It IS awful. The whole testing thing has been awful for a long time. But how many of you complaining here will say one thing to your school or your school board or anyone in government? I'll bet not one. Where is the Virginia opt out movement? There isn't one. As long as parents let these things continue, they will only get worse. It's your fault.

Anonymous wrote:

They've been excused for years! Finally we are upping the standard. You cannot allow children to float through the system as they have in years past.

So, are you one of those people who think parents should not read to their kids in order to "even the field"? Sounds like it.

Hell no! My kids all started school reading. I supplement at home, do fun (educational) stuff all the time. I'm not for "evening any playing field." Not sure how you got that impression. I think parents need to be more involved, for sure.

Teachers do not have a problem with being held accountable. At least good ones don’t.
The problem with holding teachers accountable for the result of the SOL tests is that it is a single test (per subject) on a single day. And, unless this accountability takes into account student growth, in terms of learning, it presents a huge disparity for teachers who teach in at-risk schools vs those that teach in higher income areas. Most students in the higher income areas are going to learn DESPITE who their teacher is. Their parents have the resources to hire tutors, send kids to after school academic camps or summer camps, or have someone at home (themselves or a nanny) who reads to the student and makes sure homework gets done. So, great pass rates make the teacher look good.
Students from at-risk schools generally do not have these advantages. This is not an excuse - these kids can and do still learn, but it is often BECAUSE of the great teaching. Their scores are not always as high as those students who are from higher income areas, but believe me, they learn. They may not pass, but they learn.
So, accountability must include the GROWTH a student makes during the year and not just the final score.

Well said. I'm another retired teacher and this is spot on. I have taught the very, very poorest and I have also taught in a well mixed socio economic group. I never taught in an affluent school.
Teaching in the very poor school was the hardest work I have ever done. Of course, the kids can learn--but getting them to grade level when they start three grades behind is not easy. I taught first grade in the days before universal K. When a child has never held a book, it takes a lot of work to teach them to read, much less read on grade level. Sadly, there are more behavior issues, too. Truancy and parental support are another problem.
Standards are not going to fix this. Testing certainly is not.

The teachers I worked with were some of the hardest working people you could find--and they cared. No test will show that.

Speaking as a former (retired) teacher.....

Teachers do not have a problem with being held accountable. At least good ones don’t.
The problem with holding teachers accountable for the result of the SOL tests is that it is a single test (per subject) on a single day. And, unless this accountability takes into account student growth, in terms of learning, it presents a huge disparity for teachers who teach in at-risk schools vs those that teach in higher income areas. Most students in the higher income areas are going to learn DESPITE who their teacher is. Their parents have the resources to hire tutors, send kids to after school academic camps or summer camps, or have someone at home (themselves or a nanny) who reads to the student and makes sure homework gets done. So, great pass rates make the teacher look good.
Students from at-risk schools generally do not have these advantages. This is not an excuse - these kids can and do still learn, but it is often BECAUSE of the great teaching. Their scores are not always as high as those students who are from higher income areas, but believe me, they learn. They may not pass, but they learn.
So, accountability must include the GROWTH a student makes during the year and not just the final score.

They've been excused for years! Finally we are upping the standard. You cannot allow children to float through the system as they have in years past.

So, are you one of those people who think parents should not read to their kids in order to "even the field"? Sounds like it.

In theory, yes. In reality, very few.

Source, please.

Anonymous wrote:

Teachers should have to show sample lesson plans and for each learning style, thereby proving that they understand how children, in this case, learn. FCPS should have specialists that do this for each grade and subject. I don't know if they do.

Shouldn't teachers have learned how to do this in order to become certified in the state of Virginia? Why should we now have to hire other people (specialists) to do this? Isn't it cheaper to hire qualified people?

In theory, yes. In reality, very few.

Anonymous wrote:

ProSOL poster here. I need to clarify...when I say review tests, I don't mean SOLs. I am referring to general tests. The teachers NEVER review any tests with the kids. IE a test on fractions. The teacher only hands back the tests, s/he NEVER reviews the answers, so the kids don't LEARN from their mistakes.

You like to generalize, don't you? This is just not true.

Ok. 80% of teachers.

They've been excused for years! Finally we are upping the standard. You cannot allow children to float through the system as they have in years past.

Maybe they aren't anti-accountability, just anti-accountability based on tests where the kids' lack of success could be due to environment, LD, undiagnosed LD or test anxiety as you mentioned (and not due to teacher failure).

Exactly. I'd like to see one place where the teacher gets excused from accountability because the environment was bad. Or, the kid didn't come to school, or had test anxiety.

ProSOL poster here. I need to clarify...when I say review tests, I don't mean SOLs. I am referring to general tests. The teachers NEVER review any tests with the kids. IE a test on fractions. The teacher only hands back the tests, s/he NEVER reviews the answers, so the kids don't LEARN from their mistakes.

You like to generalize, don't you? This is just not true.

It highlights kids who didn't get due to: environment, teacher, LD, undiagnosed LD, or test anxiety. Or a combination of all. Why are folks so anti-accountability? I don't get it.

Maybe they aren't anti-accountability, just anti-accountability based on tests where the kids' lack of success could be due to environment, LD, undiagnosed LD or test anxiety as you mentioned (and not due to teacher failure).

Today it is very much a full-time job with benefits. Like most FT jobs, working 8 hours/day is a thing of yesteryear, raises are no guarantee, and accountability is taken seriously. It's just teachers that are held accountable, all professional are today.


The only problem is that teachers are "professionals," most with master's degrees, that make less than personal trainers, dental hygienists, flight attendants, and plumbers, few of whom routinely work more than 8 hours a day, I'm guessing.

Apparently the tests will help to keep the quality high even though the teachers aren't paid as professionals (and many of them apparently have not been trained well).