Anonymous
09/29/2014 16:59
Subject: Re:Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:If there is a payback requirement, one day of work won't satisfy it. Tell them now and expect some bridges to be burnt.
They can't make you "pay back" maternity leave. As for burning bridges, explain your reasoning and be professional and friendly and you won't burn any. But in different circumstances, a law firm wouldn't think twice about burning you if were in their interest. Plenty of lawyers have been laid off (RIFed) after returning from a maternity leave. (Only really dumb firms lay off staff while they are on leave, but it's been known to happen.)
Of course they can, especially if it's a stated policy. But I doubt they would. Being "friendly" really isn't going to compensate for being dishonest.
Anonymous
09/29/2014 16:58
Subject: Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
Anonymous wrote:PP, exactly. I find it nuts considering I know plenty of people who are RIF'ed after maternity leave. (Putting aside people who are just sacked as a matter of course).
I find the whole question of ethics to be a side show. You are at-will. And you are not working for anyone else. If I had publicly announced my federal clerkship back in 09, you better believe I would have spent ten months unemployed. Watch out for yourself, give notice and move on. Your supporters will be supportive because you are a potential lead at the very least.
The whole tell them now stuff is nonsense.
Really, nonsensical to not tell your current employer that you've accepted a new job. A little different from a clerkship that starts in a year. But you seem lacking in judgment.
Anonymous
09/29/2014 15:06
Subject: Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
PP, exactly. I find it nuts considering I know plenty of people who are RIF'ed after maternity leave. (Putting aside people who are just sacked as a matter of course).
I find the whole question of ethics to be a side show. You are at-will. And you are not working for anyone else. If I had publicly announced my federal clerkship back in 09, you better believe I would have spent ten months unemployed. Watch out for yourself, give notice and move on. Your supporters will be supportive because you are a potential lead at the very least.
The whole tell them now stuff is nonsense.
I find the whole question of ethics to be a side show. You are at-will. And you are not working for anyone else. If I had publicly announced my federal clerkship back in 09, you better believe I would have spent ten months unemployed. Watch out for yourself, give notice and move on. Your supporters will be supportive because you are a potential lead at the very least.
The whole tell them now stuff is nonsense.
Anonymous
09/29/2014 14:53
Subject: Re:Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
Anonymous wrote:If there is a payback requirement, one day of work won't satisfy it. Tell them now and expect some bridges to be burnt.
They can't make you "pay back" maternity leave. As for burning bridges, explain your reasoning and be professional and friendly and you won't burn any. But in different circumstances, a law firm wouldn't think twice about burning you if were in their interest. Plenty of lawyers have been laid off (RIFed) after returning from a maternity leave. (Only really dumb firms lay off staff while they are on leave, but it's been known to happen.)
Anonymous
09/29/2014 14:47
Subject: Re:Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
As a BigLaw partner who has taken 2 maternity leaves, I think it's entirely unethical for OP to accept another job while continuing to be paid for the duration of her maternity leave. I have no problem with you quitting and think it's highly unlikely your firm would try to recoup any of your prior paid leave if you are up front about it, but keeping the new job secret from your current employer while continuing to collect maternity pay is completely wrong and I think the firm would have a basis to go after you if you intentionally conceal it from them.
It's incredible to me that there are so many people out there, including OP, who even have to debate this question. As others have said, it's people like you that make the rest of us look bad. You should come clean, OP.
It's incredible to me that there are so many people out there, including OP, who even have to debate this question. As others have said, it's people like you that make the rest of us look bad. You should come clean, OP.
Anonymous
09/29/2014 12:15
Subject: Re:Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
OP, here is your question at its essence: I recently accepted a new job. I know that means I should give notice at my old job but I don't want to because I will probably give up a few weeks of paid maternity leave since I will no longer be employed by my old employer. I also know that my old employer will be unhappy that I withheld that information and will probably damage my reputation with my former co-workers and make it harder for my old colleagues who are pregnant or soon to be pregnant, but I don't care as long as I get what I want.
Better hope there is no cause for new employer to contact old over the next 5 weeks.
Better hope there is no cause for new employer to contact old over the next 5 weeks.
Anonymous
09/29/2014 12:07
Subject: Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
A PP here. OP, it may also depend on whether you have a substantive specialty or not. On one hand, you may be so established in that area that your reputation will carry you. On the other hand, those subject matter bars can be small and you would not want to burn breidges if possible.
GL
GL
Anonymous
09/29/2014 12:01
Subject: Re:Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
Anonymous wrote:That's not true. Under the DC and VA bar rules, there is no ethical requirement regarding giving notice. There's a requirement about ensuring client transitions are taken care of and whether a client is left hanging in the breeze without counsel but in terms of ethical obligations...unless there's a direct conflict (and going in house rarely poses one), you are fine. Particularly since you are on leave.
I am the woman who left to go in house during leave. I looked into this extensively. Finish up your leave.e Go back and give notice during which time make sure your clients are transitioned, etc. You can't just quit and never come back but there is no need to tell them sooner.
Your narrow definition of ethics isn't shared by most.
Anonymous
09/29/2014 11:59
Subject: Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
Anonymous wrote:Well, OP. You can have it either way. Cower in fear over what people think or just build a network and move on.
And to the poster above, the reference point makes sense to me. If you can pull references together to get a new job, then you'll be fine and really don't need to bother about "burning bridges." Who knows how long that PP was at that firm or whether he had worked elsewhere and build a decent network there.
That said, don't pull punches. Put in your two weeks and move on, respectfully but firmly. That's what I would do (and I'm still in biglaw as a partner).
