford me the best school, I went to a regular public school, middle school was horrible with gangs. I’m now a parent two two boys. One with autism. I dedicate time to him and he succeeds. I recognize that now I have an economic component that other kids don’t have. But it goes hand in hand. IEPs also don’t cost money, it’s a law that schools have to provide.
But As other black men said, they practice self care and do the best they can. Showing up and hard work gets you far, even when the stakes are against you. This is why immigrants come here. Granted I’m also aware blacks experience another level of racism Hispanics don’t.
OP’s examples of people who kill senselessly are not related to blacks. Any race can do that. The Hispanic man who shot that woman in San Francisco, etc. these are just people with no social network, no church, job, family (again not bought with money!), and emotional battered. Probably no role models either, mixed with the $ aspect. And drugs. It kills any sense of morality or care for humanity. OP do you think this from reading the news. The news is sensational.
Of course you can love and take care of your kids in poverty. But poverty adds stress, and reduces resources (by definition). When coupled with things like lead poisoning, bad schools, bad housing, lack of outdoor play space that already disadvantage these kids ... poverty makes it MUCH MUCH harder for parents to take care of kids and prevent behavioral issues. The parents don't actually love their kids any less -- that I am clear on -- but stress & poverty must make good parenting so much harder.
And IEPs don't cost money, are you joking? Do you know the number of hours & personal expertise & professional/personal capital I had to dedicate to get my child's IEP ... and the money it takes to enroll him in a school that will implement it well?
Anonymous
07/22/2019 17:41
Subject: A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Part of it has been systematic disenfranchisement of African Americans. This recent Propublica/New Yorker article covers one example--black families passed down land to descendants, and the land is sometimes later taken from them by courts, developers, etc. I'm black (although 1st-gen American) and I had no idea stuff like this had occurred recently and is still ongoing.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019/07/22/kicked-off-the-land?utm_brand=tny&utm_source=facebook&utm_social-type=owned&mbid=social_facebook&utm_medium=social&fbclid=IwAR1O7GdqtpMZK7fjhGnTFgzNfrm3ShGBmRmydq0pG7c11bKpcTi0zsnNtDc
This is an interesting piece. But you should know seizing land and valuables happens in small towns too. Texas has a huge problem with this, and it’s not just against Blacks. I only skimmed the piece but it’s seems it’s a lack of education of how laws are in flux that results in land losing.
I’m Hispanic (2nd generation), I’m the pp poster with my family idea. I think Op that the ones that do this have drugs and nothing to lose. Most people are good if they aren’t on drugs. If they had a good family unit even poor, there would be something to turn to. Money does buy opportunities. But love care and togetherness is not bought with money. If they could turn to church, they could turn around. I don’t think they are past rehab. But it can’t be the government fixing this. Yes there’s millions of issues they can fix. But you can’t fix instrisic value with a law. Foster children have the same issue.
Yes, in fact love, care, and togetherness ARE bought with money, in part. I am the PP white mom with the challenging son. My money and privilege: got him an IEP; got him top-of-the line therapy; got a house zoned for a good school where they implement the IEP; got me a job with great health insurance for him; got me a house close to my work so I can spend more time at home with him; and probably most importantly -- not being in poverty greatly reduces my stress level, so I can be a good parent.
Ok this is ridiculous OP. So unless you get paid well you can’t love and care for your kids? Cook or clean at home? I’m Hispanic and my parents came here as immigrants and through their love and care a I succeeded. My mom worked as cafeteria lady, we were dirt poor. Their money did not afford me the best school, I went to a regular public school, middle school was horrible with gangs. I’m now a parent two two boys. One with autism. I dedicate time to him and he succeeds. I recognize that now I have an economic component that other kids don’t have. But it goes hand in hand. IEPs also don’t cost money, it’s a law that schools have to provide.
But As other black men said, they practice self care and do the best they can. Showing up and hard work gets you far, even when the stakes are against you. This is why immigrants come here. Granted I’m also aware blacks experience another level of racism Hispanics don’t.
OP’s examples of people who kill senselessly are not related to blacks. Any race can do that. The Hispanic man who shot that woman in San Francisco, etc. these are just people with no social network, no church, job, family (again not bought with money!), and emotional battered. Probably no role models either, mixed with the $ aspect. And drugs. It kills any sense of morality or care for humanity. OP do you think this from reading the news. The news is sensational.
Anonymous
07/22/2019 17:35
Subject: A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
How about as a black person I’ll answer this question when you start a thread asking white people what they need to do or Vietnamese people what they need to do, or Russian people what they need to do this is some ignorant mess.
