Anonymous
05/27/2019 13:14
Subject: Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
Anonymous wrote:What's the point of it? You pretty much have to assume that every kid has gotten some kind of help or advise on it, even if just from a parent. Why put so much weight on something that there is absolutely no way to tell, how much help was received?
OP, I totally understand your point. Just to build on your point, what is the point of list of courses taken, grades earned, SAT/ACT scores, and ECs. Kids get a boost in everyone of them from their parents, teachers, tutors/prepping, coaches, etc. What is the point in reference letters? They are never totally honest. So why not colleges sell a lottery ticket in the form of application fee and assign an ID number to each applicant and draw lottery to see who will get admitted to that college. All angst is solved. Every applicant has equal chance of getting admitted to each given college. Admission by lottery is a true level field for all applicants. No pretence of "holistic admissions", "promoting diversity", "offering best learning experience", or any other number of ways colleges try to justify their way of admissions decisions.
Anonymous
05/27/2019 07:58
Subject: Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
We have to recognize that the DCUM community is more savvy and privileged (that’s not the same as rich) than average.
MOST students aren’t getting help in the form of essay coaches. You may feel that way because it seems like everyone in this area is doing it, but this area is not normal.
MOST students aren’t getting help in the form of essay coaches. You may feel that way because it seems like everyone in this area is doing it, but this area is not normal.
Anonymous
05/26/2019 08:33
Subject: Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
Almost every aspect of the college admission process can be gamed:
1) Tutoring for the SAT's.
2) Tutors to get through the HS classes.
3) Counselors to help on the college essays.
The funny thing though is, while the colleges can not tell who does 1 or 2, they can absolutely tell the difference between the writing of a 17 yo and a 30 yo. My DD's essay, for example, is talking about figuring out who she is, partially from the HW assignment to write the college essay in her junior year. I only saw it when she submitted it.
She was 1450 SAT's, and 3.8 UW, 4.3 W. She was admitted to 2 Ivys (rejected at 3 other top schools), and all of the state schools. Interesting, she chose Virginia Tech over the higher rated schools because of cost and the feeling.
1) Tutoring for the SAT's.
2) Tutors to get through the HS classes.
3) Counselors to help on the college essays.
The funny thing though is, while the colleges can not tell who does 1 or 2, they can absolutely tell the difference between the writing of a 17 yo and a 30 yo. My DD's essay, for example, is talking about figuring out who she is, partially from the HW assignment to write the college essay in her junior year. I only saw it when she submitted it.
She was 1450 SAT's, and 3.8 UW, 4.3 W. She was admitted to 2 Ivys (rejected at 3 other top schools), and all of the state schools. Interesting, she chose Virginia Tech over the higher rated schools because of cost and the feeling.
Anonymous
05/26/2019 07:29
Subject: Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
I love when people who have never worked in admissions start sentences with "Colleges should..."
What follows is always so informed and spot on, and really helps the people in admissions who never thought of it.
What follows is always so informed and spot on, and really helps the people in admissions who never thought of it.
Anonymous
05/26/2019 05:58
Subject: Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
Anonymous wrote:The essay is a simple way to remove cheaters. It can be pretty obvious when someone else writes it.
Actually, it really isn't obvious. How would it be? They don't know the kid.
Anonymous
05/26/2019 05:37
Subject: Re:Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
SATs and ACTs are not fair because of the extra time issue.
Essays are not fair because adults write them.
GPA/Grades are not fair because of rampant grade inflation.
Teachers recs don't matter because many are cut and paste.
ECs don't matter because most of them are bogus.
What's left?
Amazing how jaded everyone is about whatever weakness their kid has.
Essays are not fair because adults write them.
GPA/Grades are not fair because of rampant grade inflation.
Teachers recs don't matter because many are cut and paste.
ECs don't matter because most of them are bogus.
What's left?
Amazing how jaded everyone is about whatever weakness their kid has.
Anonymous
05/26/2019 05:31
Subject: Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Who says they put a lot of weight on it?
Why not also toss out GPA (maybe they had a tutor) or SAT/ACT scores because they may have prepped?
Admissions departments aren't grading them the way a teacher would, they are looking to see what the student can reveal about him or herself or how they think.
If your essay was slapped together quickly, with or without help, it will show.
? You're aware of the Papa John's pizza essay that got the girl into Yale? It is often a tie-breaker at more selective schools.
In my son's school, the essay is weighted very heavily. They really want to know what makes the kid tick...look beyond the grades and test scores. Honestly, I wouldn't want my kid to attend a school that didn't care who he was. But that's just me.
Anonymous
05/26/2019 05:30
Subject: Re:Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Or, they could use technology to figure out the likelihood that it is the same person that wrote it. You would need something that wasn’t manipulated, like in theory SAT essay or original work the school submitted on behalf of the student.