Until the next job and people want references from his prior firm, or someone who knows of how he departed becomes his new supervisor, or would be a the next place, and so on.
Anonymous
09/29/2014 11:53
Subject: Re:Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
That's not true. Under the DC and VA bar rules, there is no ethical requirement regarding giving notice. There's a requirement about ensuring client transitions are taken care of and whether a client is left hanging in the breeze without counsel but in terms of ethical obligations...unless there's a direct conflict (and going in house rarely poses one), you are fine. Particularly since you are on leave.
I am the woman who left to go in house during leave. I looked into this extensively. Finish up your leave.e Go back and give notice during which time make sure your clients are transitioned, etc. You can't just quit and never come back but there is no need to tell them sooner.
I am the woman who left to go in house during leave. I looked into this extensively. Finish up your leave.e Go back and give notice during which time make sure your clients are transitioned, etc. You can't just quit and never come back but there is no need to tell them sooner.
Anonymous
09/29/2014 11:52
Subject: Re:Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
Anonymous wrote:Maternity leave is a benefit you earned. Ignore the harpies. They wouldn't dare come after a man who was off due to a stroke who decided they didn't want to come back. There is no legal difference between the two situations.
I guess if that is the way you look at it. Problem is that, in this town, law is a relationship business and, sometime in the future, OP may want to go back to a firm or need the folks at the firm to speak on her behalf.
I think people are telling OP that she needs to be careful and handle the situation delicately because it could burn bridges and damage her reputation.
Anonymous
09/29/2014 11:45
Subject: Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Arg. Why do so many women do this? We fight and fight for reasonable maternity benefits, and then women like OP decide to take advantage and screw us all by cashing in when they have no intention of going back to work.
Don't be that person, OP. Give notice. Pay back whatever you obviously owe because you went on leave under false pretenses. Think about someone besides yourself.
OP here. Didn't go on maternity leave on false pretenses. I didn't expect to actually get a job offer - especially in this economy/industry. I fully figured I would be going back to work at the firm. The job offer presented itself mid-maternity leave and I couldn't pass it up and now I am seeking advice from you guys on how to handle it.
Ethically, I think you need to give notice as soon as you have accepted an offer with another employer. So, tell your firm now.
This is correct, no other option is ethical.
Anonymous
09/29/2014 11:44
Subject: Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
Well, OP. You can have it either way. Cower in fear over what people think or just build a network and move on.
And to the poster above, the reference point makes sense to me. If you can pull references together to get a new job, then you'll be fine and really don't need to bother about "burning bridges." Who knows how long that PP was at that firm or whether he had worked elsewhere and build a decent network there.
That said, don't pull punches. Put in your two weeks and move on, respectfully but firmly. That's what I would do (and I'm still in biglaw as a partner).
And to the poster above, the reference point makes sense to me. If you can pull references together to get a new job, then you'll be fine and really don't need to bother about "burning bridges." Who knows how long that PP was at that firm or whether he had worked elsewhere and build a decent network there.
That said, don't pull punches. Put in your two weeks and move on, respectfully but firmly. That's what I would do (and I'm still in biglaw as a partner).
Anonymous
09/29/2014 11:40
Subject: Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
Anonymous wrote:Previous PP. My reputation is fine. I've got great connections (and wouldn't have been able to get through the reference checks, etc.). I have a pretty great network and honestly could land someone somewhere else if needed.
The biglaw world is transient and quite honestly isn't that small. This isn't the US Attorney's office or DOJ. People's memories run short. And truthfully, if they weren't on board to support you -- giving or not giving notice isn't going to make a difference. That person isn't going to help you and you are best served moving on.
One thing I think needs to be driven home is that if someone is going to "black list" you for taking an accrued benefit and quitting (when honestly you are going to be screwed anyway -- we all know about those extra years added to partnership consideration "per maternity leave."). It's not a contest. There's no bridge to burn because there's no bridge in the first place.
If always the people who have a bad reputation who think reputations don't count, people have short memories, people wouldn't hold that against me etc. . . . I would have thought the reference check was complete before you told your firm you were leaving so really that proves nothing. Though I would not have been surprised if there was a "good riddance" feeling on the part of your former firm.
Anonymous
09/29/2014 11:34
Subject: Quitting law firm to go in house immediately after maternity leave
Previous PP. My reputation is fine. I've got great connections (and wouldn't have been able to get through the reference checks, etc.). I have a pretty great network and honestly could land someone somewhere else if needed.
The biglaw world is transient and quite honestly isn't that small. This isn't the US Attorney's office or DOJ. People's memories run short. And truthfully, if they weren't on board to support you -- giving or not giving notice isn't going to make a difference. That person isn't going to help you and you are best served moving on.
One thing I think needs to be driven home is that if someone is going to "black list" you for taking an accrued benefit and quitting (when honestly you are going to be screwed anyway -- we all know about those extra years added to partnership consideration "per maternity leave."). It's not a contest. There's no bridge to burn because there's no bridge in the first place.
The biglaw world is transient and quite honestly isn't that small. This isn't the US Attorney's office or DOJ. People's memories run short. And truthfully, if they weren't on board to support you -- giving or not giving notice isn't going to make a difference. That person isn't going to help you and you are best served moving on.
One thing I think needs to be driven home is that if someone is going to "black list" you for taking an accrued benefit and quitting (when honestly you are going to be screwed anyway -- we all know about those extra years added to partnership consideration "per maternity leave."). It's not a contest. There's no bridge to burn because there's no bridge in the first place.