Could fcps make Lee the esol magnet for the entire county? That would make more sense and be less disruptive than making it the only IB school for that area.

It's ironic that cutting funding for ESOL/FARMS, which was supported by people in low ESOL/FARMS school basically created this mess. So, if they had kept the Marshall adult ed ESOL site, none of this would have been necessary.

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Anonymous wrote:The issue is that Lee is an ESOL CSS site for new comers (they did this when they cut ESOL funding and got rid of night schools), particularly those who are older (18-20). Under the VGLA standards, they were exempt from state testing but had to put together a portfolio of learning to show competency. The state did away with this, and based on projections, Lee's performance will tank. Compared to Mount Vernon, the SOL performance wasn't impacted as much by the loss of VGLA and Stuart's ESOL population is actually falling since some older new comers are choosing to go to Lee for services. These schools' ESOL students do not qualify for VGLA in large numbers so their SOL performance is static or minimally impacted.

This is definitely something that is being considered. And what has been the most interesting is that initial projections show that it's definitely possible to execute. There is political drama, though.

I have two issues with this:

1) Why should the schools be punished for being burdened with the older ESOL population (18-20)?

2) What do you mean by saying some of the older newcomers are choosing to go to Lee? I hope you are not saying they get a choice. They should go to the nearest program. I'm going to assume they are just choosing to live in Springfield.

It seems as though the special program that was assigned to Lee may be the problem. What about the ESOL students of typical age?Are they not performing well?

Perhaps the special ESOL program should be moved elsewhere.

Legally, public schools are supposed to offer education past age 18. I think most states cap it at 20 or 21 (otherwise, you'd be kicking out 18 year old seniors, fwiw).

I don't know if these students are getting to go to Lee while living out of zone or whether it became more popular because people in the community learned about it and moved to Springfield (which honestly has more affordable housing than other areas). I don't know if it's a chicken or egg.

The ESOL program was required because the county gutted ESOL funding. This is basically the only way to show it was providing newcomer services/services to low level ESOL students to older learners. From an admin standpoint, I think Lee got it because it had space and was under enrolled and had a lot of students in this bucket. If the county didn't do this, it would be forced to spend millions in litigation (see Prince William County, which went from having one non-compliant ESOL school to having over 50). It's the cheapest choice to be compliant since they got rid of the Marshall learning site/night school.

Anonymous wrote:The issue is that Lee is an ESOL CSS site for new comers (they did this when they cut ESOL funding and got rid of night schools), particularly those who are older (18-20). Under the VGLA standards, they were exempt from state testing but had to put together a portfolio of learning to show competency. The state did away with this, and based on projections, Lee's performance will tank. Compared to Mount Vernon, the SOL performance wasn't impacted as much by the loss of VGLA and Stuart's ESOL population is actually falling since some older new comers are choosing to go to Lee for services. These schools' ESOL students do not qualify for VGLA in large numbers so their SOL performance is static or minimally impacted.

This is definitely something that is being considered. And what has been the most interesting is that initial projections show that it's definitely possible to execute. There is political drama, though.

I have two issues with this:

1) Why should the schools be punished for being burdened with the older ESOL population (18-20)?

2) What do you mean by saying some of the older newcomers are choosing to go to Lee? I hope you are not saying they get a choice. They should go to the nearest program. I'm going to assume they are just choosing to live in Springfield.

It seems as though the special program that was assigned to Lee may be the problem. What about the ESOL students of typical age?Are they not performing well?

Perhaps the special ESOL program should be moved elsewhere.

The issue is that Lee is an ESOL CSS site for new comers (they did this when they cut ESOL funding and got rid of night schools), particularly those who are older (18-20). Under the VGLA standards, they were exempt from state testing but had to put together a portfolio of learning to show competency. The state did away with this, and based on projections, Lee's performance will tank. Compared to Mount Vernon, the SOL performance wasn't impacted as much by the loss of VGLA and Stuart's ESOL population is actually falling since some older new comers are choosing to go to Lee for services. These schools' ESOL students do not qualify for VGLA in large numbers so their SOL performance is static or minimally impacted.

This is definitely something that is being considered. And what has been the most interesting is that initial projections show that it's definitely possible to execute. There is political drama, though.

The fcps school profiles show that Lee's IB scores are pretty strong, better than Robinson or Marshall for the most recently provided data. If you're looking at the IB program, it would appear to be strong. I'm not sure if there's a place to get more detailed IB data, such as percent receiving an IB diploma or a range of all scores.

Anonymous wrote:I am friends with someone who works in the Gatehouse. Yes, this IB center idea is a thing, but it's one of many avenues they are looking at for Lee. The state got rid of VGLA for SOL testing, which will tank Lee's scores and probably have the school run into accreditation issues with VADOE. Based on projections, Lee could run into accreditation issues in less than five years. So, combined with the IB MYP rollout, they are considering turning it into a "new" school and doing to big redistricting, which apparently would impact South County, Hayfield, West Springfield, Edison, Annandale, and Lake Braddock.