The essay is important to get a sense of who someone is beyond the numbers, how they would contribute to the school community, and perhaps how much they know about your school and why they think it would be a good fit for them. It also the chance for the student to advocate for themselves.[/quote]
Yes, in theory the essay would be a good tool for getting a sense of this, but sense there is no way of knowing whether the ideas came from the student or someone else, why bother?
In my son's school, the essay is weighted very heavily. They really want to know what makes the kid tick...look beyond the grades and test scores. Honestly, I wouldn't want my kid to attend a school that didn't care who he was. But that's just me.
Anonymous
03/29/2019 23:28
Subject: Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
I think it is my essay that got me into grad school.
I think my son’s essay helped get him into college.
Both of us had some unique things to talk about that weren’t well handled any other way.
I think my son’s essay helped get him into college.
Both of us had some unique things to talk about that weren’t well handled any other way.
Anonymous
03/29/2019 22:22
Subject: Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
The essay is the only thing that holds back a student from applying to even more colleges. Without it, it becomes pretty much just pay an application fee and click a button for each college. For a wealthy family kid who does not care about paying the fees, he can do a ton in half day. Acceptance rate probably will immediately become 0.1% for elite schools.
When the results come down, the kid is just like "meh, who cares". He already forgot he ever applied to many of the schools.
When the results come down, the kid is just like "meh, who cares". He already forgot he ever applied to many of the schools.
Anonymous
03/29/2019 20:50
Subject: Re:Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
My kid applied to 12 colleges.
Besides the Common App essay, they wrote about 13 supplemental essays. The one they thought was the most challenging was also the shortest
"Please complete the following sentences, and have a little fun doing it.
I am empowered by people who...
I appreciate my community because ...
In the future, I hope to explore..."
Besides the Common App essay, they wrote about 13 supplemental essays. The one they thought was the most challenging was also the shortest
"Please complete the following sentences, and have a little fun doing it.
I am empowered by people who...
I appreciate my community because ...
In the future, I hope to explore..."
Anonymous
03/29/2019 20:10
Subject: Re:Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I would be glad for the essays to go. It is just a big exercise in projecting and parroting back what one thinks admissions wants to hear. It also bugs me that the woe-is-me-type-essay seems to do so well.
If that's what you think the essays are, then you are doing them wrong. I'm sure that what the admissions officers read is 99% (yes, I made that statistic up) this type of drivel and 1% authentic writing. The woe-is-me essay may bug you, but some kids have actually overcome serious obstacles. If those problems also appear in teacher and counselor recommendations then they are real. Not everyone is as privileged as you. Essays don't stand alone, they are part of the whole student package. Admission decisions are not made or broken based on one metric, but the essay can help a student stand out if it catches the admissions officer's eye.
I've attended my share of college information sessions and listened to admissions officers do their spiels. I distinctly remember one at an elite institution that was very well done. If you were paying attention, the officer had three layers to her story (the main points she wanted to share, the story she wrapped it in, and the humorous thread in the story). I have no doubt that if you picked up the humorous thread and wove it into your own essay, she would notice it and notice you.
Selective institutions could toss out the entire group they admitted and admit a different but equally talented group from the remaining students (MIT admin has said this.) A good essay just helps you end up in the first group.
And you should get into a college, all things equal, because you picked up an AO's joke?
Anonymous
03/29/2019 19:52
Subject: Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
The essay is a simple way to remove cheaters. It can be pretty obvious when someone else writes it.
Anonymous
03/29/2019 19:06
Subject: Re:Colleges should just get rid of the application essay
Anonymous wrote:I would be glad for the essays to go. It is just a big exercise in projecting and parroting back what one thinks admissions wants to hear. It also bugs me that the woe-is-me-type-essay seems to do so well.
If that's what you think the essays are, then you are doing them wrong. I'm sure that what the admissions officers read is 99% (yes, I made that statistic up) this type of drivel and 1% authentic writing. The woe-is-me essay may bug you, but some kids have actually overcome serious obstacles. If those problems also appear in teacher and counselor recommendations then they are real. Not everyone is as privileged as you. Essays don't stand alone, they are part of the whole student package. Admission decisions are not made or broken based on one metric, but the essay can help a student stand out if it catches the admissions officer's eye.
I've attended my share of college information sessions and listened to admissions officers do their spiels. I distinctly remember one at an elite institution that was very well done. If you were paying attention, the officer had three layers to her story (the main points she wanted to share, the story she wrapped it in, and the humorous thread in the story). I have no doubt that if you picked up the humorous thread and wove it into your own essay, she would notice it and notice you.
Selective institutions could toss out the entire group they admitted and admit a different but equally talented group from the remaining students (MIT admin has said this.) A good essay just helps you end up in the first group.