Anonymous
07/22/2019 17:34
Subject: A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
1- Not all black people live in the same community
2- Are you addressing African-Americans, Afro Caribbean Americans, African immigrants, Black folks from the Caribbean, which black people are you talking to because we don’t all have the same issues, live in the same place and are you really asking white people what black folks need to do to ‘ make us better’ you must be smoking the biggest crack rock in America.
2- Are you addressing African-Americans, Afro Caribbean Americans, African immigrants, Black folks from the Caribbean, which black people are you talking to because we don’t all have the same issues, live in the same place and are you really asking white people what black folks need to do to ‘ make us better’ you must be smoking the biggest crack rock in America.
Anonymous
07/22/2019 16:55
Subject: Re:A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
Anonymous wrote:Honestly, as a black person, I have just accepted that racism is a real thing and that there is a huge, huge effort by many white people to deny its existence. So, I see the truth in things.
I see it. I accept that it's not a fair playing field. I accept that professionally I will struggle and have struggled in ways my white coworkers simply never will. I accept the study that demonstrates big law partners rate the writing of black attorneys more harshly than white attorneys. I accept things will never really change because most white people are fine with the ways things are. I accept that many white people refuse to admit that the past 50-75 years in this country is a minimal amount of time compared to the hundreds of years of horror black people have suffered through. I accept that wealth is probably unequal due to discriminatory hiring, lending, housing that benefited white people's grand parents and parents. I accept it all.
Then I get up, send my children to the best school we could find, go to work and do good work, go home, work with my children and drive them to classes and sports and activities. I make healthy food. I meditate. I practice self-care. I do all of the things to thrive. And I keep the rest out of my mind. Because I know it's there and I know there is no strong incentive to change things (if anything there is an incentive to deny, ignore and deflect).
I can't give it any more power or influence in my life. I can't change it. I refuse to engage it. It's not my doing or responsibility. And the premise that black people or minorities should speak to racism, own racism, fix racism is a farce. This is a white people's problem that many of them have little interest in fixing.
I choose to thrive. I choose to live.
White person here. PP, you are absolutely right. My hope is that as more and more white people realize this, we will actually stop tolerating racism overt or systemic enough to change our culture.
Anonymous
07/22/2019 16:54
Subject: A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:NP here and I also find you suspect OP. I can easily think of half a dozen more appropriate forums to have an honest discussion if you’re not trolling. And no I’m not mentioning those other forums here.
I'm OP and I'm not sure I can speak to what you find suspect about my post. I did give some thought to where I posted it before deciding to open it here. As you know, people post all kinds of things under Off-Topic - it's a catch-all kind of forum - so I went with it. I just figured if Mr. Steele and his colleagues saw fit for it under another forum, they would move it.
But yes, I am a being real, here - this discussion is important to me and I'm doing my best to read/respond as quickly as I can. No trolling, I promise. Thank you.
The pp doesn't mean which forum on DCUM. The pp means, if you're really trying to effect change in the black community and want to know from people in the black community what the underlying problems are, there are other forums than DCUM that would be more effective. I'm willing to bet there isn't a huge number of black posters on DCUM. Getting opinions from a predominantly white forum isn't going to effect change. I agree with the pp.
Anonymous
07/22/2019 16:29
Subject: A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:NP here and I also find you suspect OP. I can easily think of half a dozen more appropriate forums to have an honest discussion if you’re not trolling. And no I’m not mentioning those other forums here.
I'm OP and I'm not sure I can speak to what you find suspect about my post. I did give some thought to where I posted it before deciding to open it here. As you know, people post all kinds of things under Off-Topic - it's a catch-all kind of forum - so I went with it. I just figured if Mr. Steele and his colleagues saw fit for it under another forum, they would move it.
But yes, I am a being real, here - this discussion is important to me and I'm doing my best to read/respond as quickly as I can. No trolling, I promise. Thank you.
Pp is suggesting a forum other than dcum. Dcum has some serious racists and trolls. I guess everywhere does, but this sort of topic doesn’t work very well in this particular, anonymous, space.
Anonymous
07/22/2019 16:22
Subject: Re:A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
I'm white but I was a teacher in SE and I agree with others who have said there is no epidemic of somehow irredeemable young black men. They're just young men. Kids are the same everywhere.