One interesting blind item. The schools have different school board members. One is definitely for the program and is pushing it along. One isn't.

I also remember the original Gatehouse poster saying Lee could quickly run up against accreditation issues and that the school board didn’t want to touch that with a 10 foot pole so they would close Lee rather than have a high school accreditation denied. Question though, would accreditation problems also affect some of the other lower performing HS’s? What’s the status with Mount Vernon and Stuart these days?

The Board of Supervisors, who provide funding to the School Board, need to put some pressure on school board members to resolve petty turf battles for the good of the school system as a whole.

They could also revert to the previous system of appointed rather than elected school board members.

I am friends with someone who works in the Gatehouse. Yes, this IB center idea is a thing, but it's one of many avenues they are looking at for Lee. The state got rid of VGLA for SOL testing, which will tank Lee's scores and probably have the school run into accreditation issues with VADOE. Based on projections, Lee could run into accreditation issues in less than five years. So, combined with the IB MYP rollout, they are considering turning it into a "new" school and doing to big redistricting, which apparently would impact South County, Hayfield, West Springfield, Edison, Annandale, and Lake Braddock.

One interesting blind item. The schools have different school board members. One is definitely for the program and is pushing it along. One isn't.

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Anonymous wrote:Honestly, I would be more concerned about whether your kid would even attend Lee. There is talk of closing the school and re-branding it as the regional IB center for a bunch of schools, fwiw.

No, they're not going to do that.

What I think they are considering is whether to turn Lee into an IB only school and turn Key into an IB MYP site exclusively.

I think it would result in shuffling feeders from West Springfield, South County, Hayfield, Lake Braddock (I think?), Annandale, and Edison, IIRC. Students at all of these schools could attend the proposed IB site with the thought that the loss of students to the new IB site would be off-set through boundary adjustments, redistricting, etc.

I don't know how probable this is, fwiw. But it's something to keep in mind around that part of the county.

That's not going to happen. OP doesn't need to think about that at all.

I thought I read that they were looking into this around here recently. I don't know if I would be so certain, PP.

Someone zoned for Lee keeps posting this idea as her pipe dream of what she believes should happen. Each time she posts this idea the shuffling becomes more complicated, with rezoning around a dozen elementary schools and having some elementary schools that high schools sit in the middle of jumping over other elementaries to make her numbers work.

Fcps is not going to rezone over 10,000 elementary students in one fell swoop based off the hopes of a dcumer.

Wasn't it someone who worked in the Gatehouse who posted this theory? I thought they were claiming that FCPS was looking into this as a solution if Lee goes under state DOE oversight because of failing test scores.

That’s what I remembered too. I don’t think the original post was a pipe dream, but all the speculation of “oh these elementary schools can go here and these schools can go there” certainly is.

You couldn’t implement any proposal to turn Lee into a true IB magnet without some big changes in feeder patterns. It’s really only the West Springfield posters who get all worked up about that idea.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, I would be more concerned about whether your kid would even attend Lee. There is talk of closing the school and re-branding it as the regional IB center for a bunch of schools, fwiw.

No, they're not going to do that.

What I think they are considering is whether to turn Lee into an IB only school and turn Key into an IB MYP site exclusively.

I think it would result in shuffling feeders from West Springfield, South County, Hayfield, Lake Braddock (I think?), Annandale, and Edison, IIRC. Students at all of these schools could attend the proposed IB site with the thought that the loss of students to the new IB site would be off-set through boundary adjustments, redistricting, etc.

I don't know how probable this is, fwiw. But it's something to keep in mind around that part of the county.

That's not going to happen. OP doesn't need to think about that at all.

I thought I read that they were looking into this around here recently. I don't know if I would be so certain, PP.

Someone zoned for Lee keeps posting this idea as her pipe dream of what she believes should happen. Each time she posts this idea the shuffling becomes more complicated, with rezoning around a dozen elementary schools and having some elementary schools that high schools sit in the middle of jumping over other elementaries to make her numbers work.

Fcps is not going to rezone over 10,000 elementary students in one fell swoop based off the hopes of a dcumer.

Wasn't it someone who worked in the Gatehouse who posted this theory? I thought they were claiming that FCPS was looking into this as a solution if Lee goes under state DOE oversight because of failing test scores.

That’s what I remembered too. I don’t think the original post was a pipe dream, but all the speculation of “oh these elementary schools can go here and these schools can go there” certainly is.

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Anonymous wrote:I agree with the PP who stated that Saratoga and Key both have good teachers. I don’t have any experience with Lee yet, but I’m sure it does, too. The schools have challenges to educate a very diverse student body, but my children are doing well in the pyramid. I’m not sure they would do any better elsewhere. I’m also glad my children aren’t dealing with the “jetting to Europe for Spring Break is normal” crowd.

