Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tons of vacation time and a good pension.

You do realize that during the summer months there's no paycheck, right? You have to be proactive about saving up to cover your expenses during those months or get a summer job.

yes we all know that. Your $40-80k salary is for 10 months + benefits.

Anonymous wrote:If they don't get the respect and income they think they deserve, why stay?

Same reasons lots of people don't quit:

Worried won't find another job
Need the income or benefits
Want the retiree benefits
Like the job, hate the people.
Like the people, hate the job/company.
Don't know what else to do.
Stuck in the area due to spouse's job.
Don't want different hours or commute.

These people who say teachers should just quit are the same ones who would be screeching about childcare if there was a walkout. Or whine about bigger classroom sizes.

Anonymous wrote:As someone whose nieces and nephews in Ashburn are on their third year of having a long term sub because LCPS couldn't fill a position...well, idiot, of course they do quit. That is why there is a critical shortage of teachers in this country.

What I find confounding is that for all of let the market drive things...teacher wages seem to be the one thing that is uncoupled from that concept.

The other fun thing -- as a LEO -- I get my salary and overtime. But I work in a profession that is primarily male. There is an inherent sexism in education that people refuse to actually address. My DH is a DCPS teacher and his day is way, way more dangerous than mine.

My neighbor's son in 3rd grade has a long term sub this year after having one all of last year in 2nd grade. It really blew my mind! Same letter was received this year... hopeful that a permanent teacher will be found... blah, blah, blah... Ms. ____ is an excellent teacher blah blah blah.

My other neighbor is a teacher at a school in Sterling and she told me that the librarian had to cover a classroom one day because no sub could be found.

Anonymous wrote:Tons of vacation time and a good pension.

You do realize that during the summer months there's no paycheck, right? You have to be proactive about saving up to cover your expenses during those months or get a summer job.

As someone whose nieces and nephews in Ashburn are on their third year of having a long term sub because LCPS couldn't fill a position...well, idiot, of course they do quit. That is why there is a critical shortage of teachers in this country.

What I find confounding is that for all of let the market drive things...teacher wages seem to be the one thing that is uncoupled from that concept.

The other fun thing -- as a LEO -- I get my salary and overtime. But I work in a profession that is primarily male. There is an inherent sexism in education that people refuse to actually address. My DH is a DCPS teacher and his day is way, way more dangerous than mine.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Teachers have the same frustration as so many in the middle class. Wage stagnation, demands for more productivity, pensions being attacked, increasing health insurance costs. I'm in that rut but I only get three weeks of vacation a year, not 12-15.

It's not vacation. It's an unpaid furlough. Teachers have a contract that states how many days per year that they are required to work.

This must be such a shock and surprise to teachers. If only they had known this before they went to college for teaching!

I'm pointing out that the "vacation" days are unpaid. Some people think that teachers get lots of paid vacation time.

NP here and unless I'm misunderstanding something this seems like a meaningless distinction. You have an annual salary that is paid over the course of the school year and, apparently, not paid during the summer. Why does that matter? The salary is still the salary and you're getting some portion of the summer off.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:summers off.
good pensions- retiring at 55 vs working corporate and retiring at 67.

many of my mom friends stick with it to have the same time off as their kids (no childcare needed) and retire early

YES! The majority of us retire and head off to our corporate jobs! Damn! Our secret is out!

Really? I will be 55 but my pension is nowhere enough to survive on. Most career teachers who are the breadwinners in their family need to stay until 65 in order to be able to pay their bills with pension and Social security.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:they do, in droves.

+1 There are teacher shortages across the country

And we need more good teachers, so people need to encourage more smarter people to get into education, not turn them off.

Anonymous wrote:60K for working 9 months is the same as 80K for 12 months. Not bad. And it only takes a 4 year degree and maybe a certification.

If they want to teach in a public school, they need to be certified on in the process of being certified. Many district require a Master's degree within a certain number of years after being hired. Every teacher I know has at least one Master's degree. Many have more than one because you need 6 graduate credits every 5 years to be recertified.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:summers off.
good pensions- retiring at 55 vs working corporate and retiring at 67.

many of my mom friends stick with it to have the same time off as their kids (no childcare needed) and retire early

YES! The majority of us retire and head off to our corporate jobs! Damn! Our secret is out!

Why would a glorified baby sitter, with one of the easiest BA/MAs there is, who held a job where it was extremely difficult to be fired from be highly sought in corporate recruiting?

Anonymous wrote:
A nation that ceases to invest in its citizens, its teachers, its children, will remain stagnant, on a downward path, intellectually, socially, etc. A nation of ignoramuses provides fertile soil for the emergence of tyrants and tyrannical structures. Not to invest in teachers in this nation -- whether at the private or public level -- is a grave mistake, one that has begun to impact civic engagement, basic numeracy and literacy proficiency levels, critical thinking and creativity, and the fundamental sense of citizenry and signers to this social contract of DEMOCRACY.

So, please as the discussion continues, try not to focus on symptoms of the problem of education in the United States, be courageous and delve deeper, challenge the status quo that deprives so many of our nation's children and their educators a world-class education and fair, healthy working conditions, respectively.

This. The argument that teachers get what they deserve because they should have known the pay sucks and they'll be treated horribly ignores the fact that it is in all of our best interests to have a well-educated citizenry, and that we all benefit when our neighbor's and fellow countrymen and women do well.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If they don't get the respect and income they think they deserve, why stay?

Thousands quit every year. Some between the last day of school and the start of a new year. Some in the middle of the year. A few in the middle of class.

Those who stay almost always are those who love kids and understand the children are not the problem. Even in a tough school, the children aren’t the root cause of the chaos. And sometimes, for the toughest kids, a particular teacher is the lifeline. Leaving means being just one more person who gave up on them. So the teachers stay, work a couple side jobs, get stress-related illnesses, and keep teaching. At least, that’s what my mom did. Her last year, she taught a sixth grader whose grandmother she had a student.

PP, I agree with most of your post, but will have to disagree with your premise that those who "leave" do not care about the children. If you are a teacher, and have a family to support, and are being subjected to many of the challenges faced in schools WITH LOW PAY and VERY LITTLE SUPPORT, and can find better elsewhere for your health, your family's health and wellbeing, you will do that. Your mother, my mother were both teachers. I know why my mother kept teaching : She of course loved her students, but did not like everything else about the job. She stayed for the family health care coverage, for holidays and summers with her children, for a guaranteed retirement check...for the stability it provides working mothers or working parents. If the United States had universal health care coverage and a national pension/retirement system that applied to all forms of work, perhaps she would have taken the chance to find greener pastures/opportunities elsewhere.

Anonymous wrote:summers off.
good pensions- retiring at 55 vs working corporate and retiring at 67.

many of my mom friends stick with it to have the same time off as their kids (no childcare needed) and retire early

YES! The majority of us retire and head off to our corporate jobs! Damn! Our secret is out!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Teachers have the same frustration as so many in the middle class. Wage stagnation, demands for more productivity, pensions being attacked, increasing health insurance costs. I'm in that rut but I only get three weeks of vacation a year, not 12-15.

It's not vacation. It's an unpaid furlough. Teachers have a contract that states how many days per year that they are required to work.

This must be such a shock and surprise to teachers. If only they had known this before they went to college for teaching!

The only way to successfully fight back is to hit where it hurts. So while the job is tough, the work is never-ending and the pay is crap, I am home WITH my children.

b/c you never get that time back . . .

And it's worth the sacrifice to know my kids are safe and nurtured.

sorry that many of you have no empathy or compassion for those of us who look after YOUR kids all day long