I agree that childhood stress and poor parenting (for a host of reasons) contribute to why more kids in some neighborhoods end up committing crimes (including whole swaths of white America, but different crimes with different consequences). When that combines with a microculture of young men AND WOMEN who
a) don't believe that there's a path to success for them in mainstream culture, because they've given up on school or been incarcerated and they can't envision themselves in a good job with a stable life in the future
b)buy into an alternate culture where they can achieve a sense of self worth even if it's based on crime/violence
c)feel desperation/hopelessness
d)become extremely geographically/culturally isolated
that's when you get violent crime problems that aren't directly related to economic incentives (e.g. muggings or profitable criminal enterprise (a lot of it isn't really profitable)).
I agree that childhood stress and poor parenting (for a host of reasons) contribute to why more kids in some neighborhoods end up committing crimes (including whole swaths of white America, but different crimes with different consequences). When that combines with a microculture of young men AND WOMEN who
a) don't believe that there's a path to success for them in mainstream culture, because they've given up on school or been incarcerated and they can't envision themselves in a good job with a stable life in the future
b)buy into an alternate culture where they can achieve a sense of self worth even if it's based on crime/violence
c)feel desperation/hopelessness
d)become extremely geographically/culturally isolated
that's when you get violent crime problems that aren't directly related to economic incentives (e.g. muggings or profitable criminal enterprise (a lot of it isn't really profitable)).
Anonymous
07/22/2019 16:16
Subject: A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
Anonymous wrote:Unless reparations are part of the discussion, there IS no discussion.
I'm black and get annoyed when this is brought up. It's never going to happen. Why spend your time obsessing about a pipe dream. Find real solutions!
Anonymous
07/22/2019 16:11
Subject: Re:A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
I have driven Lyft and Uber for the past several years in DC
The cause is very easy to find. There are too many black folks who don't know how to parent properly. Babies and kids are ignored, yelled at, cussed at, etc and experience all sorts of trauma from an early age which screws them up for life. This has nothing to do with racism it's failure to parent period.
I'll add once you get to the middle class these problems largely go away because people actually know how to raise children properly and there are plenty of poor white folks who can't parent either.
The cause is very easy to find. There are too many black folks who don't know how to parent properly. Babies and kids are ignored, yelled at, cussed at, etc and experience all sorts of trauma from an early age which screws them up for life. This has nothing to do with racism it's failure to parent period.
I'll add once you get to the middle class these problems largely go away because people actually know how to raise children properly and there are plenty of poor white folks who can't parent either.
Anonymous
07/22/2019 15:38
Subject: A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
After visiting the African American history museum and viewing years 1400 through now, it all makes sense. No one else answer what you think or give any stats. Just take the metro to DC and educate yourselves. Then give a thoughtful post.
Anonymous
07/22/2019 14:48
Subject: A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
Anonymous wrote:NP here and I also find you suspect OP. I can easily think of half a dozen more appropriate forums to have an honest discussion if you’re not trolling. And no I’m not mentioning those other forums here.
I'm OP and I'm not sure I can speak to what you find suspect about my post. I did give some thought to where I posted it before deciding to open it here. As you know, people post all kinds of things under Off-Topic - it's a catch-all kind of forum - so I went with it. I just figured if Mr. Steele and his colleagues saw fit for it under another forum, they would move it.
But yes, I am a being real, here - this discussion is important to me and I'm doing my best to read/respond as quickly as I can. No trolling, I promise. Thank you.
Anonymous
07/22/2019 14:40
Subject: A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
Yes, this is why we moved to the burbs.
Anonymous
07/22/2019 14:31
Subject: A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
NP here and I also find you suspect OP. I can easily think of half a dozen more appropriate forums to have an honest discussion if you’re not trolling. And no I’m not mentioning those other forums here.
Anonymous
07/22/2019 14:27
Subject: Re:A serious question for my fellow Black DCUMers
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Hard pass.
+1 this website has so many racist and prejudice people.
I’m not about to have normal black get together convo on here. I call troll
+1, I'm starting to think so too. Don't think most black people would bring this up on DCUM and title it "my fellow Black DCUMers" knowing how few of us there are on this site, and how racist the responses will be.
Black guy here.
I agree.
OP, the black delegation has chosen to vacate and remand your case back to the lower courts.
But the question remains; with grave consequences.
I guess the question will remain then.
If you wanna get your jollies off talking bad about black folks then go ahead and do it, but you won't be getting an all-exclusive invitation to do some from any black DCUM posters.
No.
Your GIFs game is on point. Props, for that. But I care a lot more about reading your thoughts on the issue.
Please don't get me wrong, I get it - the issue is not something we're proud of and it is difficult to discuss because it's hurting us in very personal ways. But we can control what we share in these dcum forums, so I didn't see harm in creating a space for us to share the thoughts we're willing/able to share. I believe there's value in that sharing - that's why I opened the thread. No jollies, but mature and thoughtful exchanges.