Travel to places other than Springfield Mall is probably good for kids.

This is so ignorant. My students travel a lot. They visit family all over the world, in addition to beach trips and vacations to usual places.

You can’t have it both ways. Either these kids travel to other places like students in other pyramids, or they don’t.

DP. There's a middle ground between vacationing at the Springfield Mall or Europe. Many people prefer that middle ground, not just parents of kids at Lee. If you prefer that your kids go to school with other kids who vacation in Europe, that's fine. Others have different preferences.

I do prefer that my kids go to school with kids who've seen other parts of the world besides the mall and Nags Head.

And, if they vacationed in Europe, they probably did take a big jet and went when they weren't in school. Would you rather they take a Turboprop while school was still in session?

Np- Most of us want middle ground. We don’t want to hear kids talking about where they “summer”, or complaining about the snow in Sundance this year.

As a general matter, kids in FCPS don't use "summer" as a verb. Are you deciding between Lee and Andover?

Some do go on ski trips with their families. We never did, but I can't imagine holding that against anyone.

No you’re just concerned about the mall and Nags Head. Don’t worry I’m sure you have struck the perfect balance and have made the best choices. You have managed to claim the middle road AND look down at children of lesser means. We congratulate you,

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Anonymous wrote:I agree with the PP who stated that Saratoga and Key both have good teachers. I don’t have any experience with Lee yet, but I’m sure it does, too. The schools have challenges to educate a very diverse student body, but my children are doing well in the pyramid. I’m not sure they would do any better elsewhere. I’m also glad my children aren’t dealing with the “jetting to Europe for Spring Break is normal” crowd.

Travel to places other than Springfield Mall is probably good for kids.

This is so ignorant. My students travel a lot. They visit family all over the world, in addition to beach trips and vacations to usual places.

You can’t have it both ways. Either these kids travel to other places like students in other pyramids, or they don’t.

DP. There's a middle ground between vacationing at the Springfield Mall or Europe. Many people prefer that middle ground, not just parents of kids at Lee. If you prefer that your kids go to school with other kids who vacation in Europe, that's fine. Others have different preferences.

I do prefer that my kids go to school with kids who've seen other parts of the world besides the mall and Nags Head.

And, if they vacationed in Europe, they probably did take a big jet and went when they weren't in school. Would you rather they take a Turboprop while school was still in session?

Np- Most of us want middle ground. We don’t want to hear kids talking about where they “summer”, or complaining about the snow in Sundance this year.

As a general matter, kids in FCPS don't use "summer" as a verb. Are you deciding between Lee and Andover?

Some do go on ski trips with their families. We never did, but I can't imagine holding that against anyone.

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Anonymous wrote:I agree with the PP who stated that Saratoga and Key both have good teachers. I don’t have any experience with Lee yet, but I’m sure it does, too. The schools have challenges to educate a very diverse student body, but my children are doing well in the pyramid. I’m not sure they would do any better elsewhere. I’m also glad my children aren’t dealing with the “jetting to Europe for Spring Break is normal” crowd.

Travel to places other than Springfield Mall is probably good for kids.

This is so ignorant. My students travel a lot. They visit family all over the world, in addition to beach trips and vacations to usual places.

You can’t have it both ways. Either these kids travel to other places like students in other pyramids, or they don’t.

DP. There's a middle ground between vacationing at the Springfield Mall or Europe. Many people prefer that middle ground, not just parents of kids at Lee. If you prefer that your kids go to school with other kids who vacation in Europe, that's fine. Others have different preferences.

I do prefer that my kids go to school with kids who've seen other parts of the world besides the mall and Nags Head.

And, if they vacationed in Europe, they probably did take a big jet and went when they weren't in school. Would you rather they take a Turboprop while school was still in session?

Np- Most of us want middle ground. We don’t want to hear kids talking about where they “summer”, or complaining about the snow in Sundance this year.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with the PP who stated that Saratoga and Key both have good teachers. I don’t have any experience with Lee yet, but I’m sure it does, too. The schools have challenges to educate a very diverse student body, but my children are doing well in the pyramid. I’m not sure they would do any better elsewhere. I’m also glad my children aren’t dealing with the “jetting to Europe for Spring Break is normal” crowd.

Travel to places other than Springfield Mall is probably good for kids.

This is so ignorant. My students travel a lot. They visit family all over the world, in addition to beach trips and vacations to usual places.

You can’t have it both ways. Either these kids travel to other places like students in other pyramids, or they don’t.

DP. There's a middle ground between vacationing at the Springfield Mall or Europe. Many people prefer that middle ground, not just parents of kids at Lee. If you prefer that your kids go to school with other kids who vacation in Europe, that's fine. Others have different preferences.

I do prefer that my kids go to school with kids who've seen other parts of the world besides the mall and Nags Head.

And, if they vacationed in Europe, they probably did take a big jet and went when they weren't in school. Would you rather they take a Turboprop while school was still in session?